October Becomes November Lockdown

[BlueThursday]

New thread

I suspect this will be the second of many

I work from home anyway, have done for over a decade. DH is enjoying not having to commute though, especially over winter where the drive can be hairy. He's been told he won't be back in the office until at least April 2021, and after that probably on a 3 day at home, 2 day in the office split.

It's saving us a fortune in petrol!

@OOAOML I loathe it! I have lots of strategies to avoid that as well as hugs from randoms 😃

@WouldBeGood I tend to fall back on ‘I’ve just put hand cream on’ and thankfully rarely have to fend off random hugs which would completely freak me out.

I have realised how little my office suits introverts although I know several people there are extroverts and this will be really hard for them (although it good for me not having to put up with the noise).

I'm not really saving anything, the little petrol I'm saving is overshadowed by higher electricity and gas bills. I work in an office that is out of town so don't spend much on lunch, an occasional pound on a soup as otherwise bring my own.

I can't get rid of a car either as I need it if I'm in the office even though its not too far, there is no public transport and too long to walk.

DS has a car too for getting to the station for uni but that's not happening either so we have the expenses of running 3 cars but really could manage with 2 or even 1.

I just wish permanent decisions would be made.

I don't do hugs but don't mind handshakes. I'm a tall woman and standing up to shake a hand can sometimes be intimidating for people and sometimes that's really useful....

I've wfh for years and there are some downsides even if you generally like it, it's nice if the crisis makes it more feasible and reduces the need for office space but some time out of the house is good for most people! I certainly found it helped relationships to be in the same physical place for at least a small percentage of the time.

I used to go out to do branch inspections with my 6 foot 4 male colleague and me over 6 foot in heels. I think it's a shame now, but the reaction we'd get arriving suited and booted used to make us laugh.

They were usually OK once they realised we were generally smiley and friendly but we did play up the entrance for the lols.

Latest from Swinney - students might not be allowed home at Christmas and halloween sweeties could be purveyors of coronavirus.

Happy holidays!

I certainly wouldn't want to reach my hand into a bowl of sweeties on a doorstep but my view is coloured by seeing how people behave in the streets here (maintaining usual levels of skank).

I think they're going to have to let the students home but stagger travel and advise on how much they mix after. If I was on a course that was being taught online I don't know if I'd go back though.

Wish they would get off with all the things we are allowed or not allowed. It's not legally enforceable to restrict the movements of individuals in this country - yet - The police are able to police only because of the consent of society and cannot operate in any other fashion.

I'm generally a compliant person but they can get to feck with this continued pish, like they are my dad and it's their house and their rules. Think i've just been sent to my room.

The public are asking "why" and being told "just becasue..."

We are not being given the appropriate information at the appropriate time or allowed to risk rate and behave like individuals.

I do wish as well Jason Leitch in particular would take some note of basic human psychology. Telling us now that we likely won't have Christmas oh and btw your student DCs won't be allowed to come home, well it pushes generally law abiding people over the edge.

We already have stricter restrictions than England, and they must know there is a balance between compliance and restriction fatigue.

If I had a student aged DC they'd be coming home regardless- unless they got booted off their course for doing so, in which case there is a potentially illegal rule to challenge.

They don't need to make enemies of us, they need to appeal rather than dictate. Or if they are going to dictate they need the legislation to support it.

@WaxOnFeckOff

The public are asking "why" and being told "just becasue..."

We are not being given the appropriate information at the appropriate time or allowed to risk rate and behave like individuals.

This is what gets me most of all.

It’s so annoying to be continually treated as a giant baby.

It’s also annoying that they’ve acknowledged once again that the spread is more in residences, so why tf is hospitality closed?

NB I think that the SNP; the Tories; Welsh Labour and the DUP are all doing terrible jobs, just on the interests of political balance 😃

@WouldBeGood

It’s also annoying that they’ve acknowledged once again that the spread is more in residences, so why tf is hospitality closed?

NB I think that the SNP; the Tories; Welsh Labour and the DUP are all doing terrible jobs, just on the interests of political balance 😃

I agree but only one group is being defended to the hilt by their supporters about how much better they are doing and how much more competent they are than anyone else.

My guess is that young people, being the target market and all, will be "allowed" home at the last minute and other many other constraints, just to show how how lovely they are when the reality is that most folk wont give a shit and will end up breaking all of that. What they could do is say that they can return home but should isolate in their own home for a week before seeing any other households which would probably get a reasonable degree of compliance. I'd add that this is also a pile of pish, but is what I would do if I was them. If I was me, i'd do something else... :o

I think restriction fatigue is becoming a big issue. To begin with it seemed like everyone I knew was basically following the rules and any transgressions were pretty minor - people having a chat outdoors on walks for example. That seems to me to have changed now, with large numbers going "ffs" and stretching or just plain ignoring the rules.

What I don't get is they knew this. They knew they'd get one good shot at lockdown with high compliance then this would happen. They needed to use that time wisely - building up the NHS, the temp hospitals, ventilator and drug supplies, training people in new specialisms to be able to support covid patients, doing mass entry level recruitment and training of auxiliaries, cleaners, admin etc so that clinical staff could be focused solely on the clinical side. Building testing capacity and a system that worked. Track and trace that works, quickly and reliably. Networks to support the vulnerable. Sorting out care homes properly - specialist teams should have been going in to every home to create tailored plans taking in to consideration the premises, staffing, patient/resident needs and so on.

It doesn't seem like they did much of that at all, at least not well. So now they're trying lockdown lite, and people aren't complying anymore.

This is not an snp bash - seems like it's been blown across the country

They definitely need to address the isolation length. Asking students or families to self isolate for 7 days is a lot more achievable for many than 14 days, and I believe catches the vast majority of cases.

But I can perfectly envisage a situation where it is reduced in England but not here as I believe it's a health decision so could be made independently.

I agree. You can say “just because” for a while but people are querying numbers and facts. It’s not enough to say “scientists are much cleverer”.

I don’t really know anyone fully complying. It’s too much, too long and people don’t trust the numbers

I completely agree.

We all complied at the beginning of the year with the faith that the powers that be would do SOMETHING by the time we were out of it.

In my opinion they haven’t. I’m not talking vaccine as clearly that would be miles off but decent tracking and tracing

And yet, she is riding high...

@Arkadia I’m not so sure. I think polls are difficult as it’s hard to speak out in Scotland without hassle, like the referendum came as a surprise result.

Anecdotally even my arch SNP supporting Facebook people have been very quiet. And DP was a staunch supporter but is totally sick of them now.

I suppose it depends on questions too: eg “Do you support restrictions to save lives?” Hard to say no without sounding evil 😂

I think that may be largely because she comes across well, and much better than Johnson. She seems to be communicating clearly- even if the rules make little sense

The self isolation length and also the repeated isolation even if you have definitely had covid are both issues. I agree that 7 days plus a negative test, for example, would be more palatable. Does anyone have the stats on % who test negative after that length of time but then develop it? Similarly I could understand the position on risk of repeat infection initially but unless I've missed it we are now nearly a year in to this virus and I've only read about a handful of repeat infectiona which suggests a reasonable level of immunity is conferred in most people. Yet we have a situation where someone could get it, self isolate, return to work, then get identified by track and trace days or weeks later as a contact of someone infected and have to self isolate again. People aren't going to do that.

Anecdotally even my arch SNP supporting Facebook people have been very quiet. And DP was a staunch supporter but is totally sick of them now.

Actually now you say that that might be true, but then I tend to keep snoozing them when I get fed up so they may all be snoozed at the moment...

Does anyone have the stats on % who test negative after that length of time but then develop it?

No, but we do know that a werther's original is akin to a covid hand grenade

Totally agree with the last few comments! (And that's not like me at all). We are being treated like children who can't be trusted... I was "fine" with the lockdown in March (well, not fine, but accepting) as so little was known about the virus. It bought us some time to get a bit more knowledge, "flatten the curve" and do all the things statistically says. But they didn't. So now we have the threat of lockdown, and crazily stringent restrictions for the foreseeable future, and no apology that it's because they cocked up and didn't increase NHS capacity etc while they had time (instead focusing on "elimination"). But because we're meeting in homes, or flocking to cafes (because they are the only places open) or taking up university places, or passing virus purveying sweeties to each other ( covid hand grenade )

The briefing today specifically said the isolation period won't be reduced to 7 days in Scotland. Which to me seems like a much more "tolerable" period that may well increase compliance even if a few people do come down with symptoms after that period. Scotland prefers to stick to the full 14day period that only 10% of people do properly and then blame us that the virus keeps spreading. It just seems that they have lost the ability to be pragmatic and accept that the perfect can be the enemy of the good.

The big fright of Halloween agree all the politicians around the UK are making a dog's dinner of this.