When parents are slagging off the local comp...

[Everyoneafter3]

I've posted before about my concerns over the local secondary, which, thanks to comments on this board and an excellent recent Ofsted, are very much allayed. I had a very good read of school newsletters etc and am much happier. Dd1 (Y4) is musically gifted and will also audition for a specialist music school.

The area in which we live is very affluent: many children round here go to fee-paying independent schools. These dc are going to school and telling my dd (and others) that the local secondary is rubbish ("my mum and dad say..."). One particularly stupid parent has said at home that "no child of mind will set foot in x school" which of course is coming back home with our dd.

Dd1 has now got it into her head that the local school is terrible, that she's really upset to go to not a good school, that she wishes we weren't poor (we're not! But no, we can't afford independent school fees without having to sacrifice other stuff we prioritise as a family). She's been researching exam results and all sorts.

For our part we've said well look at any local school she'd like to, although as we live across the road from the school in question it'd be unlikely that she'd get in.

I'm heartily sick of parents telling their dc how awful the local school is. It's simply not fair. My dc won't receive a 'lesser' education. They aren't going to a 'rubbish' school. If this continues I'm tempted to speak to their current primary school tbh. What else can I do? I've told dd to not listen, we've looked at the school website, talked about results (!) but I'm at a loss.

[SafeToCross]

My dd got told lots of gory stories about people having their face punched in at lunchtime however as I work with all the local schools I have a much better overview than them, I just wouldn't share it. I agree OP, it is terribly unhelpful of the parents.

[DriftingDreamer]

I am trying to calm my hackles in order to confuse those who have made a different choice to me. Those who told their children, who shared with my ds that he would only ever be average if he went to school he is at.
I am not good at 'calm' but I am trying....

[Myrobalanna]

People are shitheads who can't keep their opinions to themselves.
That said, schools objectively vary in outcomes.
We left one area because the lines were drawn in primary school already and we didn't want to take the chance. But people should keep their traps shut in front of the kids

[Floggingmolly]

Was Year 4 a typo? Year 4 school kids do not spend all their time slagging off the secondary school choices of their peers . Not by the class load, anyway...

[RaspberryIce]

They might do if their parents are saying it.

[sashh]

You could speculate about how bad the local independent is, considering the intake. Unlikely to be many children with SEN or ESOL.

Wonder how any parent can consider a school where the teachers do not have to be qualified (OK that's changing).

You could then talk about how some children NEED smaller classes and more attention because they are not that bright and wouldn't do well in a comp.

All the evidence (read it once in the torygraph) is that if you child is going to be in private education for only part of their education it is better to send then there for primary.

OhTheRoses

So which school was best for each child?

[hoddtastic]

minifingerz, are you saying if you vote labour you can't send your kids to any private school for any reason? Or have private healthcare or whatever?

I am a labour member, living in a grammar area- I will do what is best for my children, I wouldn't expect anyone to try and score cheap political points based on that. (You'll note I haven't said what I plan to do with my children)

[Floggingmolly]

What are the chances of all the parents getting het up about Year 7 when the kids are still in Year 4, Raspberry? All of them, simultaneously?
Year 6; very possibly.

[Nowdecide]

It's awful. People seem to need their choices validated but I confess, we are thinking about not sending dc to local popular m/c choice but I'm worrying about it. No-one - not one single person I know opted for school we did and now I'm getting cold feet. What if they know something I don't?

I suspect it's all about class and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy when the m/c parents don't send their kids there so the next year the same happens cos there aren't enough m/c kids there and so.

We too have had snide comments from children who I assume are echoing what they'be heard at home.

Baffling. In what way do our choices undermine those of others? It's like breast/bottle, working/stay at home 'debate' (bear-bait) all over again.

There is no 'right' answer and your solution doesn't get any more or less valid because I make a different choice.

I've hated this whole school thing. I'll be glad when it's over.

[RaspberryIce]

Op hasn't said ALL of the class are doing it.

[Cyrpusinsummer]

You could speculate about how bad the local independent is, considering the intake. Unlikely to be many children with SEN or ESOL.

This is simply not true, my dd has SN and has been in the state sector, now in the private sector for the past five years. There are many, many dc in mainstream private schools with SN as contrary to popular opinion they are often not looked after better in the state sector.

I really hope that the thread continues without bashing a particular type of school.

[DriftingDreamer]

Nowdecide... What if you know something they don't! Smile enigmatically and confuse them...

On a serious note, you are right about self fulfilling prophecy. However, try to see you and your child as trail blazers. I am trying that approach in my head.

Also, get involved in school if you can. Show willing as an engaged parent. I find that school ds at very willing to talk, reassure and involve...

[Nowdecide]

Ha! I wish! It's a nice thought. I'll work on my inner sphinx.

I also agree with your 'get involved' advice. I will. Engaged parent and all that. Thank you.

I will ignore the near-constant gnawing parental anxiety. That's just being a parent isn't it?!

[DriftingDreamer]

Well hope anxiety universal....
Do try enigmatic. Quite fun!!

[Everyoneafter3]

It's not all classes but it's most of dd's friends. This might not be the case in other schools but I can assure you all it is at ours.

Round here the secondaries have specific Y5 open evenings. Those parents with older children know this which is why we have Y4 children getting het up.

[Sadik]

I wouldn't dismiss the OP's experience of yr 4 children having opinions on local schools. Here it happened in yr 5 because that's when parents start thinking about secondary (only two realistic choices, both state, essentially guaranteed a place at either).

But my experience with friends in cities is that they do start thinking about secondaries earlier, especially if you're talking about selective private schools where parents may consider tutoring for exams.
And I can absolutely see parents who are needing to motivate little Tom, Dick or Harriet to work hard with a tutor doing this by running down the non-selective state options.

We chose the less MC favoured option because dd preferred it and we agreed it would suit her better - she got a lot of "Only disabled / thick kids go to school X" - but using much less pleasant language. We talked it through with dd - yes, there are more disabled children at school X, because it is totally accessible, has a support unit, lifts etc. She was quite able to understand that this is a good thing, not a bad thing (!) and that it's great to go to a school that will help you if you are having problems. Just talking it through gave her the confidence to answer back and say that it didn't matter what others had chosen, she liked that school best and wanted to go there.

FWIW now that she's more than half way through (yr 10) I'm still happy she made the right choice - she's had good and bad times, but having talked to parents of dc at school Y, it's just the same. I think every school has good and bad points, no-where's perfect, and you just have to see what you think will suit best.

[DriftingDreamer]

That is reassuring Sadik...

[Sadik]

I also know pupils who've later moved in both directions (probably about an equal number) when they haven't settled / have had problems. Nothing's set in stone, no matter how final it feels in yr 6 . . .

Mind you, we're now starting the whole thing again (though fortunately dd is by now totally 'could I care less' in true teenage fashion). I mentioned to a friend that DD & I were going to a 6th form open day at the local college and she told me in great detail how mutual friend's ds was being totally let down etc and how her ds was of course going to stay in school for 6th form. Having asked mutual friend, it transpires that her ds had some timetable glitches that were fixed in the first 1/2 a term and is blissfully happy at college

[minifingerz]

"minifingerz, are you saying if you vote labour you can't send your kids to any private school for any reason?"

You can do what you like. Free country and all.

But don't jackboot about being sanctimonious about the importance of equality of opportunity for children, and the value of living in diverse communities, and then send your child to a school which is elitist.

Private schools exclude 90% of children who attend state schools - i.e. children who are neither wealthy nor very high achieving. It's embarrassing - social, economic, racial and academic discrimination and inequality writ large, played out in our schools every day. It's ugly and wrong.

And before anyone argues that there are 'all sorts of children' at their dc's private school - I call 'bollocks'. Private schools which claim to be ethnically diverse never even remotely reflect the demographic of the area in which they're based. For example the local private schools near me take in large numbers of Chinese and Asian children but have almost no Caribbean kids, who represent the largest minority locally.

The claim to be economically diverse is also bogus - only very clever, high achieving children from families with modest incomes welcome. No support or help there for children who are actually disadvantaged, rather than the ones whose only disadvantage is having parents without a big income.

I live in London and the divisions are so stark. Kids at local state schools are predominantly poor and black. Kids at local private schools are predominantly wealthy and white. It's like we live in a state of social and ethnic apartheid when it comes to education. Heart sinking, and left wingers shouldn't be propping the system up by paying into it.

[Alicekeach]

Tell your daughter to be like me. I went to the local under achieving comp because it's all my parents could afford. I had parents of friends describe it as being "a training ground for Borstal". It wasn't a great school academically but I made good friends and was happy there. I took great pleasure in getting better exam results than most of my expensively educated friends and an Oxbridge place to boot!

[motherinferior]

In Y4, the school I sent my daughters too was a real "oh well if it has to be X" and/or "you know, it's really quite good" (tone of amazement)....

It's now become the school people queue up to get their precious kids into, and this year's GCSEs look set to push that even further (not a stealth boast, DD1 will do well but some will do stratospherically well).

I am quite amused.

[motherinferior]

That should read 'sent my daughters TO'. Sorry. Thumbs on train.

[Ingles2]

Ok here's my story in the hope it'll allay your worries.
We live in Kent.. Ds1 is very academic and had his pick of grammar schools. We felt that was a good choice for him as he's conventionally academic. Ds2 is bright, but maybe not as bright as ds1. He is also dyspraxic so was struggling with gross and fine motor schools at 10/11. We decided that he shouldn't even sit the Kent test as our local school seemed like a good fit for him.. You wouldn't believe that stuff that people said to us, the school, other parents, other kids... You'd of thought we were condemning him to the worst of borstals! I've got to confess I worried and nearly wobbled, but dh insisted it was the right choice. Ds2 is now in yr 11 and just about to sit his GCSEs. Not only is he predicted 10A/A* but he is happy, confident, motivated, with nice friends and the school has given amazing pastoral support. I am so pleased we followed our (dh's) 😉 Gut instinct. Go with your gut.. It's not set in stone and can be changed . Fingers crossed it goes well 😊

[RaspberryIce]

I'd ask the school to speak to the children about not being rude about other people's school choices. Tact and sensitivity are important lessons for them to learn.
In dd's primary class everyone but two children went to one of four local comprehensives, so there wasn't too much of this, although one of the schools had a slightly poorer reputation at the time so there was the odd comment about that one. There probably isn't too much in it now though as it's improved. The two that didn't go to those comps went to a private school and a faith comp further afield. I remember the private mum making a comment about knowing her dd would be safe at the school she was going to. She's actually lovely though and I think it was a slip of the tongue. I can laugh about it as dd is happy at her comp and definitely feels safe.

[Nowdecide]

Good to hear the positive stories. Of course all schools are good and not so good at different things. It just seems like there are two doors, one marked 'success' and the other opening to a sheer drop. I know that's not true but I still fret (sometimes).