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Secondary education

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Original poster

DH had decided DD should not go to grammar school - Help!

262 replies

supadoula · 26/08/2014 21:18

Our gorgeous DD passed her 11+ without any tuition and then got into a grammar school 10 minutes away. She is not happy because she will miss some of her friends.
Without my knowledge, DH phoned the headmistress of her previous school (a failing middle school in special measures!) to ask if they would have her back. Of course, they said they would. Now, DD is convinced she is going back to her middle school...
I am going to mediation tomorrow with soon to be ex DH in order to sort this out ASAP. She is registered at the grammar school anyway but I need ammunition so that DH realises that it is his parental duty not to give into his daughter's whims and think about her long term future. Help!!AngrySad

OP posts:
Hakluyt · 01/09/2014 07:26

A bright child with supportive parents will do well anywhere. That's a why the grammar school is s unfair. Because the kids who get to grammar school are the bright children with supportive parents who would do well anyway. Privilege attracts privilege.

SeagullsAndSand · 01/09/2014 07:47

That is absolute pants and royally hacks me off when people say it.Bright children don't do well anywhere and actually why should they?Why should they put up with the "anywhere".

Dp and I were both bright(I had supportive parents and he didn't,Dp's family were poor too)and went to utter shite comps.We did ok but could have done way better. Dp ended up doing A levels whilst working in a year and hoping on to do two degrees at two red brick unis.There is no way on earth my dc are going to be experiencing the same at secondary ie an uphill battle to get what they are capable of.

We will aim to get them in the school that best suits like them just like the sporty parents trying to get their sporty kids into the out of catchment all singing all dancing comp down the road having spent £££££ on sporting activities out of school.We have about 4 schools to choose from,the grammar is but one.It best suits 2 of my 3 dc so we're going for it.

SeagullsAndSand · 01/09/2014 07:50

And my dc aren't up for grabs,there to be used by Wilshaw et al to provide a good influence to others.We will decide where they go,nobody else.And we will choose the best fit for them not the general population thanks. Been,there and done that experiment.It was shite and of no benefit what so ever to me or dp as individuals.

Hakluyt · 01/09/2014 07:55

"That is absolute pants and royally hacks me off when people say it.Bright children don't do well anywhere and actually why should they?Why should they put up with the "anywhere"."

Why should anyone have to put up with "anywhere"?

SeagullsAndSand · 01/09/2014 08:00

You just suggested that a section of society should.

Many,many families don't put up with "anywhere".Many have a choice,in our area you do,a good choice.In others some scrimp and save,giving up on holidays and all sorts of things in order to live/ rent or buy near their school of choice.Some parents couldn't care less.Some parents try for grammar or private schools.

It is a democracy and frankly the anti 11+ crusade is getting utterly tedious?You don't like it,there are lots of things in life I don't like.GS are here to stay,live with it.

Hakluyt · 01/09/2014 08:05

"It is a democracy and frankly the anti 11+ crusade is getting utterly tedious?You don't like it,there are lots of things in life I don't like.GS are here to stay,live with it."

You don't have to engage with it if you find it tedious. I'll happily continue the campaign without your input!

SeagullsAndSand · 01/09/2014 08:13

On every single thread. Sometimes posters want and are entitled to help,info and support without your crusade.

Are you going to up your crusade to any out of catchment school or in catchment school parents move to and choose to send their dc to?Because as far as I can see unless every single parent in the land puts up with an allocated school and zero choice your anti gs crusade is a tad weak.

JustAShopGirl · 01/09/2014 08:40

Some of us just think that you cannot have truly comprehensive education where GS exist. (or public schools for that matter - but that is a different story to state funded GS v comprehensive education)

If they take off the top 10% or whatever, of kids whose parents are invested heavily in their child's education then other schools will not have the full range of abilities there, or the parental involvement that makes a school "better".

poorer pupils will always be significantly under-represented at top performing state schools REGARDLESS of their ability unless something changes - and those who hold the power do not want this to change.

Our local grammars - 5 of them - had 1%, 2%, 4%, 2% and 1.5% FSM intake last year.

SeagullsAndSand · 01/09/2014 08:44

How on earth does the presence of 3 kids in a class of 30 have a massive impact on everybody else?

What are you expecting from them?

Why should they of their parents be held responsible for everybody else?

Our local comp loses more kids to the all singing all dancing comp down the road than to the gs,but that's ok.

Hakluyt · 01/09/2014 08:46

"On every single thread. Sometimes posters want and are entitled to help,info and support without your crusade."

No. Only on threads where people are misinformed about selection at 10 and the impact on everyone concerned.

SeagullsAndSand · 01/09/2014 08:48

No you pitch up on every 11+ thread.

Have you ever thought MN is a good place for all parents(poorer included) to get info.The constant it is impossible to get into grammar without spending shed loads of money,it's not for poorer families puts poorer families off.

There is a time and a place.

Start your own anti grammar threads.

SeagullsAndSand · 01/09/2014 08:52

And I'm presuming you're in favour of the lottery system for every child in the land alongside abolishing private schools as regards school selection.

RabbitOfNegativeEuphoria · 01/09/2014 09:14

hakluyt - bright child with supportive parents and no SENs/other issues might do well anywhere. Or they might not. And there is nothing to suggest that all kids at grammar school have supportive parents. And being generally supportive and being usefully engaged aren't necessarily the same thing either. Many parents who are supportive of their kids (want them to do well) are about as much practical use as a chocolate teapot (I'm certainly one such).

TheWordFactory · 01/09/2014 09:41

To be honest hak to use a thread where woman is seeking advice on how to deal with a controlling ex on your 'campaign' is a bit low.

The OP really doesn't need lectures on your views of the selective system. Time and place ...

Hakluyt · 01/09/2014 09:50

I didn't start it, Word.!

QuintessentiallyQS · 01/09/2014 09:53

Laphem if you reread my post you will find that I said that a bright child can do well in a good school. Your school does not seem to have been good. It does not appear that Ops child is in a school similar to yours, and she has parents that wants the best for her schooling, so the child is already half way there! I assume from your post that your parents did not encourage you to become a doctor or lawyer seeing as it never occurred to you? So, what was really missing from my post was the addition that a bright child could do well in a good school ^with the support of parents who care about the child's education".

QuintessentiallyQS · 01/09/2014 09:59

"Why should anyone have to put up with "anywhere"?"

Indeed. Why is a school deemed "satisfactory" allowed to continue their "education" by this government?

Why change to a stricter and better curriculum when schools are not able to deliver the current curriculum to at least somewhere between "good" and "outstanding" as minimum?

If all schools were outstanding, and striving for higher standards of education, you might find that the allure of the Grammar and the fee paying school diminished, as children would be at an even playing field.

QuintessentiallyQS · 01/09/2014 10:04

However, I do agree that it is a shame that parental input should matter at all.

My parents took no interest in my education, or my spare time activities. I think I was the only child at my football team whose parents were never at matches. I was the only child whose parents did not take me to horseriding, so had to drop out, as it was difficult to cycle there in winter. They paid for my activities, they just did not take me there, I had to find my own transport or get there on my own, even as young as Y4.

I had no help with homework, nobody checked that I did my homework. Yet, I was not in a deprived family at all. I still managed to do reasonably well in school.

Molio · 01/09/2014 10:23

QQS parents do not need to check homework is done once a child hits Y7! My parents certainly never did but were sufficiently interested in my education. I've certainly never checked whether or not my own DC have done any homework and am sufficiently interested in their education. If a DC doesn't do homework, that gets noticed at school and the DC gets into trouble - the DC needs to work out for itself that homework needs to be done.

YeGodsAndLittleFishes · 01/09/2014 10:33

You can't have truly comprehensive education where indy and public schools exist either.

Who says truly comprehensive education is a good thing? DH turned down an Eton scholarship and went to his local comp. He basically took over teaching maths there (relative was a maths teacher and he was the girfted type.) He went to Cambridge a couple of years early. But did that benefit the other children in his school year? The SN provision in the school was terrible.

I don't think the problem is grammar schools, it is that more that teachers can't teach, because of behaviour of children, class size and wide differentiation, as well as not getting training in SN (which is what I call teaching!)

areyoubeingserviced · 01/09/2014 10:36

Supportive parents have a huge
Impact on a child's education.
I am that parent.
My dcs attend/ attended a school which was deemed inadequate( primary)
Yet they are doing well
That is because myself and dh are interested parents who support our dcs education.
I am on annual leave at the moment but have spent the last week helping my dcs with English , maths, science etc. I suppose my dcs are fortunate as my dh and I are fairly well educated and therefore are able to help our children.
However, I know many children of recent immigrants who have achieved outstanding GCSE results at both grammar and comprehensive schools.
They have one thing in common.
Supportive and interested parents.

Molio · 01/09/2014 10:42

I don't think being interested should have to extend to teaching or checking up on DC re. homework? Isn't being interested generally in how they're doing enough?

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 01/09/2014 10:43

I think the argument about selection was inaugurated with the (possibly quite knowingly contentious) comment about 'rubbing shoulders with the brightest and the best', word - obvious bait, obviously going to be risen to.

Tad unfair to say that Hak should not say anything about selection when things are already being said about selection by others with different perspective.

differentnameforthis · 01/09/2014 10:58

You know deep down if she goes to less academic school she will coast, she will be top of the class doing not much and then get into bad habits

There's nothing to say that won't happen at the grammar! If she is miserable, how effective is her schooling going to be?

RowanWeston · 01/09/2014 11:12

Exactly! My child is at the grammar that the OP wants, having a miserable time and missing either chunks of, or entire lessons because of bullying.