Tiers Of A Clown

[Bytheloch]

Thread #3456

Released from our dirty T4, but still bamboozled. Let’s keep each other sane on here...

@NotAnActualSheep we know she very effectively keeps dogs and cats away! People should be easy

Re the drugs deaths, Scotland records any death where drugs were in a person's system as a drugs death regardless of what caused their death. Other countries do not.
Portugal had one of the highest rates of drug deaths in Europe and now have one of the lowest. Public Heaith Scotland wish to implement the same strategies here and the SG have asked for the powers needed but WM have refused the request.

Sorry, I totally missed a page of thread... Yes it does sound so hard torvean. There doesn't seem to be much consideration at all given to people who live by themselves with friends and family in another country! Hope you get a good break.

Logic has definitely gone out of the window with the levels now. So frustrating... And yes, if health boards are being lumped together in terms of tiers, why not base travel restrictions on those same health boards.

I'd forgotten about the dog and cat thing!! Yes, people are a doddle compared to keeping a cat away from someone that needs a good sit on.

Re the drugs deaths, Scotland records any death where drugs were in a person's system as a drugs death regardless of what caused their death. Other countries do not.

A bit like the way they record Covid then? A death within 28 days of a positive test, whatever the cause?

So basically what you're saying is that the ScotGov are a bit shit at statistics. Which we already knew.

Why don't they just withdraw from recording any results and then the problem will be gone? Just like they withdrew us from international education monitoring.

Not really sure what powers you need from westminster to deal with a health/societal issue? Another excuse to do nothing and blame those horrid english people.

The travel restrictions are controlling. Sorry I am jumping out of nowhere to say that. I have not seen anyone except my DC for weeks and weeks. I was planning to meet a friend for coffee tomorrow and take a gift to a colleague who also lives alone (meeting outside) - but both are apparently illegal. I think I can argue meeting colleague is exercise as we planned to meet outside and it is less than five miles from my council boundary, but I don’t think there is any exception which meets having coffee with my friend in Costa outside my council area (both areas are tier 3). The fine is £30, right? I will pay it if needs be, but I think this is ridiculous. I have had long covid and I still have symptoms. So I don’t think this is a mild illness, but equally, I don’t see how locking people in council areas and them not being able to see friends in supposedly safe spaces or outside actually helps.

And I need to say, no, I do not think NS needs to be on screen every single day. The poster who said she is in a bit of a bubble with her almost normal working environment makes a valid point. She is not working on Zoom day in day out and not seeing anyone in real life and also looking after children.

@Liverpool9

Re the drugs deaths, Scotland records any death where drugs were in a person's system as a drugs death regardless of what caused their death. Other countries do not. Portugal had one of the highest rates of drug deaths in Europe and now have one of the lowest. Public Heaith Scotland wish to implement the same strategies here and the SG have asked for the powers needed but WM have refused the request.

What powers do they need that they don't already have?

@Liverpool9

Re the drugs deaths, Scotland records any death where drugs were in a person's system as a drugs death regardless of what caused their death. Other countries do not. Portugal had one of the highest rates of drug deaths in Europe and now have one of the lowest. Public Heaith Scotland wish to implement the same strategies here and the SG have asked for the powers needed but WM have refused the request.

Yes, but the graph on the BBC shows that numbers have more than doubled since 2015 (much more than doubled for benzodiazepines). So something is getting much worse since then, or the system for counting in Scotland changed then, which seems an odd thing to do.

Isn't public health devolved? What powers are needed for a public health measure that Scotland doesn't have? (not goading... I genuinely don't know).

(and going to get a glass of wine between typing and posting means everyone else has asked the same question!!)

Bit of a silly comment WaxOn and completely disregards the devastating impact drugs can have on families and communities.

It's reflective of the 'big picture' strategy that the SG want in place. This is similar to the very successful approach taken regarding violent crime- tackling the root of the problems causing people to end up committing crimes/ taking drugs as opposed to just giving out sentences (this resulted in violent crime being at a 40 year low in Scotland).
I've attended a drugs misuse conference in Portugal (with others from all over the world) but the UK Gov are refusing the SG the powers needed to take forward and replicate what Portugal have done.

Do you have any detail for this argument? Which powers exactly are they lacking? You haven't answered this question and have simply drawn a pick and mix comparison to Portugal and a conference you've been to?

What powers do they want @Liverpool9?

Bit of a silly comment WaxOn and completely disregards the devastating impact drugs can have on families and communities. Eh?

I think you need to be looking at NS and scotgov who seem to be disregarding the impact as they are the ones in a position to change things, not me. they are too busy pissing our money up the wall on named person, hate crime bills, dodgy ferry contracts, legal cases asa result of their lying etc etc. Money that could have been given to drug programmes, food banks, homeless agencies etc etc. So don't go pointing a finger at me.

Oh! didn't realise you'd attended a conference, i bow to your expertise then...

Cant do what you want so then the solution is to do fuckall? What exactly, and I mean exactly is the reason that she can't do what she wants? What power is it that is missing cos I'm at a loss...?

It looks to me like street diazepam being widespread here is what has changed, doesn't that come under crime?

@KatySun

The travel restrictions are controlling. Sorry I am jumping out of nowhere to say that. I have not seen anyone except my DC for weeks and weeks. I was planning to meet a friend for coffee tomorrow and take a gift to a colleague who also lives alone (meeting outside) - but both are apparently illegal. I think I can argue meeting colleague is exercise as we planned to meet outside and it is less than five miles from my council boundary, but I don’t think there is any exception which meets having coffee with my friend in Costa outside my council area (both areas are tier 3). The fine is £30, right? I will pay it if needs be, but I think this is ridiculous. I have had long covid and I still have symptoms. So I don’t think this is a mild illness, but equally, I don’t see how locking people in council areas and them not being able to see friends in supposedly safe spaces or outside actually helps.

And I need to say, no, I do not think NS needs to be on screen every single day. The poster who said she is in a bit of a bubble with her almost normal working environment makes a valid point. She is not working on Zoom day in day out and not seeing anyone in real life and also looking after children.

I agree katy. The travel thing is taking away freedom from our lives that I don't think is justified in the impact it will have on reducing spread. Especially when whether we can travel or not isn't based on case numbers/ hospital patients etc from our own area, but in the wider region. I think strictly speaking what you are proposing isn't allowed... but really, I don't think you'd be "lucky" to avoid a fine! Mental health benefits from meeting your friend would make it arguably essential. And you are combining the coffee with exercise which is allowed. I suppose if you see a policeman you could take your coffee and walk with it . I hope you recover soon.

That depends on whether it's the right kind of crime I suppose @anon444877, just like dying from anything other than covid is the wrong kind of death and therefore doesn't matter.

I follow our local police force and they do seem to have been spending resources on policing drug supply with lots of posts about successful busts.

It’s shame @Liverpool9 that NS did not stay to explain this difficulty to the SP this afternoon when it was debated.

I’d like to hear an explanation from her and her front bench team but they all left.

And hello @KatySun that all sounds so hard

And as a 'horrid English person' happily living in Scotland, your comment saddens me. This is an issue with the UK Government, not 'English people'.
I've worked in Public Health in both countries and whilst not perfect, Public Health Scotland are progressive and overall very good. Here, our hands are tied as drug abuse is a reserved area and despite asking explicitly to have the power to change the relevant laws, the UK Government have refused.
I am not 'blaming horrid English people' when I say that and neither are Public Health Scotland or the SG, it's just reality...

Thank you for your reply Notanactualsheep and the good wishes - my DD says I should just say my friend and I are discussing work - which is true to an extent, because it is practically all I have to talk about and she did advise me on a job I recently applied for (good advice as it turned out). I suppose I just cannot see the reasoning why it would be fine to meet someone in my own LA in a Costa two miles in one direction, and not in the next LA two miles in the other, if I travel in my own car there and back. The health board areas at least made sense.

Drug policy needs to focus on poverty, deprivation, poverty and education. Not just drug education, but good quality school education which enables aspiration and the ability to move away from the hopelessness.

Hello WouldbeGood - thanks

@WouldBeGood

It’s shame *@Liverpool9* that NS did not stay to explain this difficulty to the SP this afternoon when it was debated.

I’d like to hear an explanation from her and her front bench team but they all left.

This. Both NS and the Swinneybot didn’t stay to answer anything about the report 😒 #busysavinglives

However, she has, so far, been almost magically immune to the actual day to day impacts of the virus.

Sheep that's exactly how I feel. Shes still going to work, chatting with people face to face, she has no idea about the loneliness that people are facing on a day to day basis.

I have a sound marriage, we are both working from home. But we aren't seeing another sod. Other than kids and Christmas we have nothing to talk about.
I really really miss the general gibber of the office. I don't miss the big fancy nights out, but I really miss my work colleagues, family and friends.
My kids have hardly seen their cousins this year which for little kids is a really long time and when they build the bonds that will last them a lifetime.

I was really looking forward (but nervous) to seeing my Mum I'm not even sure that will happen 😢