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Scotsnet

Welcome to Scotsnet - discuss all aspects of life in Scotland, including relocating, schools and local areas.

Thread 7 - No pitch forks or Pom Poms - Scottish political shenanigans

999 replies

TheShadowyFeminist · 06/04/2021 15:46

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forfucksakenett · 22/04/2021 08:15

I think they make the distinction because they want to. It's about self identification. It's not something being imposed on people which would, of course, be hugely problematic.

They feel English and they feel Scottish. I don't see the problem with that. As I've said I'm almost certain it's deliberate to show that the move for independence isn't motivated by tartan and romantic notions of William Wallace.

StarryEyeSurprise · 22/04/2021 08:40

There's also Welsh Scots for Yes and others from other countries. I'm not sure what the problem is- please can create groups and meets ups as they wish?

WouldBeGood · 22/04/2021 08:41

Poll today shows six point lead for No.

StarryEyeSurprise · 22/04/2021 08:43

*people

CirclesWithinCircles · 22/04/2021 09:46

@ScotlandUnited

My DD was telling me today that her friend, who I've known since a baby, is now a non-binary person called Pip.

I confess I laughed because knowing this child as well as I do, I'm 99% sure they are not non binary but saying they are for a laugh (they do have a habit of taking the pee out of people at times)

But under the new HCB my DD could report me for that couldn't she? Even though I have non-binary colleagues who I accept, work well with, and like.

No 9ne knows how strictly it will be enforced, but what the new legislation will do is to create a climate of mild fear, so that people will feel inhibited to speak in even their own homes, for fear of someone reporting them. The Law Society of Scotland opposed the legislation and did succeed in changing the wording from very draconian to slightly less draconian, but when the government is ignoring its own country's lawyers telling them their legislation is bad, thars really worrying.

I think that's very sinister and I cannot think of any reason why Scottish politicians consider it justifiable. It doesn't concern the greater public interest as with terrorism offences.

It really does show that minority groups hold far too much sway in influencing legislation in Scotland, and the lack of a second chamber to act as a check on Parliament. It's really concerning that Scotland is able to pass such legislation without a second revisary chamber being in place.

I always find it strange that in all the effort the Snp has put into independence, it has never formulated plans for a constitution protecting all citizens from human rights, or to become a signatory to the ECHR, or to create a proper bicameral parliament with a clear separation of powers.

I would have thought such matters would be at the forefront of independence discussions.

WouldBeGood · 22/04/2021 09:51

There is never any discussion about anything except getting away from evil Tory WM and the English.

SempreSuiGeneris · 22/04/2021 10:04

I don't think the Yes / No split has ever moved from 55:45. The only thing that changes is how many Don't Knows bother to elaborate that they actually mean No and how many Nos declare as Yes just for laughs.

Don't think it does either side any good when they amplify any slight movement in their favour. I'm on the No side but if you called and asked me today I'd say Yes just because my twitter feed is full of ignorant journalists and talking heads crowing.

WouldBeGood · 22/04/2021 10:08

I think the margins are too tight for a successful split.

annabelindajane · 22/04/2021 10:42

@StarryEyeSurprise

There's also Welsh Scots for Yes and others from other countries. I'm not sure what the problem is- please can create groups and meets ups as they wish?
Maybe we should just all rejoice in being British and living in one of the best countries in the world
SempreSuiGeneris · 22/04/2021 11:22

Wonder how English Scots for Yes feel about NS warning tourists up from England to avoid contaminating our hospitality. Hmm If I send DH down to my MiL will I have to rinse him in carbolic on his return to re- certify his communion with his fellow Scots.

Welsh and Irish Scots for Yes are not conflicted in the same way because they want double Indy for both identities.

riverrunning · 22/04/2021 12:16

It wasn't until I moved to Scotland that I had any consideration of being 'English' or different in anyway from anyone else due to that fact. I'd love to see us all moving away from identity politics but I suspect that's a forlorn hope as it seems to be on trend all over the world.

SempreSuiGeneris · 22/04/2021 12:36

Bit of a niche point on the latest Yes / No polling which I had forgotten about. Savanta / Comres came out a couple of days ago and admitted to a polling error affecting Dec, Jan and Feb. They presented the data as weighted when in fact it was unweighted. In all 3 months the impact was to lower the headline % for Yes by about 3 points. In Dec and Jan the impact straddled the 50% marker thus completely changing the narrative from Scotland is still No to Scotland is becoming Yes. (By Feb it was below 50% even with the artificial inflation).

Acres and acres of coverage and analysis and airtime was devoted to the pivot from No to Yes which turned out to be nothing but an illusion even if you give much credence to the science of polling in the first place.

Amply demonstrating my pp agreeing with Anas that Indyref is nothing but divisive distraction and equivocation atm.

SempreSuiGeneris · 22/04/2021 12:40

river I am somewhat of the eternal optimist. Feels to me like after a tinge more rose tinted narcissistic navel gazing perhaps the World is reaching a High Water Mark on all aspects of Identity. Hope so any way.

HigherOptions · 22/04/2021 12:46

WouldBeGood where was that screenshot report from that stated that loads of Glasgow Life venues are going to be permanently shut? I had heard about Maryhill Library moving out of its current building and Whiteinch Library closing but nothing else. I see The Times has an article about it but I can't find any other stories about it (I can't read that because it's behind a paywall).

Why isn't there an outcry about this? I've just been on the Glasgow Live site and it's not on there (but may be buried as it was 'yesterday's news').

I hope the media aren't deliberately keeping quiet about this because it might reflect badly on the SNP? If Glasgow is going to lose libraries and sports venues I'd like to know. It would be something I would definitely bring up if I ever get a canvasser at my door (that and the mess that the SQA is presiding over)

RedactedTaeFeck · 22/04/2021 12:49

@HigherOptions

WouldBeGood where was that screenshot report from that stated that loads of Glasgow Life venues are going to be permanently shut? I had heard about Maryhill Library moving out of its current building and Whiteinch Library closing but nothing else. I see The Times has an article about it but I can't find any other stories about it (I can't read that because it's behind a paywall).

Why isn't there an outcry about this? I've just been on the Glasgow Live site and it's not on there (but may be buried as it was 'yesterday's news').

I hope the media aren't deliberately keeping quiet about this because it might reflect badly on the SNP? If Glasgow is going to lose libraries and sports venues I'd like to know. It would be something I would definitely bring up if I ever get a canvasser at my door (that and the mess that the SQA is presiding over)

Not sure if it's the same article but here in the Sun:

www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/scottish-news/7002140/glasgow-libraries-sports-community-centres-closed-nicola-sturgeon/

StarryEyeSurprise · 22/04/2021 14:09

@SempreSuiGeneris

Wonder how English Scots for Yes feel about NS warning tourists up from England to avoid contaminating our hospitality. Hmm If I send DH down to my MiL will I have to rinse him in carbolic on his return to re- certify his communion with his fellow Scots.

Welsh and Irish Scots for Yes are not conflicted in the same way because they want double Indy for both identities.

Ha, I still have a lot of friends and family in Liverpool and they'd bite their own arm off for a chance to join Scotland and be independent from Westminster.
CirclesWithinCircles · 22/04/2021 14:23

Wouldn't it be nice to live in a country without constant polling and independence referendums? And why does Scotland have so much poverty and drugs problems, despite some of the most generous benefits in the world, its own government and extensive, free education until age 16/18?

I'm looking into finding a job outwith Scotland and moving away. Its purgatory.

WouldBeGood · 22/04/2021 14:29

@HigherOptions yes, it’s the same as the Sun one linked to above. I really don’t know why there’s not an outcry. It’s a total disgrace when they’re promising the world and free stuff in their manifesto.

Bytheloch · 22/04/2021 14:54

Ha, I still have a lot of friends and family in Liverpool and they'd bite their own arm off for a chance to join Scotland and be independent from Westminster.

They should could come for a holiday, enjoy some Scottish hospitality...oh, wait, perhaps not anytime soonConfused

Coquohvan · 22/04/2021 17:07

NO not Scotland St Museum! Kids love that place, surely not going to close.

HigherOptions · 22/04/2021 17:14

I'm really sad about the Scotland Street Museum too - such a loss. I will also miss the library in GOMA. I often used to duck in there when we went into the city to shop - there always seemed to be people in there?

It is utterly depressing that this doesn't seem to be deemed newsworthy. It stinks.

forfucksakenett · 22/04/2021 17:15

@riverrunning

It wasn't until I moved to Scotland that I had any consideration of being 'English' or different in anyway from anyone else due to that fact. I'd love to see us all moving away from identity politics but I suspect that's a forlorn hope as it seems to be on trend all over the world.
Of course this would be the case. England is the hegemonic force within the UK. Englishness is 'normal'.
forfucksakenett · 22/04/2021 17:31

@CirclesWithinCircles

Wouldn't it be nice to live in a country without constant polling and independence referendums? And why does Scotland have so much poverty and drugs problems, despite some of the most generous benefits in the world, its own government and extensive, free education until age 16/18?

I'm looking into finding a job outwith Scotland and moving away. Its purgatory.

There's a moving to England thread full of similar people.

It's a shame you feel like that of course but I hardly think having another referendum after the broken promises of the first one seven years ago is constant referendums.

forfucksakenett · 22/04/2021 17:31

@HigherOptions

I'm really sad about the Scotland Street Museum too - such a loss. I will also miss the library in GOMA. I often used to duck in there when we went into the city to shop - there always seemed to be people in there?

It is utterly depressing that this doesn't seem to be deemed newsworthy. It stinks.

Devastating! I actually think this is the kind of thing that will gain traction and while it may not be reported on today it will be soon.

Not on.

SempreSuiGeneris · 22/04/2021 17:32

Not sure your average Yorkshire, Lancastrian, Cornish, Brummie, Londoner (North or South or did you actually mean Essex or Kent) etc etc etc would agree with Englishness as an accepted catch all.