Fears For Tiers

[Bytheloch]

Thread #567 Still here, getting through each day one 2M step away at a time. November into December 2020 here we go...

Made my own life easier and moved my holiday to next December. In the hope that next year they have it all sorted and I can enjoy the sunshine without worrying about all the rules first.

Someone of FB posted that police in Stirling were stopping folk and handing out £200 fines

It's stuff like this that people will suck up and get the fear from. A: The fines are meant to be £30 and B: You'd either have to be pretty thick not to come up with a reasonable excuse. Or C: the police and/or the person were being complete dicks or D: the fine was for something else and they got a warning.

My manager is off to Tenerife for a week - how can that be happening with travel restrictions? She has to have a covid test before she goes. The flight hasn't been cancelled so she won't get money back if she doesn't go but I was surprised she can still go - also the test is gonna cost her £150 (on top of her holiday - what if it's positive!)

@bbconeandtwo also depends where she is flying from

@BBCONEANDTWO you're allowed to travel abroad if you're in Tier 1&2.
To be fair if everyone else has had their covid tests, then she's probably less likely to catch it there than Scotland, provided she avoids the hoards of Tier 3/4 covid ridden zombies at the airport plane spotting -oh look what's that bright shiny thing in the sky, I used to travel in one of those - or getting covid tested. Actually I'd probably want to avoid the people getting covid tested myself.

The pre test is such a worry though, it would strip out any anticipation. Imagine if you were asymptomatic and tested positive, not only would you not get your nice shiny holiday, you'd need to self isolate for a fortnight.

Well she's flying from Glasgow which is in Tier 4 but yes if she tests positive she won't be able to go.

rookie it's worrying the restrictions are not being questioned in parliament. Makes me feel kind of powerless about it all.

More transparency would be a start, but an attempt to have the underlying data published was voted down.

Actually depending on who she's booked with she may we'll get her money back if she's positive - a lot of the holiday and insurance companies have somewhat responded to the covid risks now.

Of course east Dunbartonshire is closely linked with Glasgow as is Renfrewshire, East Ren, west Dunbartonshire...

Whoops posted before making my point!

As we are so linked the rules make no sense. My neighbours are a teacher in a school in Renfrewshire and a doctor in Glasgow. Fine for them to travel back and forward for work, but they are breaking the law by taking their kids to Pollok park?

There is NO sense in it. Where were all the cases caused by people "flocking" to Troon and Loch Lomond in the summer? Oh wait, didn't happen.

RaspberryCoulis
That's the biggest issue with the central belt, it is so interlinked, people live in one area work in others.
They even recognise it for nursery funding there are about 7 West of Scotland councils that meet to agree what funding they'd offer to each others kids, ie the 1120 hours, or the minimum 600 I think one said they were offering 900.

There was plenty traffic on the roads but the buses that passed me as DD and I were on our walk were all empty, whereas they'd normally be pretty busy with people heading into town or to shopping centres.

@RaspberryCoulis

Whoops posted before making my point!

As we are so linked the rules make no sense. My neighbours are a teacher in a school in Renfrewshire and a doctor in Glasgow. Fine for them to travel back and forward for work, but they are breaking the law by taking their kids to Pollok park?

There is NO sense in it. Where were all the cases caused by people "flocking" to Troon and Loch Lomond in the summer? Oh wait, didn't happen.

I think the idea of that is that it'll minimise numbers in certain areas, rather than taking covid from one tier 4 area to another. I was in Pollok Park a few weeks ago and it was ridiculously busy. So if everyone stays vaguely to their own area hopefully that can be avoided.

Are you really that likely to get COVID in Pollok Park though? We were there loads in summer when it was busy. Still plenty of space.

From my observations the rules do in fact force people to congregate in the shops/parks/whatever is open.

I’m wondering, if Edinburgh’s cases continue to fall despite restaurants and gyms being open, do you think the SG might reconsider their position on them?

@ICouldHaveCheckedFirst

rookie it's worrying the restrictions are not being questioned in parliament. Makes me feel kind of powerless about it all.

More transparency would be a start, but an attempt to have the underlying data published was voted down.

That is disturbing @ICouldHaveCheckedFirst.

Why won’t they publish it?

Pollok Park is massive but all the best bits are a bit waterlogged atm and the playpark is a bit rundown (not helped by them having removed half of all the balance based swings due to Covid security ). Car parking is an issue and set to get worse if council proposals progress. Be careful not to run down the squirrel who likes to play chicken.

DDs and I never used to get beyond the Burrell and the Stables. They are both out of operation atm so we have now discovered the secret duck pond with the fattest ducks on the planet, the market garden and scarecrow, abandoned ship raised beds, the fairy village complete with dragon and the "ancient" fort settlements.

Cannot wait for an unrestricted slap up lunch in Pollok House.

wouldbegood cases in Glasgow have been falling steadily for over 2 weeks with gyms etc open but that didn't save it from tier 4.

@Dinnafashyersel I was just clutching at straws.

Feeling bit fed up.

I’d feel better if they showed us clear data that justifies the choices.

I’d actually really love to be in charge of all this. Not as a politician who needs to curry favour though. But as someone who’s job is to make the best possible decisions for the population based firmly on evidence that on the balance of probabilities any restrictions are necessary, effective, and proportionate.

That's the problem though. "Balance of probabilities" and taking "unintended harms" into account has been replaced by the "precautionary principle" with regards to Covid-19 alone. This is not the fault of the Scottish or UK Govt. The whole International community has got all the various politicians boxed in.

Can only hope the vaccines and the US inauguration change the narrative.

Similarly perplexed but only keeping sane by not trying to rationalise the decisions based on the data.

I fear I lost sane some time ago. It’s all so nuts 🤷🏻‍♀️

Just got to pray it ends after the three weeks.

One further chink of light. New data out of China from their mass testing of 10m. They picked up over 1,000 asymptomatic PCR positives. They did not pick up onward transmission from any of them.

Sorry, just fact checked myself. 300 asymptomatics with over 1,000 close contacts traced.
www.nature.com/articles/s41467-020-19802-w

Final thought. Banning 500k Glasgow residents from the wider countryside and closing down most of Buchanan Street is probably not the best approach to keeping them out of Pollok Park.

The residents of all the surrounding "Shires" have acres and acres of braes and countryside on their doorsteps. With all the amenities within Pollok closed can't imagine many would make a special trip into the City who weren't local.

@Dinnafashyersel as luck would have it I’m in Pollok Park right now and can confirm that it’s pretty bloody busy, even when it’s been grotty today.

And we were just as Tesco in Silverburn and it is rammed. Close all the other shops in Silverburn and obviously that’s what you get, people with trolleys full of toys.