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Original poster

A Level Maths - how much of a jump from GCSE?

83 replies

MsRyanGosling · 17/09/2014 22:38

DS 1 has opted for A level Maths because he is perhaps fancying computer science at uni. The few we looked at all ask for A level Maths. He is at his schools 6th form.

He is not naturally talented at Maths. He got a B at GCSE in yr 11 and a C on Foundation paper in yr 10.

He is also doing physics (A @ GCSE) , IT (A @ gcse) and Psychology. He has no problem with these so far.

However, his 6th form have decided that they will be tested every four weeks and if they don't pass will be kicked off.

Had the first test this week and he got 21%. Says only one person passed, this was a boy who got an A* at GCSE and the highest mark in the school. Teacher said he was expecting 80%.

What I think has happened is DS was in set 3 for Maths and appears not to have been taught some of the higher level stuff which the kids ( a and a *s) who were in set 1 were. Perhaps something to do with I think, if I understand it right, he was fast tracked in yr 10? and missed stuff due to that, but I might not be right about that.

So to get to the bloody point.

Once they get into the A level syllabus and work will he be taught things from scratch or is he screwed if he doesn't get the a* gcse stuff. Does that make sense?! He can do the maths in physics well enough.

OP posts:
halamadrid · 17/09/2014 22:49

It is usually suggested that the GCSE should be grade A in order to take A level maths. My son got a B but the teacher has allowed him in the class because he got the B with no revision at all. The teacher said that if he had had to work hard for the B then he would be struggling at A level. I would think that, as your son was in set 3, he might struggle if he had to work really hard to get that B.

IDontDoIroning · 17/09/2014 22:52

My ds got an a* and he found it a huge step up and very hard initially. His school didn't do the further / additional maths at GCSE which he says would have helped.

Original poster
MsRyanGosling · 17/09/2014 23:01

Ahh. He was in set 3 because he spent 3 months of year 10 in hospital but got the highest mark on the foundation paper they sat so he clearly must have some aptitude and he is ok with the maths in Physics.

He did not do a tap of work at home revision wise but they seemed to do a lot in school.

His tutor also said needed an A really but ds argued and said the entry requirements state a B!

Perhaps he needs to channel himself a bit and work hard. I think he was really shocked at 21%.

I'd like to see how he gets on with the actual a level course which he says they've not got into yet. Not even a module handbook to see what might be in store.

OP posts:
Debs75 · 17/09/2014 23:02

Huge leap. I passed gcse 22 years ago with a C, B on mocks and came away with a U at A level. The step up is huge it is like learning another language. I really loved maths and still do, did gcse again last year and got an A. Although I would love to do A level maths again it is really hard and will probably remain a pipedream.

If he is adamant then it will require a lot of homework to keep up to standard

Original poster
MsRyanGosling · 17/09/2014 23:03

Sorry if I sounded arsey. I just read it back and it could be taken as arsey Confused

OP posts:
Original poster
MsRyanGosling · 17/09/2014 23:06

Right well I'll argue to at least keep him (if they try and kick him off) until they've started the actual work and if he can't do it he can't do it.

6th form have said definitely no changes allowed so if he does get kicked off he hasn't another to do Sad He got an A in Chemistry and was quite good at it and perhaps would have liked that.

OP posts:
halamadrid · 17/09/2014 23:15

If he's naturally able and could have got a better mark at GCSE then I don't suppose he will have a problem. It's just that you wrote in your OP that he's not naturally talented at maths. My son also missed most of the first term of year 10 but he is clever enough to have studied and caught up if he could have been bothered. He's assured me that sixth form will be different!

halamadrid · 17/09/2014 23:16

It's a bit harsh that no changes are allowed.

circular · 17/09/2014 23:21

If he hasn't already gone through it, take a step back and go through the CGP Headstart to AS maths' it covers all the A stuff from the GCSE course. It was DDs holiday homework before starting A level maths last year. It is actually possible to get an A at GCSE without knowing any of the A stuff.

DD got a mid-A at GCSE, expected to struggle but its been better than she thought. Physics for her has been far worse, A* GCSE, but really dropped at AS.

Dragonlette · 17/09/2014 23:23

We would be encouraging him to change courses if he was at our school.

We find that students who attempt AS level after getting a B at GCSE usually end up with Us at AS. The ones who manage to get a grade who have come to us with a B are the ones who work their socks off for the whole course, ask loads of questions, seek out help for homework at break and lunchtimes, use internet tutorial sites to help them (Khan Academy seems to be popular) but don't just copy their solutions, etc. And even then those who arrive in sixth form with a B grade GCSE tend not to get higher than a D at AS, unless they are very bright and the B came from messing around/absence in years 10 and 11, and then pull out all the stops in sixth form.

balia · 17/09/2014 23:29

DD got an A in Maths and an A in Statistics at GCSE but really struggled with A-level. She really worked for her GCSE's though, so not 'naturally able' as such and she was doing an extra AS level so could drop it without causing herself problems further on.

I'm intrigued by the idea that he has started his A level course but they aren't doing A level work. What are they doing?

ChewyGiraffe · 17/09/2014 23:30

I think you know he needs to just put his back into working at the maths and if he does that he'll soon catch up. I didn't do maths A level but did similar subjects and all went so far past GCSE that resting on your GCSE laurels, for anyone tempted to do that, was never going to get you very far.

Actually brilliant that his 6th form tests every four weeks. No better way to learn than practising questions (at least that's what I found for accountancy professional exams) and the fear factor of tests is a great motivator to get the practice in.

I admit I'm slightly confused by the choice of Psychology though. If he's interested in computer science at uni, was good at Chemistry and got an A at GCSE, then I'd say that Chemistry seems like a far better choice than Psychology (- think it would form a more related group with his other subjects and give him better scope to refine his choice of uni course if need be). Could you see if his college would let him swap Psychology for Chemistry? No matter what they've said already about no changes, that seems a bit harsh when term is only like 2 weeks in and he's perfectly capable of making that work up in his own time.

BackforGood · 17/09/2014 23:36

When my dn (who got an A* at GCSE) got a D for her AS, we began to hear lots and lots of stories from people, and all said it was the biggest jump in levels, at any point in your education, and that maths was renowned for being a particularly big jump.

Obv., this is just individuals' experiences and not data, but it is something I've heard over and over, from different sources.

Original poster
MsRyanGosling · 17/09/2014 23:41

I am truly shocked.

Is it really that hard Shock why doesn't he struggle with physics Confused

He absolutely HATED his maths teacher who he had for y10 and y11 (she left part way through the year!).

I wonder if it is a combination of things re Maths that have got him on this backfoot.

I don't want him to get a U. That would be totally pointless and damaging.

Oh dear. I'll look into the books and website you've mentioned see what he thinks and feels about it.

There are a few after school sessions and resit tests planned so will see if he miraculously picks up or wether it's flogging a dead horse.

He's not the type (now) to put in as much effort that seems required and he doesn't have the luxury of a lot of time like he had Y7-11.

Thanks for the replies Smile

OP posts:
Original poster
MsRyanGosling · 17/09/2014 23:47

Psychology was suggested by a tutor at another college as a way of giving his mind a rest from figures and the rigor of maths and physics Shock and thinking in different ways.

It was meant to be sociology or ethics and philosophy as he was quite good at RE/IS but the timetable clashed so in enrolment he chose psychology himself Shock perhaps because it is something brand new also.

Its so hard for me my PFB Grin

OP posts:
Cherrypi · 17/09/2014 23:50

Get him to concentrate on GCSE A*/A algebra work. If he works really hard he could get a D.

CantSleepWontSleep · 18/09/2014 00:07

Gosh it seems that people have quite different experiences from mine. I got a B at GCSE (was expecting an A until I took the exam and came out knowing that I'd royally funked up on a massively marked question). I went on to do 2 A levels in maths, in which I got an A and a B.
I worked hard for them, but I wouldn't say that the jump was as big as this thread suggests.
This was a long time ago, but unless they've massively dumbed down GCSEs since, I don't see why it would be any different.
WWill the low mark on this test give him a wake up call and encourage him to work harder do you think?

ReallyTired · 18/09/2014 00:27

A-level Maths requires a strong foundation. I sat GCSE Maths early and got a B and I also got a B for A level. I found that A-level Maths inspite of starting early in year 11. I sweated blood to get my B for A-level Maths.

A-level Maths requires a different type of brain to GCSE maths. (Or at least it did in 1990) GCSE maths involved solving problems where as A-level maths was more proofs, geometry and calculus. I found A-level Mechanics easy as I was doing A-level Physics

Cherrypi · 18/09/2014 04:24

Your hit the nail on the head there cantsleep. GCSE Maths is a lot easier. It is possible to get a B without understanding algebra. Some students are not even taught the A* work that is the foundation for A level. A level was dumbed down a bit too but not so much. There was some O level maths that you wouldn't cover till your degree now.

PickledPorcupine · 18/09/2014 04:47

I got an A at gsce maths with very little revision. Ended up with a D at A level after working my backside off and doing resits!! I did 5 AS's and 4 A levels and maths was the hardest by a very very long way. I agree with others who say the jump is huge. I loved gcse but A level was horrendous and I wish I'd never bothered with it.

hellsbells99 · 18/09/2014 08:05

My DD got an A at Gcse and went on to get an A at AS but she did do extra algebra in year 11. As mentioned in a previous post, you need to continually do past papers/questions. DD has worked her socks off and had an excellent teacher. If he is determined to do it and will work hard, then get him a tutor.

darlingfascistbullyboy · 18/09/2014 08:53

at dd's school they say students must have a B at GCSE in order to do A level maths but they must also have covered all of the A material at GCSE (so have been in one of the top two sets) and be able to demonstrate 'proficiency' in algebra. In effect this means that only A & A GCSE students take the A level.

duhgldiuhfdsli · 18/09/2014 10:37

If he doesn't do A Level maths, it restricts his options in applying for computer science in the Russell Group and the next band down. There are a few courses which will take students who don't have A Level maths, but usually only if they have A Level computer science, not to be confused with A Level ICT. But they are uncommon, and the ones I know of offhand demand AAA at least. And at those universities he would have to do what amounts to A Level maths in the first year, and if he fails it that's a problem. In practice, the vast majority of students who successfully complete computer science degrees at selective universities have A Level maths, typically at grade A or at least B.

duhgldiuhfdsli · 18/09/2014 10:40

why doesn't he struggle with physics

Because most of the maths has been stripped out of GCSE Physics, and A Level physics doesn't require much that isn't in GCSE maths. By the end of A2 physics he might find that he's picked up a bit of the material that's in additional maths (a small amount of calculus, particularly) but the days of needing to do what amounted to A Level maths to do A Level physics have long gone.

neiljames77 · 18/09/2014 10:47

My youngest has dropped A level maths. She got A at gcse but now knows she can't get the A/A she needs at A level. It's a huge leap.