Scottish Exam Results 2020

[Lidlfix]

After hearing DD3's deep sigh and worried voice observe "this time in four weeks..." I feel it's acceptable to begin the 2020 thread.

Over the years Scotsnet regulars and visitors have given great support, advice and even (tales of blissfully unaware snoring DC) light hearted relief to each other over the years.

This year has been particularly fearful for us and our DC and I know how much I have appreciated results threads in previous years. As there are plenty of threads with political discussions and chances for posters to express concerns about what politicians/councils/ schools/ teachers are or aren't doing, can I gently ask that we keep this to topic?

I have DD3 waiting on 1 AH and 2 Highers for a conditional offer and DD4 waiting on 5 Highers - results depending she'd like to apply for Law for the end of S6.

@jodri- the article didn’t say- SG probably haven’t thought that far ahead 😟

Thanks @Wbeezer, academically flying, still struggling socially. Hope all is in better shape with DS3.

@Wbeezer these were accountancy/management/ consultancy firms.
I remember being told this at an Andersen consultancy (now Accenture) seminar while at university 20+ years ago.
Unfortunately I can understand sifting out candidates depending on higher English grade. With some roles having so many applicants there has to be a fair and objective way to bring the numbers of candidates down to a manageable size.
I think this is better than a fire brigade in Scotland who in the past would get so many applications that they would go through the pile blindly yes, no, yes, no... Just to bring the pile down to a manageable size and then they would look at and read the application.

Jodie but that's not fair or objective and is little better than the fire brigade to be honest. I know they have to do something though. I used to recruit for office trainees and would weed out anyone who want out anything in the big open section for further info or essentially why they want the job. You'd get hundreds for just a few posts. Seems bizarre though for accountancy etc to ignore what could be better quality candidates in that field for ones with higher English.

@WaxOnFeckOff he is fine and on his best behaviour but my mental equilibrium has gone to pot and trust is going to be a long term issue, not fun and outcome likely to be uncertain for quite a while.

I would argue that english is still vitally important for STEM and clinical degrees. The amount of reports, presentations, scientific papers, interpretation of results and what that actually means, writing grant proposals, securing funding for research and communicating with clients and patients are crucial. The evidence for this is when things don’t go well and communication is often at the root of this.

I would add that these skills do not just magically appear with a higher in English (many people have these without the qualification) but it is one way of quantifying it.

Many pupils picking Higher options don't pick English as it's not required for their degree pathways that History or RMPS etc is evidence of writing skills at that level.

That's my DS - he is looking at science degrees where all that's required is a Nat 5 English at B. He got that last year and decided not to do the Higher as he hated English so much. He does have History instead though.

But in "my day" absolutely everyone did English, Maths and three other subjects. Everyone. That has changed a lot though and it's really not standard any more. DD is thinking of a career in Primary teaching and won't be asked for Higher Maths, just a sound A or B pass at Nat 5.

Yes, the students I know have History Highers. History is a very analytical subject at this level and above I would argue just as suitable.

My point was that there has to be an objective way to whittle down candidates in a competitive field to manageable numbers to enable applications to be considered fully.

In my field, where written and verbal communication skills are key, it would be extremely surprising for an applicant not to have a pass in Higher English and so sifting by reference to the quality of that pass is objective and fair.

I expect that may be different in STEM occupations but I imagine different objective tests will apply there too.

Recruiters simply don’t have time to consider every application for a graduate role.

@Lidlfix I know that a number of pupils at my DD’s school who are going on to study various degrees (on an unconditional basis) resat English this year to upgrade their B passes. I also know of others who are going to study law without an A. It may be a differentiator when it comes to applying for graduate roles in different sectors but who knows where we will be at that point, particularly if we have another year like this one.

I'm back at work so not keeping up.

School phoned on Monday and got dh. They asked if we felt we should appeal ds's B. We were like nah it's ok. It turns out he had applied to UCAS as per the school making them do it 🤷🏻‍♀️ but he wants to do college.

Family member is now ranting about how her child's grades won't change as it was the school who marked him unfairly 🤦🏻‍♀️

Lots of companies do their own basic (maths/english) tests relevant for the job to sift. Better these than looking back 5 years to a H English or worrying that 2020 results are over inflated. With applicants from rUK, Europe and beyond with so many different qualifications then its the only way for us.

Sometimes it can be a bit random whether you get thru screening procedures for an entry level jobs. DD had a waitressing work trial and got the job only to find out later that she'd been chosen over other equally suitable candidates because they liked her hair braids!

Just popping in for my tuppence worth......

In England, very few with STEM degrees would have A Level English. They will all have maths, further, maths, and one of two sciences.

My son will be choosing his Highers soon. He is certain he wants to study computer science at university (spends all his available time coding, etc so he's unlikely to change his mind). He's very committed.

He is intending to take Highers in fifth year in maths, applications in maths, physics, chemistry, geography and music. These are the subjects he most enjoys and does really well in.

So no English. Is this going to be a problem going forward? His music is an additional higher but is an easy option as he's grade 8 in two instruments.

My view was that an A at Nat 5 more than demonstrated the ability to write and understand coherently and DSs mental health was impacted on subjects where he felt he would need to speak out with opinions and views so it was best to drop it. He thought about picking it up at higher in 6th year but as he didn't need it for his chsen Uni applications and in the end had 4 unconditionals for uni, he didn't bother.

I agree there are some IT jobs where higher levels of English might be used but those skills are not necessarily only demonstrated by Higher English and there are plenty of IT jobs where that really isn't a consideration. I suspect my DS will be one of those that sit developing and analysing code rather than project managing or doing business proposals but who knows, maybe it was a mistake. He wanted to keep wide range of science/engineering/maths type of subjects as he wasn't sure specifically whether he'd go for engineering or CS or a mix.

Re Law - dd in 3rd year and where she is H English was/is a requirement so I'd suggest looking carefully at the entry requirement at each place she might apply to.
I'd agree that History, Modern Studies and RMPS are all solid "essay " type subjects and I think ( purely subjective opinion) that it is good for all students to try to retain a bit of balance.
Re the point about university students advancing to the next stage without robust exams this year - in dd's institution (which would be regarded as fairly high tariff/reputable) this only happened with first year undergrads and some second years. All final year students and students from any year studying accredited degrees leading to a professional qualification were examined.

@Lidl Just spoken to dd who says yes H English is useful and upgrading might be worthwhile. Her conditional was based on a B at AH English and she was advised that H Philosophy would be useful - she did do this in S5.

Agree English is generally a requirement for Law but definitely not for Accountancy. I am a Chartered Accountant with a Law Degree. This in itself makes me a rarity. I trained in England and most English Accountants have STEM degrees and therefore had no room for English in their A Levels.

Also agree with pp about English and Maths aptitude tests for graduates. They were introduced over 30 years ago. For the Big 4 accountants they are now the front end primary sift. They are not to be mistaken for a low "just to make sure" hurdle - I know Maths graduates who found the "Maths" challenging as it is actually more arithmetical competence than Maths they are looking for.

Student teachers out on placement 2 (so still had that one to pass and placement 3 to undertake) if they had passed all observed lessons and Uni academic work were automatically passed for their Provisional Registration so not all subjects for professional qualifications were examined. Maybe to prevent a teacher shortfall but the lecturer' and mentoring teachers judgements were accepted with no question.

DS1 in 2nd year uni didn't sit any exams but his subject (CS) has regular class testing and he sits over 90% in everything and actually is going into 3rd year having never sat an exam at Uni yet as his results have meant he hasn't needed to.

DS2 doing Politics and IP and sat 1st semester tests in 2 from 4 subjects and did well and other 2 were continuous assessment. He should have done same in semester 2 but his two exams were cancelled and just used the class assessment material. I guess in Scotland most courses were near finished by end March so effectively just finished a couple of weeks early. After Easter is revision and exams.

@Aurea maybe he could do crash higher RMPS or Modern Studies in Sixth year. My DS did AH Geog and that involved a lot of writing (he thought it was very dull though and wished he'd done AH CS instead)

So DD has a B for Higher English is an upgrade to A essential? She has A for Higher History an A band 1 for N5 English. If she decides to upgrade we will do it as an additional qualification (if the school allows) as I am an English teacher so can easily drag her through it. But for the sake of family harmony would prefer to avoid that .

Oh dear @Dinnafashyersel DS2 is super bright at everything except Maths, a B at Nat5 maths is the only B hes ever got in any exam, i hope he doesn't fall at a maths hurdle at interview, hes got an A at Higher Computer Science!

Lidl, would it be worth contacting her unis of choice and asking how they view it or are you meaning further down the line where she might be looking for legal experience etc?

Is challenging the teachers grade a possibility or does the B feel fair?

I think if you knew that you would be sitting competency exams in Maths, it would be easy enough to study for that specifically, probably more statistics and data analysis and arithmetic I would think rather than maths.

Wax we are tempted, would be awkward as I'd be questioning the estimation of one my local authority peers, but looking at her prelim, the folio grade her teacher and I anticipated and her body of evidence a low A , High B would have been a tough call. They judged B . So much for overinflated grades I think further discussion with DD, some admissions offices and school is needed.

would be awkward as I'd be questioning the estimation of one my local authority peers,

Hopefully not a friend though Lidl.

Maybe get your DH to at least front up activities as an otherwise innocent bystander! :o