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Scotsnet

Welcome to Scotsnet - discuss all aspects of life in Scotland, including relocating, schools and local areas.

The Scottish power grab?

201 replies

Mango1982 · 20/08/2021 11:50

The SNP has unveiled sinister plans to make its emergency Covid powers permanent. Deputy First Minister John Swinney says it's an opportunity to maintain the brilliant 'innovations' the SNP has made in the last 15 months.
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/17/scottish-government-wants-make-emergency-covid-powers-permanent/

Not shocked at all but worried yes !
I knew governments wouldn’t never want to give back these powers they never do 🤷‍♀️

OP posts:
TheGenealogist · 20/08/2021 20:04

Read the word soup that the Scot Gov churn out? No thanks. Would rather gouge out my own eyeballs with spoons.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 20:08

Ok @ElephantOfRisk please explain to me how self ID is any different to what's been going on since the 70s because I am bored of this reactionary and transphobic discussion.
How did the woman in my town who everyone knows was once a man actually manage to get the surgery she had? That's right she self IDd as a woman for many long years.. and faced horrible prejudice.
And actually now WHO CARES? She lives her life peacefully.
If you disagree with the consultation to extend aspects of the coronavirus powers isn't that what is up for discussion?
It would be good if people could just actually say what their exact worries are. Is it abuse of mask powers by mask crazy MSPs and mandarins?

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 20:09

"Confirmed liars"

"Gouge my eyes out with spoons and moan on here rather than exercise my democratic rights "

If the thread police did exist they would have a ball

TheGenealogist · 20/08/2021 20:11

I have exercised my democratic rights by filling in their consultation. And my views will be ignored. As they always are. Because Nicola only wants to hear from people telling her she's doing an amazing job. Ergo, filling it in is a waste of time.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 20:12

That's great you filled it in @TheGenealogist I hate to tell you but Nicola probably won't read it, maybe a junior researcher at Victoria Quay on their internship.

ElephantOfRisk · 20/08/2021 20:15

I also don't care how anyone lives their lives when it's not at the detriment of women and girls such as self ID in prison etc. maybe you need to open your eyes a bit. It's also detrimental to all children actually, being told that they can be the opposite sex rather than be treated properly for their mental conditions. It shouldn't even need to be said that we are not talking about people who just want to live their lives and be accepted in society.

Mango1982 · 20/08/2021 20:19

this
ElephantOfRisk

It's not about whether we agree or disagree with individual items. There is a process in place to have those agreed and changed as required. There may well be things that in retrospect have worked well and the case can be made for those to be kept. Not this piecemeal ram everything together and hope people don't notice.
othetwise what’s the point of democracy we should just let the queen decide or get in a dictatorship🤷‍♀️

If you have a good idea you put it to parliament the parliament put the feelers out and on what their constituents think and vote accordingly well that’s how things used to be done

OP posts:
visitingagain · 20/08/2021 20:26

I'm sorry @ElephantOfRisk you are expressing some pretty silly and transphobic views there. I don't blame you, I was sucked into this at first but it's a red herring.
The truth is that if people are doing bad things whatever gender then they are bad people and breaking the law.
It's gay men = paedophiles all over again.
Of course there are one or two evil misogynists and incel men who masquerade as women.
That doesn't mean all trans people are evil. It's a false equivalence and women including trans women are no more at risk than they have ever been.
This is just a load of horrible moral panic. It sickens me and I sincerely hope people espousing it never have any friends or family who experience transphobic abuse.

ElephantOfRisk · 20/08/2021 20:28

For goodness sake, no-one was saying that all trans people are a problem. You are making your own shite up here.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 20:28

And @Mango1982 it is exactly about whether you disagree or agree with individual items. Go and have your say in the consultation as I can assure you Scottish Government aren't patrolling mumsnet.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 20:31

"I also don't care how anyone lives their lives when it's not at the detriment of women and girls such as self ID in prison etc. maybe you need to open your eyes a bit. It's also detrimental to all children actually, being told that they can be the opposite sex rather than be treated properly for their mental conditions. It shouldn't even need to be said that we are not talking about people who just want to live their lives and be accepted in society."

In what way is it detrimental to children to be told they can make their own decisions?

Where are these hundreds of rapists and peeping toms dressed as women, to the detriment of " real" women? Utter nonsense

ElephantOfRisk · 20/08/2021 20:33

Christ I'm not going to get into all this when you clearly haven't got a clue, but i'll leave you with a question, is it possible to change sex?

ElephantOfRisk · 20/08/2021 20:34

The only person that has mentioned rapists and paedos is you.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 20:36

Yes @ElephantOfRisk it is perfectly possible to change sex. And why it threatens you so much that you need to bring Christ into it I don't know. I do have a clue and you don't know who I am or what I do.
Your opinions are transphobic and in twenty years you are going to look back and wonder at them.

ElephantOfRisk · 20/08/2021 20:41

Well by the posts on this thread you seem to be some scotgov employee and you are clearly deluded. I'm not transphobic in the slightest. 3 kids from DSs class believe that they are trans, 2 have transitioned physically one not. All decent kids and i'd have and have had any of them in my home at any time. But they haven't changed sex.

rightenough · 20/08/2021 20:50

In what way is it detrimental to children to be told they can make their own decisions?

It is detrimental to children because from the time they are born we are immersing them in a society that says pink and dolls and ponies = girls and blue and cars and dogs = boys.

We are also telling them, factually, that vagina / flower = girl and penis / willy Grin = boy.

But three year old Becky doesn't like dolls and she certainly doesn't like pink.

FINE.

We need to be teaching a very confused becky who thinks she is a boy (because she is immersed in a society where blue and cars and dogs = boy) that becky can still be becky and like blue and that gender stereotypes are exactly that - stereotypes.

What is harmful is telling Becky that because she likes blue and cars and dogs that she might be a boy.

That's the detrimental part. The inappropriate part.

And, since you keep wanting to use gays and lesbians to further your point (they must get SO sick of being dragged into this so apologies) here is the equivalent:

Three year old Jack thinks he might be gay.

What we do is tell him that's fine, love comes in different forms and sometimes it's a man and a woman, or a man and a man, or a woman and a woman. And we let him grow up and discover what he is.

We don't go any further than that, do we? So why do we have to go further with Becky?

And for someone complaining about derailing - the quickest way to do it is to put words into other peoples mouth so they need to explain themselves....

Whycangirlsbesonasty · 20/08/2021 21:02

I think that in 20 years time people will look back and wonder how on earth we travelled so far down the plug hole that the radical trans right lobby dragged us down, and why we didn’t just let transgender people lead their lives in quiet dignity instead.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 21:13

Gender stereotypes are horrible @rightenough so just equating those with boy/ girl is wrong too.
People are getting their knickers in a twist over this to be frank. There is literally no harm in explaining difference to children and letting them say things like " I am a boy ".
@ElephantOfRisk I am not an employee of the Scottish government.
I am an SNP member, but not terribly active.
It's very easy for people on mumsnet and Scotsnet in particular to take knee jerk reactions to anything they read in the telegraph etc about Scotland and as those of us with independence supporting views have been driven out this is just becoming an echo chamber.
Despite all the outrage we have another SNP government just elected 100 days ago. We have a majority for independence in the parliament.
That means that the policies and the personalities have been popular. Despite unremitting negativity from many quarters and the whole Alex Salmond creepy hands transphobe party debacle. We still got elected.
I know you don't like to hear this on mumsnet but you are finding it hard to objectively unpick your actual objection to the specific part of the consultation you disagree with so instead we have gone off piste and into the witch hunt on difference. What don't you like? Is it the public health measures? Are you anti mask and anti vax? Please say

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 21:15

"I think that in 20 years time people will look back and wonder how on earth we travelled so far down the plug hole that the radical Black Lives Matter lobby dragged us down, and why we didn’t just let black people lead their lives in quiet dignity instead."

ElephantOfRisk · 20/08/2021 21:27

Oh we've gone off piste have we? Who keeps bringing stuff into the conversation? Not quite sure why you think Black lives matter is part of this.

Do you just jump on any bandwagon?

Since you said please then i'll answer, no i'm not an antivaxer (you really do like to pigeonhole people don't you? You've accused me of all sorts of things on this thread but i'll not bite. I've had both vaccinations as have my family though young ones not due 2nd yet. Anti masker? No, I think if people want to carry on wearing them I don't have a problem with that. They don't do anything but people are scared and think they help so fine. I do object to being required to wear one though. A: because they don't do anything and B: because I was sexually abused and find it difficult to wear one for any length of time.

Hope this helps.

Whycangirlsbesonasty · 20/08/2021 21:28

I think people do look back I’m in utter horror at the way ethnic minorities were treated in the past. Ethnic minorities have a right to be treated equally to others. But trans women are not women and will never be women. They can never be treated equally to women as for that to happen women would have to give up their rights, and its grossly unfair fir us to be asked to do that.

TheGenealogist · 20/08/2021 21:45

@rightenough - massive round of applause. Could not agree more.

Schools should not be asking 4 year old Sebastian who wants to paint his fingernails and dress up as a mermaid whether he's sure he's not actually a girl and change Sebastian to Stephanie.

Schools should be hammering home the fact that "girl" and "boy" stereotypes about what toys to play with, clothes to wear, jobs to do are outdated. Giving kids the confidence to say that actually, they can be a girl who likes football, video games and wearing joggers and hoodies, and that they can be a boy who's into dancing and sparkles.

People cannot change sex.

That's not transphobic. If someone decides that actually, they're happier wearing clothes associated with the other sex, changing their name, and having a relationship with whoever, then they absolutely have the right to do that free of judgement, harassment and persecution. Live and let live, peace and love.

But you can believe all of that and still think that, for example, a transwoman has no place as head of a Rape Crisis centre. Or want to retain the right to ask for a female doctor to perform an intimate examination. Or send your daughter off to shared Uni accommodation to live with other women.

Woman = adult human female.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 22:15

Go and say that on Twitter @TheGenealogist - and you will be banned for hate speech. Express that opinion at work in a local authority or corporate work place and you will be disciplined.
Your views and those of @Whycangirlsbesonasty are out of step with the world. Alf Garnett springs to mind.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 22:17

Trans women are women. Accept that, because it's true.

visitingagain · 20/08/2021 22:20

I think @ElephantOfRisk we have met here before. I'm sorry that you can't wear a mask for such sad reasons and that's perfectly understandable. But masks do help and I will wear mine to protect you.

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