Where are all my No-mates?

[HamletsSister]

In despair. Absolutely in despair. Do we have to go through this again? And with such a long lead up to the referendum? Really? What happened to the settled will of the Scottish people?

@statisticallychallenged Will you help me get through this again? (Was Roseformeplease then).

www.snp.org/schools_pack

It's ok. The snp are so proud to indoctrinate kids it is on their own website.

For me this is like child abuse.

Carol said: “Charlie was born at Simpsons on a Saltire. We are so proud to be Scottish that we wanted him to be surrounded by the Saltire and we took photos of him on the flag in his nappy and wearing his Saltire babygrows.

I HATE this. Properly HATE this. Who the fuck do the SNP think they are, appropriating the flag of MY country for their nationalistic ends? Would I wear something with a Saltire in 2017? Would I fuck - because it's now so strongly associated with independence. Fuck that.

And yes, indoctrinating babies is sinister. Could draw parallels with other Nationalistic parties with a "youth" wing but it speaks for itself.

I grew up in england but I am as far as I am aware of completely scottish heritage. I used to wear things with the saltire on all the time, but I have shredded all my old photos with me wearing or carrying one. I am so sad. I love scotland, but this wierd national socialism bullshit by the snp is enough to make me barf out my hard tory breakfast.

this is as bonkers as the texans my obstetrician told me about who'd had a cat litter tray full of texas soil shipped to the state the baby was being born in so the first ground the baby's feet touched was texan...

it's not just the flag, it's all the lovely culturally unique things about Scotland that have been appropriated, songs, Scots poetry - all enslaved for political nationalism...they don't own Scottish culture...

(It would have been my soft labour or libdem breakfast if I could vote for them btw- Not much chance with Jeremy in charge and with libdems not existing any more. I'm having to vote conservative to try and get rid of these numpties)
Can't shred my wedding pics. My English hubby wore a kilt as he was marrying in to a scottish family. The mood has been to seek anyone out that is not quite scottish enough, by some nationalists. My own scottish parents (born and raised here) and sister (born here) and proud scots feel more english than they have ever done because of this. They don't really have a choice as it feels they are not allowed to be both. The union jack for my family was what we choose as ours, but would have happily carried or worn any. We would be ashamed to fly the saltire now and too frightened to fly the UJ-IN OUR OWN COUNTRY. I can't describe how outraged I am by what they have done.

it's not just the flag, it's all the lovely culturally unique things about Scotland that have been appropriated, songs, Scots poetry - all enslaved for political nationalism...they don't own Scottish culture...

Yes all stolen from us.

I was speaking to the hubby and I said I would only let him wear a kilt now if it was red white and be and had a UJ sporran. None of us want to be associated with that lot.

I pray for the day they stop this and I can be proud again. I am so sad, all the things I used to think about with warmth and love now just give me a sick feeling.

I have some nats on my Facebook and I am continually bombarded by their proud yesserness mixed in with all the beautiful symbols I once loved.

Now whenever I see the saltire, a thistle, shortbread, tartan, the bagpipes, scottish poetry my heart just sinks and I feel sick.

i don't think you should let them co-opt them, it's fine to celebrate these things because you love Scotland without voting independence. I've got a massive thistle on my ceiling, love Outlander, love Scottish history, programmes about walking around Scotland etc and I'm clearly not a raving nationalist :) It's a lovely symbol that means something else to me than it'd mean to the SNP supporters.

I agree with you in part, but it is very difficult for me at the moment. I worry that it is too late. My parents were very proud Scots and a large part of my upbringing was heavily intertwined with Scottish culture and traditions and English ones were also encouraged. I also love English culture and my English family and friends. My wedding was a Scottish one with kilts and a ceilidh (the only difference was that the scramble was in the sun).

We have experienced some pretty horrible treatment by some of my own family (nats) since the nationalists commandeered everything Scottish and I am trying my best to untangle them in my head. I can not share what exactly as the instances may be identifying.

While in my heart I want to hang on to my heritage, every time I hear the SNP talk about quislings and colonies and make English people out to be racists and certain family members accuse us of pushing up houseprices and that we shouldn't be allowed a say in politics and that English people are greedy, nasty, selfish tories, acuse English people of being members of the edl or wanting to bring back the empire it makes me disassociate with my Scottish heritage.

It has tainted my view of my own upbringing and soured what were once beautiful memories. Not just for me but for my Scottish parents too.

I am trying my best not to let it happen, but in my heart I am devastated. Sometimes I feel like if something terrible were to happen to me or my husband, people would just walk past. The rise in the SNP ideology (particularly in my area) and the way they deal in hatred really worries me and sadly it is continually intertwined with all of those things that I loved and identified with.

I hope I'll be able to embrace all of those memories and culture again one day. At the moment, while I want to I am finding it really hard.

I hate identity politics it is horrible.

By the way no lottery win. I would not assume you were a nat just because you like outlander and have a thistle on your ceiling (sounds very cool), but I am just having trouble feeling any alignment with these things at the moment. I feel like they are not part of me any more if that makes sense.

i understand, you feel they've been tainted by association. I wouldn't put a saltire out now either without a union jack because people would assume I was making an independence related statement.

I don't want symbols of my heritage and identity to feel tainted obviously. I think it is just my emotional response to the other half of my identity being perjured in the worst possible way by those who relentlessly display these symbols (yessers).
I myself feel tainted by association now because of the SNP and hang my head in shame when I visit my lovely friends and family in England. They are making such massive tits out of themselves in Westminster, so we can't hide them and it is terribly embarrassing
I've ended up voting conservative which plays massively in to the hands of the SNP I know (English tory haha), but it is the only chance we have got now to get shot of them and save the union.

I'd like to see a well organised campaign for the union using these symbols including the saltire and the UJ to show that supporting the union is pro Scotland. Maybe that would help people like us to identify with beautiful Scottish culture and symbols again.

hear hear Up, I will also be voting tory for the first time since I was eligible to vote about 20 years ago until the independence threat is behind or labour somehow become really electable again...i can't see that happening anytime soon.

what i mean to say is, the threat to Scotland of the unchecked power of the SNP and independence is greater than whether labour or the tories are in power, to me. I'd rather we had an electable labour government, but if I can't have that, I'll choose the tories over the loonies.

Not sure about this from Davis though. Surely it is only puffing more wind in to their sails (nats).

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.express.co.uk/news/politics/785826/brexit-nicola-sturgeon-scottish-referendum-independence-indyref2/amp

What do you think? They are screwing up with the powers they have already. Hollyrood just gives seperatism a platform to grandstand at the moment. I'm all for more powers if the scottish government can use them properly.

It will only give them credence to their "momentum/journey to independence argument" as though it is some sort of natural process

bad spin on a sensible policy to try and win back moderate Scottish voters to the UK, but I think we should shine a light on powers they've got that aren't being used as well.

I think Sturgeon's sounding a bit desperate with her latest 'Westminster power grab' rant. She keeps alleging this, and the UK government keep reiterating that the Scottish parliament will not lose any of its powers, and in fact will get some back from Brussels. She's starting to sound a bit paranoid and unhinged frankly, especially as she says she wants to rejoin the EU and give them back (and gave back some of the UK government-granted powers too).

I think it's absolutely fair enough to say that there need to be discussions about what goes where so that the internal market isn't damaged, rather than automatically sending powers to Scotland because of some non-legally binding tradition. The powers held by Brussels predate the Scottish parliament. What is wrong with giving it proper thought before diving right in?

Harking back to what we said about education earlier this is what Ruthie had to say about it earlier. Please ignore the article as it is the express, but the footage speaks for itself.

www.express.co.uk/news/uk/785833/Nicola-Sturgeon-mocked-Ruth-Davidson-Holyrood-erupts-Scotland-indepdence

bad spin on a sensible policy to try and win back moderate Scottish voters to the UK, but I think we should shine a light on powers they've got that aren't being used as well.

You are right Nolottery I didn't mean to put a bad spin on it. I do hope it will win over moderate yessers, but I do think it will be used in the progression towards independence argument. I do have faith that people will be able to see past it though so although it will not win over hardline nationalists it might appease moderate voters.
I remember alex salmond making comments in the past about seeking more and more powers and then declaring scotland independent even without a referendum, so I do worry about that too. I'll see if I can find footage.

Can't find the footage, but he said it and it was reported in many papers including here
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/scottish-independence/scotland-could-declare-independence-without-referendum-says-alex-salmond-9747555.html

I've found footage here

Second referendum officially requested.

Crap.

Double fucking crap

Lets hope they get a resounding fuck off from May.