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Welcome to Scotsnet - discuss all aspects of life in Scotland, including relocating, schools and local areas.

Margaret Ferrier

333 replies

sonicbook · 01/10/2020 18:46

Speechless and disgusted. Is it thoughtlessness? Arrogance? Panic?

I actually don't think resignation would be good enough. She needs sacked and charged.

OP posts:
BrazenlyDefying · 04/10/2020 09:57

@Scotslassie1

Both individuals are as bad as each other. What's galling ( still) is the the UK Government's response to lie for him.

She can have Scottish, English and Welsh apps on her phone and turn on/ off as she moves into a new country. Hardly an example of ' how dumb devolution is'.

No.

Ferrier is worse. Way worse. Because Cummings by breaking the lockdown put his immediate relatives he was travelling to see at risk, and no-one else. He never had a positive test. He was outside, 2 weeks after feeling better before being with other people, which we all know is ecxeptionally low risk.

Ferrier KNEW she'd had a test. She KNEW the rules that if you suspect you have had a test, you isolate util you get the result. There's no wriggle room in that for childcare, or essential travel, you stay the fuck at home. You dont fuck off to London on a train. Then when you get a positive result, you then get on another enclosed tube of metal with loads of other people who you don't know??

Why are the nats trying to dredge up the Cummings stuff? It's not relevant. It's not a "who's most stupid" top trumps, because if it were, Ferrier would win hands down. What Boris and Gove said or did in April is totally irrelevant to this situation in the here and now.

She needs to go. She needs to go NOW. She should have the common fucking decency to hand her notice in and apologise to her constituents and everyone on those trains. But it's pretty clear that she has no intentions of doing either.

Odious, selfish and utterly contemptable woman.

NotAnActualSheep · 04/10/2020 10:13

[quote NatashaAlianovaRomanova]@NotAnActualSheep

This was my mums constituency & it's highly likely it was a combination of both. It's not a very diverse area, with a higher than average acceptance of low level racism, bigotry etc as a hangover from the past but also has a high number of people in the YES camp.

As for Margaret Ferrier she needs to resign.[/quote]
Thanks! Yes, I was upset but not especially surprised he won given the feeling around Scotland at the time. Which is a pity, as the MP he took the seat from was by all accounts very good and hard working...and not suspended by her party. I hadn't realised he'd been readmitted though, until I looked him up to remember his name! They kept that quiet...

Slightlybrwnbanana · 04/10/2020 12:02

They are all relevant - Calderwood, Cummings, the one who visited his lover? And Ferrier. I don't need to forget about one when another occurs.

honigbutter · 04/10/2020 12:15

We don't forget, but we don't all agree with the implication that Margaret Ferrier is no worse than the others.

As for the PP who referred to her as Margaret ....

ancientgran · 04/10/2020 12:21

@chrislilleyswig you said Come on. Of course he did less. She returned in public transport knowing she had tested positive.

Do you really think the two are comparable?

Seems quite clear to me that you were correcting me and saying he did less, I never said he didn't do less. You asked if I think the two are comparable, both broke the rules but hers was more dangerous and therefore more serious.

throwingawaymyshot · 04/10/2020 12:24

She won't quit. She won't get another job in this climate and presumably she has bills to pay. She will sit as an independent MP. She doesn't seem to have much to lose now does she? Very stupid woman though.

Horehound · 04/10/2020 12:24

Hasn't she resigned yet?
Can she not be sacked?!

Slightlybrwnbanana · 04/10/2020 12:27

Brazen, I do not agree that DC endangered no one else. He did not know whether he would have to stop the car on that drive (I don't believe he didn't tbh, with a small child on board) and he made further unnecessary journeys when he had arrived. He did not know there would be no breakdown or accident involving close contact with others. And he had no right endangering his own family either - where any of the rest of us allowed to decide to visit family at that point? He was a selfish twat who thought rules don't apply to him and so was MF - with the addition of exposing a whole load of unwitting commuters to her illness.

Fridgeandkitchen · 04/10/2020 12:30

She cannot be sacked. Nicola S doesn’t have that power.

BrazenlyDefying · 04/10/2020 12:35

To be fair to Sturgeon, nobody has the power to sack a MP. It's quite right that the leader of the party can't - you can easily see it's dangerous to allow the PM to sack all the people who don't agree with him and replace them with clones. And

It's really hard to get rid of an elected MP unless they either step down, or commit a crime and however many of their electorate sign a petition. Perhaps Ms Ferrier are waiting to see whether she's prosecuted by the Met, Police Scotland, or both. Hmm

She might be a loyal nationalist but by refusing to go she is causing no end of damage to her cause. Nicola Sturgeon can be as cross and stamp her feet as much as she likes but if Ferrier has the brass neck to stay in position, there's nothing Sturgeon can do about it. Just shows what kind of woman Ferrier really is, doesn't it?

BrazenlyDefying · 04/10/2020 12:36

That's fine, @Slightlybrwnbanana, you continue with your mental gymnastics trying to convince yourself that the nasty Tory Cummings is every bit as bad as nationalist heroine Ms Ferrier. Hmm

Slightlybrwnbanana · 04/10/2020 12:40

I don't think you can read very well? I have said she risked more people. She should resign and be prosecuted and it's a disgrace she hasn't.But what I thought of Cummings hasn't changed since it happened - he was a dangerous piece of work long before that though. I don't think being a "Nat" is the only reason to dislike Cummings, or any other Tory? But you have come on with an agenda, so no point arguing.

BrazenlyDefying · 04/10/2020 12:42

I can read perfectly well, thank you very much Grin

And it's also very clear that you have an agenda too, with your blatant whataboutery.

Jodri · 04/10/2020 12:51

Whether you agree or not Margaret Ferrier as a MP was elected by the people and so is answerable to the electorate; Dominic Cummings was not. Unfortunately for her (and the folk she exposed herself to) what she has done has now broken the law and she committed illegal acts, I don’t think that was law when DC has a jaunt up to Barnard Castle but I could be wrong.

I’ve just read that 5 welders from Doncaster have been jailed for two months for going to Tesco to buy lunch rather than straight to their isolation accommodation when arriving at port on the Isle of Man, so perhaps there is precedent for a custodial sentence; it would send out a very strong message to the people that not all publicly elected people (who ultimately are answerable to us) believe the ‘ Do as I say, not as I do’.
If Nicola sturgeon actually pushes for this, then I’d be more inclined to believe what she says and not think she just good at sound bites and has good presentation skills.

ancientgran · 04/10/2020 12:55

She cannot be sacked. Nicola S doesn’t have that power. Very true. Could Johnson have sacked Cummings? I'm not sure who actually employs him.

BrazenlyDefying · 04/10/2020 13:12

Who knows who his employer is. Unlikely to be BoJo directly. Probably the Conservative Party as a whole. And BoJo had his own health issues to deal with when that all blew up.

WaxOnFeckOff · 04/10/2020 13:14

I'm torn here. I'm going to try to take party politics out of it.

Whilst I don't agree with the catastrophising about this having caused people to die, they were probably at equal risk just by being on a train and whatever transport they took to get to the station. She was an elected MP meant to be upholding the rules, regulations and laws that she helped put in place. That's whether or not I agree with them or her politics.

I think it is up to the people who elected her to get rid of her but there should be an easier way for them to express that especially with the restrictions in place.

It's pointless to compare what happened with cummings. If I stab someone, it doesn't mean i get different treatment because someone else hit someone with a hammer. Each situation needs to be looked at in the circumstances and rules/laws that were in place at the time of the event. I'm not a tory or cummings fan but the police looked at it and decided there wasn't a crime I think? They are currently looking at what MF has done and will take it from there.

I absolutely believe she should go but I also think that there is a crossparty need to look at the rules and regulations around removing people unfit for office.

NotAnActualSheep · 04/10/2020 16:23

@WaxOnFeckOff

I'm torn here. I'm going to try to take party politics out of it.

Whilst I don't agree with the catastrophising about this having caused people to die, they were probably at equal risk just by being on a train and whatever transport they took to get to the station. She was an elected MP meant to be upholding the rules, regulations and laws that she helped put in place. That's whether or not I agree with them or her politics.

I think it is up to the people who elected her to get rid of her but there should be an easier way for them to express that especially with the restrictions in place.

It's pointless to compare what happened with cummings. If I stab someone, it doesn't mean i get different treatment because someone else hit someone with a hammer. Each situation needs to be looked at in the circumstances and rules/laws that were in place at the time of the event. I'm not a tory or cummings fan but the police looked at it and decided there wasn't a crime I think? They are currently looking at what MF has done and will take it from there.

I absolutely believe she should go but I also think that there is a crossparty need to look at the rules and regulations around removing people unfit for office.

Yes -this. She won't have been the only person with symptoms on the train. She may not have been the only person knowingly travelling when positive. And even then, the vast majority of people on the train with them will be absolutely fine, even sitting in the same carriage. Even if they weren't wearing masks or whatever. And she may well have done what she could to avoid others being infected. I hope she did.

But her actions do, in my opinion make her unfit for office. And that's ignoring the web she was weaving to try to make people believe she was fine and dandy. It sounds like she lied to her party as to why she was leaving London, delayed telling anyone she was positive, didn't make it clear in the first place when she had tested and her movements thereafter (sounds like the SNP initially thought she had tested after getting back to Glasgow), and hasn't offered any justification as to why she did what she did. Nicola S didn't get to hear about it until Thursday lunchtime, when MF found out about the positive test on Monday (though that could be the fault of the SNP team at westminster?). That isn't good, honest conduct of someone who did what she thought was right for her constituents.

I'm on the fence about making it easier to remove elected MPs. There is a process, and I don't think it would be difficult to get 8,000 constituent signatures to recall her assuming that is trigged (though not sure electronic voting is allowed...deffo should be in a pandemic...or some form of postal signing. Cant be bothered to look up the actual process Grin ). She referred herself to the standards committee - but if she isn't censured by them in a nature sufficient to allow that, I agree there should be a reform. Hope it is an open and transparent review and not a committee designed to protect Their Own. But it shouldn't be up to the electorate to start their own petition based on what they think she should/ shouldn't have done - or it could get a bit vigilante...with people recalling an MP just because they don't like the way they voted, or the party they belong to. Which would be problematic in a democracy - especially if it was a close run seat.

Apparently there have only been 3 recall petitions since 2015 when the act was introduced - one under each of the 3 triggers...so there's not a lot to go on. The previous person to be suspended from the House for 30 days by the standards committee was this chap for not declaring hospitality paid for by a foreign government. This is the process (but it may be different in NI). MFs transgression, and attempt to cover it up seems just as bad as this, I'd have thought.

Bourdic · 04/10/2020 19:51

DC is a SPAD - a special type of civil servant funded by us the tax payer appointed and sackable by BJ.

Bourdic · 04/10/2020 19:53

Re getting rid of MPs - we have to remember that hard cases make bad laws. A knee jerk reaction to a really egregious case could open the door to ‘troublesome’ MPs being ousted for reasons that were really nothing to do with being a poor MP

Bourdic · 04/10/2020 19:55

I feel really strongly about MPs being able to earn huge money outside of Parliament and would start there actually with reforms

RepeatSwan · 04/10/2020 19:59

@Bourdic

Re getting rid of MPs - we have to remember that hard cases make bad laws. A knee jerk reaction to a really egregious case could open the door to ‘troublesome’ MPs being ousted for reasons that were really nothing to do with being a poor MP
Can do a recall petition anyway, that is sufficient. It would be insane to be able to get rid of MPs at will.

Democracy has to be governed by process. We can't do things just because the mob is cross.

Bourdic · 04/10/2020 20:13

I agree Repeat I think the Recall Act was well overdue but is good enough. You simply cannot legislate for people like MF.

OllyBJolly · 04/10/2020 21:31

Margaret Ferrier may be quite ill and unable to respond at the moment - I don't know. I think she'll stand down shortly.

I do know that when she lost her seat she worked so bloody hard to regain it and she has thrown it away by doing something so unbelievably stupid. I don't condone what she has done but I do hope she is getting some support on a personal level.

She does have to go- and she will.

BrazenlyDefying · 04/10/2020 22:28

Margaret Ferrier may be quite ill and unable to respond at the moment - I don't know. I think she'll stand down shortly.

Possibly. But in that case you get a minion - an office manager, a constituency manager, whoever - to issue a quick statement. You don't just hunker down under the duvet and hope it all goes away.

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