Scottish education needs to change, right now.

[Easypeelersareterrible]

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/scotsnet/5217850-scottish-teachers-can-i-do-anything-apart-from-go-off-sick

I’ve just read the above thread and it’s just so shocking. I’m not a teacher and therefore don’t want to derail the thread, but everyone in this situation is being catastrophically failed. The teacher, who can take no more, feels she’s been put in an impossible situation and has no choice but to leave. The child with SEN who sounds utterly distraught in mainstream schooling. The other pupils in the class who are only P1 and have to try to learn in an incredibly distressing situation. Imagine being only P1 and this being your only experience of school!

We need to open more special schools and pupil referral units. Mainstream schooling needs to be for those who want to learn and are capable of learning. By putting children with unmet SEN or disruptive pupils into mainstream schooling we are not meeting their need while at the same time destroying the education and mental health of those willing and able to learn. ‘Inclusion at all costs’ is failing Scotland.

Why can’t politicians see this, and take the decision that desperately need to be taken?

Specialist not special because ‘special’ is often used as a pejorative; “Those kids are speshul”

I haven't heard the word "special" being used in a negative light for years. Loads of kids have ASN as someone else rightly pointed out uptrend, so it's unusual if you don't have special needs in some ways. But fair point, if it's easier specialist school it is - just as long as we have provisions for these children that's ultimately all that matters at the end of the day. Call it what you want!🤷‍♀️

aesoplover
Have you looked at Falkland House? Or https://www.e-sgoil.com/i-sgoil/
?

That's terrible you have been let down by so many agencies, especially the school itself. I don't know what else to recommend. You have my sympathies, it's not easy with resources being so lacking in schools.

Do you have team around the child meetings?

Falkland House looks like a great school but it's too far away from us and DS would never board.

I-Sgoil is full and there's a lengthy waiting list.

Thank you for the suggestions though 😊

@Vettrianofan

I've not been let down by them - they have been very kind and helpful but there's just nowhere for my child to go so their input is limited.

Sorry I don't understand your question about having a team around at meetings?

At our children's local primary school all health/ social and educational professionals get together round a table and support a child. Every including the parents have input. Every works together for the child's benefit.

Sorry, I misunderstood about your child's school. Really pleased that they are supportive but limited by resources.

Ah ok - yes this was the case before Covid but since then it's been sporadic.

Sometimes the SFL lead emails to see if I want to go in "for a chat" and then it turns out it's a full meeting, the opposite is also true. People say they will be attending and then they don't turn up.

It's so frustrating that I have just given up with it all as nothing that happens ever does anything to help DS.

When I started out children would be thoroughly assessed by an Educational psychologist then would have a Statement of Special Educational needs that would often stipulate they had one to one auxiliary support with amount of hours plus how many hours SEN teaching time they'd get. Then it became "access to" these services so that became as little or as much as the school could afford.

Latterly we never see an EP in school as they work in a collaborative role and are there only for advice (on a huge salary). The only time I've known them visit is for behaviour pupils.

Pupils with ASN who should be getting extra help are not getting it as it's going to behaviour pupils who are presenting a danger to pupils and staff. We actually had a child with 2-1 PSAs full time as nobody was to be working on their own with him due to violence and spurious allegations.

Yes EPs with a huge salary with little useful to add to a meeting - DS apparently could not be picked out amongst his peers in PE as being different or standing out🤨 yet we were able to as parents notice the stark difference.

Two years later the differences are even more apparent. Luckily OT services have stepped in and can see everything we see a mile off.

The downgrading of EP to a consultative service is a scandal.

In our English Primary, the EP came in and spent 45 mins with my child, an hour with me and I assume some time with the class teacher and then prepared a 3 page report with recommendations.

Up here they seemed incredulous that I should be asking for EP involvement. I managed to speak to the EP via zoom and she just kept asking me what I wanted her to do? She also sat and ate her lunch and chatted to her partner off screen. The "don't give a shit" vibe was strong.
Ended with her saying she'd get school to prepare a CIRCLE document. They did and it showed that DS was extremely distressed and unhappy in many areas. But nothing was done about any of it.

We had your former experience a decade ago (it was rare even then). Their numbers have now been cut by two-thirds and they advise schools without names being used. We’ve not seen one in years and given their later involvement we don’t miss them.

It is a classic example of reducing input to such a level that it becomes worthless and then they can say EP input is of no benefit so why not cut it and save the money? Speech and language services are another example of this.

That's shocking @aesoplover but not untypical I fear. We even had an EP send a full report to a parent (based on a telephone conversation with me as ASN teacher, nothing from class teacher) with her name at the end of it.
The parent naturally assumed she had been down to assess the child and see him in class setting etc.
This woman is now the Senior EP 🙄

I know of several academically able kids with ASD who are home educated for this reason. I was so absolutely agast when it was suggested that my child who has always been academically ahead of his age, attended such a class, just because he is somewhat socially unaware. I hope to fuck he manages to stay in mainstream because there is absolutely no appropriate school provision for academically able kids with ASD. It's try to deal with all the stress of mainstream, or sit doing work he could have done 5 years ago.

Same in my area - nothing for academically able children who can’t manage in mainstream.

Name changed for this
I’m a teacher in a SEN school. 5-10 years ago 2/3 schools I have worked in were considered MLD, moderate learning difficulties so children maybe 3-5 years behind their mainstream counterparts. Now the intake is completely different, we don’t get those children now, due to inclusion they are in mainstream and the SEN schools are for only the most complex and severe children.

My current class all non-verbal, all still in nappies, all cognitively 12-18 months. Im in no way saying those children should not be in the school, they are entitled to an education tailored to meets their needs (but that’s another story).

Anyway SEN schools are absolutely bursting at the seams, every possible space is a classroom to the detriment of the children, that means libraries, music rooms, sensory rooms have been turned into classrooms. I heard of a SEN school being relocated into a community centre with very unsuitable facilities rather than the council find a new build.

All this poor children who should have been in a SEN school are now in mainstream, they are suffering, their classmates are suffering and teachers are suffering. A lot of the violence is unreported as staff don’t have time to fill out forms and feel no one cares even if they do. In every classroom in the country there will be at least one child who shouldn’t be there. Who ends up spending their days being followed around the playground by a PSA or sitting on an iPad just so the other children can learn. By the time high-school comes around it’s poor attendance and nurture rooms as they cannot cope with being in a class.

I feel, as many colleagues do, that there’s a whole level of SEN schools missing from Scottish education now between the current SEN schools and mainstream.

We really are failing children just now 😟

Mainstream private has worked excellently for our academic mild ASD child. We can just about scrape together the money. We have to pay the VAT though as only those who have a CSP which states that a child needs to be in that private school will get VAT-free fees. We had zoom meetings with EP, pupil support staff and teaching staff so I think we were one level down from CSP and it was a while ago anyway and I cannot be bothered to take over that old ground in the hope of avoiding VAT.

But it begs the question, could education departments be pressed to actually fund private school places for high functioning asd children? If it’s that or homeschooling and a child has a right to an education.

It would be an interesting Freedom of Information question to councils to ask if they fund any mainstream private school places. I suspect there are none.

Unfortunately there are no private schools in the Highland Council area ( which is the size of Belgium!).

That's a really interesting question about funding private schools. When I raised that if my son went to the base the work given wouldn't be of an appropriate level for him I was told they could get higher level work sent from mainstream. So I expect they would say sitting in a corner doing work on your own counts as provision.

Not to mention that part of the reason it was suggested was so he could be in a quieter environment. There are a few disruptive kids in his mainstream class, but last week in the base they had to lock some children in a separate room to keep them safe from one who was rampaging and attacking everyone. It is not a calm environment at all.

Edit: spelling

They do fund places at Donaldson's which is private special school so I assume they also fund places at mainstream private which will no doubt be cheaper.

"I was told they could get higher level work sent from mainstream. So I expect they would say sitting in a corner doing work on your own counts as provision."

This is sort of what they do with DS although he works from home and in SFL dept. Yes they are providing work but there's no teacher explaining it, assisting, giving feedback etc. No class discussion or collaboration either.

Your last paragraph sums up exactly why that is not fair or adequate provision for these young people. It's not a comparable experience to classroom learning. And it's socially isolating too.

You wouldn’t get a CSP if you are paying for private school. You fall at the first hurdle: (1)(a) an education authority are responsible for the school education of the child or young person,

You also cannot make a placing request for a mainstream private school, unlike in England.

https://www.gov.scot/policies/human-rights/childrens-rights/

I says that it is now not legal for local authorities to uphold children's rights so what does that mean re article 19 - the protection from violence - if being hurt by others in school?