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Secondary education

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Advice wanted on wording this letter

380 replies

montrealmum · 08/07/2014 19:36

Dear XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX,
We are writing to express our concern about the Year 8 Religious Studies Visit scheduled to take place this September.
Parents have been informed that girls who wish to attend the trip are required to wear trousers and a headscarf as a mark of respect for the religious institutions they will be visiting.
It is also our understanding that girls who do not wish to wear the headscarves or trousers, or whose families feel it does not accord with their beliefs, will be working on their own at school that day on Religious Studies coursework.
While I fully appreciate the need to dress respectfully on a visit to any religious institution, I feel I must draw a line at my very young daughter being compelled to wear clothing items intended for women to express their sexual modesty. Just as I feel it would be utterly wrong to compel a Muslim girl to remove her headscarf in order to participate in a school activity, so I feel it is wrong to compel my daughter, or any other girl, to wear one.
It would be very easy for us to simply agree to this request on the basis that the headscarf may be seen as nothing more than a temporary fashion accessory, to be worn for an hour or so. However, I am sure that a Muslim would not regard it as such, and nor do we. While respect for religious traditions is surely admirable, is it not the case that respect for our views as atheists and feminists are equally worthy of consideration?
We would urge the school to consider whether such an approach does truly promote community cohesion surely with a little more communication, an agreement could be come to which is mutually agreeable to all. We would hate to think that any girls first exposure to Islam would be one of unnecessary compulsion.
Perhaps an agreement that girls have the symbolism of the headscarf explained to them, and are given the option to wear one on the day, would be more conciliatory. Or at the very least, that an option is given to those girls who choose to abstain that is not tantamount to an internal exclusion.
Given these objections, we find ourselves in the unenviable position of having to choose between our sincerely held beliefs and putting our daughter in a position where she feels excluded and socially isolated.
We therefore reluctantly give our permission for her to attend on the day and follow the strictures set down, but do ask that you give serious thought to our concerns about this matter.
We would like to thank the school for their choice of role models for the girls, such as Rosa Parks and Emmeline Pankhurst, women who understood that following social conventions is not always the best choice to make.
Thank you for your time,
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

OP posts:
larrygrylls · 09/07/2014 20:39

Montreal,

You have to be having a laugh here. Seriously, there may be issues with religions and sexism but they are mostly not expressed via dress code.

And, even if you do have issues, then surely it is best to allow your child a sampler day, so she can make her own mind up?

Finally, you are awfully keen on criticising others' lack of intelligence but you lost my respect when you referred to your. 'Beliefs' as an atheist. Theism refers to belief, atheism is, by definition, a lack of belief.

montrealmum · 09/07/2014 20:41

Perhaps this is unfair. Maybe you are highly intelligent, but lack basic skills in reading comprehension. Either way, you're shadow boxing.

OP posts:
Molio · 09/07/2014 20:42

I can't quite see where my reading comprehension skills have let me down. Please be specific, don't just indulge in sound bites.

montrealmum · 09/07/2014 20:46

Asking the mosque what the dress code is is quibbling and pestering?
In what way do I not accept that there may be valid views which I don't share? By questioning those views?

OP posts:
montrealmum · 09/07/2014 20:51

Larrygrylls, letter says "views" not "beliefs"

OP posts:
montrealmum · 09/07/2014 20:56

Larrygrylls,

"Seriously, there may be issues with religions and sexism but they are mostly not expressed via dress code"
Are you for real?
I am giving my daughter a "sampler day". For the love of God, can no one on here read????

OP posts:
brdgrl · 09/07/2014 20:58

Montreal, seriously, could you please explain why, with all your commitment to the teaching of feminism and your superior methods, your son has picked up on so little of it?

montrealmum · 09/07/2014 20:59

Er, maybe because he is not exposed to it in his daily life and he is eight years old?

OP posts:
larrygrylls · 09/07/2014 21:00

Yes,

I am for real and I can read just fine. The dress code for Jewish boys/'men is far more rigorous than for women, so is Judaism sexist against men?

And you are choosing the worst of all worlds, sending you'd daughter and whining too. If you feel strongly, leg her write a feminist atheist essay in the LRC. If you don't, send her and respect the religion concerned.

Or, you could go for a really radical alternative and actually let her make up her own mind.

montrealmum · 09/07/2014 21:04

It, as in women and men or boys and girls being treated unequally.

OP posts:
montrealmum · 09/07/2014 21:06

Larrygrylls, writing a letter expressing disquiet is not "whining". What an interesting choice of verb. Says a lot about you.

OP posts:
brdgrl · 09/07/2014 21:08

He's not exposed to feminism in his daily life?

You're writing this letter to the school and patronising them with talk about how marvelous it is that they promote role models like Pankhurst and Parks...but chastising them for expecting their female students to show appropriate respect to another culture because you (rightly or wrongly, that's another topic again!) believe it is demeaning to women...

..and yet you have spent zero of this energy on making sure your son is even aware of gender inequality?
I'm sorry, but that is really telling.

larrygrylls · 09/07/2014 21:09

Montreal,

You have no idea how mild my choice of vocabulary is relative to that which would be heard in the staff room, were you go send that letter!

Optimist1 · 09/07/2014 21:12

Anyone else of the opinion that the OP is just show-boating?

OwlCapone · 09/07/2014 21:14

I think the way the OP has behaved on this thread says a lot about what sort of person she is. I find it amusing that she complains about abuse and then hurls it back in equal measure. Interesting.

Optimist1 · 09/07/2014 21:19

I would have been interested to know how she would have liked the school to deal with the proposed visit, but she declined to answer. There has been a great deal of reasoned argument upthread (some of which I agree with, some of which I don't) but apparently nobody's reasoning is of the same standard as OP's.

montrealmum · 09/07/2014 21:26

No, Brdgrl, he's not exposed to overt sexism in his daily life. All the women and men he knows treat each other as equals. However, the discussion we had as a family about this school visit gave us the opportunity to explain that this is not universally the case.

OP posts:
montrealmum · 09/07/2014 21:30

Optimist, I have answered that question, ad nauseum. Read original letter and my numerous posts concerning same.

OP posts:
montrealmum · 09/07/2014 21:37

www.thekrakenwakes.org/parenting-2/mumsnet-hell/

She's not kidding.

OP posts:
Molio · 09/07/2014 21:49

'Boden-clad'. What silly wannabe edgy stereotyping. Couldn't be fagged to read after that.

KateSMumsnet · 09/07/2014 21:56

Hello everyone,

Can we please remind you all of our talk guidelines?

Optimist1 · 09/07/2014 21:59

I've re-read the OP several times and your subsequent posts, Montreal but there's no clear indication of how exactly you'd like this situation dealt with (in the real world, where "education" means exposing our children to others' beliefs and where schools are seldom in a position to accommodate the eccentricities of those who get a bee in their bonnet). I give up. You do your case no favours by your approach.

montrealmum · 09/07/2014 22:14

Optimist, I think I could try to find a mosque that doesn't have headscarves required. A bit tricky as most of the websites I've looked at don't explicitly state their dress policy.

OP posts:
montrealmum · 09/07/2014 22:17

Molio,
"Boden - clad" - is that more offensive than being told to stay in Blackpool in my flip - flops?

OP posts:
mineofuselessinformation · 09/07/2014 22:40

What's wrong with Boden? Shock
[side-tracks thread entirely]