It seems DH is plotting to secretly meet an old GF while on a business trip. WWYD?

[CoteDAzur]

He hasn't breathed a word about this to me and it sounds like a rather romantic date.

WWYD?

"He didn't tell me because he thought I would make a big deal out of it while it's nothing. He will never speak to her on the phone and he will definitely never meet her if (!) it upsets me so. He understands why it was wrong to plan to meet her behind my back but honestly there was no bad intention there."

I don't like any of the above, especially the implication that you are somehow being a bit sensitive ('if ! it upsets you so'). I know you're paraphrasing him, Cote, and from the way you've put it, I wonder if you believe him -- doesn't sound like it.

I think there's a lot more for him to talk about here -- the big picture, not just this alleged non-incident.

I'm really glad you spoke up Cote. I am certain that this was the best thing to do.

However, I do hope you haven't said the equivalent of "Oh well, that's alright then" because it so ISN'T.

If you go back to an earlier post I made, I said that this is never the end story. There has been a monumental breach of trust and absolutely no admissions from him that he intenhded being unfaithful. I simply don't beieve this story about her parents and children being there, since there was no mention of them in any of the correspondence you uncovered.

The fact remains he was intending to fly somewhere while pretending to you and his office that he was on business. Now normally people need a hell of a motivation to get on a plane for a pleasant dinner with an old flame and her family and the greatest motivator is usually sex.

He had the cheek to imply that you would have over-reacted if he had told you the truth and in effect, tried to blame you for him lying.

Don't fall for it Cote and now this is in the open domain, don't let this drop until you get to the bottom of why he did this. Like I said before, he can and will deny till he's blue in the face, but what matters is what you believe. And in your shoes, my absolute belief would be that he had every intention of committing adultery.

If this is what you believe too, you're going to have to tell him that. And ask him to stop showing contempt and disrespect for your intelligence by suggesting otherwise. There are no innocent explanations for this - and he is still lying. He would no more believe this cock and bull story from you, than fly to the moon. As you say, even he believes that secret meetings with exes are dodgy, so how is it that when he does just that, there are no sinister motives?

Don't let this be the end story Cote. As I often say, stopping someone from doing something doesn't remove the desire to do it. The work you perhaps need to do as a couple should be about why he wanted to be unfaithful - but first he's got to admit the truth.

Cote - so her parents and all that were going to be there. But now that you've discovered and confronted him with your discovery, that makes it ok then?

I think not.

Oh, didn't twig that he had completely made up the 'business'. That's quite dodgy then. It's one thing to have dinner with an ex when you are both going to be in the same place at the same time anyway, but something else to make a special trip. Hmm.

I have to beg your indulgence, Cote ... just for this one post, I'm going to be the meanest & most cynical Grace. Apart from what follows, I agree with your most recent replies and share your confidence in yourself.

Is she from an 'emergent economy'?
How likely is it that her relatives, in Europe, are coming to the end of their work/live permits?

just listen really well to the lyrics here.

Hey, if you think it's okay, if you truly believe that, then I guess it is.

But somehow, well, I don't believe so.

Here's why: because it doesn't seem like he would be okay if the shoe were on the other foot.

I'd be keeping my options open, tbh, in such an instance.

Unless there is a mutual child involved, which in this case, there is not, an ex is an ex.

I have an ex h.

He and I divorced because he never wanted any children. That was after two years of separation and counselling.

DH knows him, and his wife, who also never wanted kids. They'd both been sterilised before meeting.

But he was the first to step up and say, 'How is your husband with this? I can back off. I understand. Can I contact him?'

No secrets for any reason.

Or parental involvement. His mother is dead. His father is off doing his own thing getting married again and again.

His brother is off married has 2 children, to a German, although living in the US, is like, 'Whatever.'

All open, the German way.

and yy, WWIFN, once again, speaks sense, from experience.

It just all sounds like a total crock of shit to me, tbh.

And man, I heard a lot of shit in my life, most of which I fell for for a really long time.

I still wish you'd explain the second half of your - spaced - post above, though, expat.

'Bonsoir - I don't think meeting exes is a big deal, but I know that he does, which is why I was skeptical about his intentions here. Especially he didn't tell me about it.'

Well,you said it yourself.

Don't let him turn this back on your like it's somehow your fault.

God, that's the oldest trick in the book!

Women use it, too.

When they cheat.

I only know because I did it, too.

About my ex, Grace?

Well, I'd told DH all about it and why we divorced.

He moved back to Germany after I was in Scotland and got back in touch via email.

And when I said I was remarried was right away, 'OMG, I didn't know, is your husband okay with my contacting you?' blah blah blah.

Not, 'Let's meet in Munich on a fake business trip.'

Or hinting for money or that.

This whole thing with Cote's DH just sounds dodgy as hell.

Well, I am glad that that I spoke to DH rather than play it to the bitter end as was my initial thought. A big Thank You to all of you who have steered me in this direction

To clarify, I don't doubt that he had business in that city on that day, but that doesn't mean anything, as it would be easy for him to arrange it with a simple phone call.

I always learn his business trips from his secretary, who books them for him. This is because he forgets to tell me, then forgets the time of flight, doesn't remember when return flight will land etc. 90% of the time he goes out in a red-eye flight and comes back the same day because he wants to bathe DC and put them to bed.

He is a bad liar so I believe him when he says that he didn't meet her before and that he didn't intend for anything sexual to happen when they met. He said his FB doesn't even need a password on his laptop which I could check at any moment (true, I didn't touch his laptop).

It looks like he enjoyed the attention he was getting from her and justified the secrecy to himself by saying that nothing would happen anyway.

Grace - Fair question. She is from South America and now lives in North America with her extended family, so no intention of moving to the EU.

expat - It sounds like you had a fun night

Cote, I am glad you discussed it with him and that you feel reassured. I don't want to take away from that but what about the cold feet comment, how does this fit?

Just read the whole thread and I have to say I don't feel Mr Cote's answers have been totally satisfactory either. But then, is hard to imagine how they could have been. I reckon he was going with the express purpose of givng her the money. Could that explain the 'cold feet' comment?

I am sure she was flirting with him. He was possibly reciprocating, thinking it's a bit of harmless fun that isn't going to go anywhere. When he didn't contact her for a few weeks, she egged him on with "So is it all good or do you have cold feet?" wondering if they were still on to meet.

Having seen his face during last night's confrontation, I believe him when he says he didn't intend for anything that would tarnish his wedding ring and certainly wouldn't do anything to jeopardize our family.

He said that any meeting would have included her parents and kids and I let him get away with this because telling him that I know exactly where they were going would have compromised my source of information. I told him the only message I read accidentally, a month ago, when he wanted me to fix something on his laptop, mentioned the date. And I now see he intends to go and hence "the talk". I didn't say I have been keeping tabs on him fairly regularly since then.

So I let him get away with it, after I told him how close I came to sticking a PI up his ass and the inevitable divorce that would follow. He has now come back down to Planet Earth and realized what he has to lose and how quickly he stands to lose it if he even plans anything like this ever again.

He said he didn't give her money. She got money from her grandmother, apparently, with whom she and her kids will be staying for a few months now in Europe while her divorce goes through.

He wouldn't carry all that money in a suitcase and hand it to her in person, anyway. He would just to a bank transfer.

Cote it sounds like you have handled the situation very well.

I hope this is the last of it.

Oh and he said his Facebook logs in automatically on his laptop (which he keeps at home) and that I can check it as often as I like if that is what I want to do. (I hadn't looked because I was so sure that it would be password protected)

Handled fantastically well! I would be tempted to ask him to break all contact with her, but I think the outcome you have achieved is excellent. Keep the break all contact up your sleeve if anything else happens (although I think it's unlikely to now that Mr CdA is back on Planet Earth).

WWIFN - Yes, an admission of sexual intent would have been cathartic and a good thing in terms of "getting to the bottom of this", but there is little I can do to force it out of him now that I have not gone down the PI route.

Second best is what we have now IMO - he gets to keep his intent to himself but is now shaken awake re the reality of what he was doing: Regardless of whether he intended to sleep with her or not, just the fact that he planned a rdv in secret is inadmissible. It is a breach of trust that should never happen again. His loyalty should be with me. (All terminology I gathered from this thread )

I already told him in no uncertain terms that he will not speak to her again nor will there ever be any thought if a rdv.

He said "But honey you wouldn't mind it if I met xx (another ex-gf)" to which I replied "Yeah, well, have secret phone conversations and plan to meet her in secret for a month and you will see how quickly she becomes persona non grata as well". I think he got the message. If not the one on honesty, certainly the one about the risk of plotting to cheat on me again.

Morning Cote - and good news to log in to. I am really heartened if seeking and receiving the measured thoughts of MN have helped change the course of this for the better.

I've thought a great deal about your situation and all the factors involved. Also - despite my own experience - I have tried to imagine a scenario where I could/would end up doing something similar to your DH and it does seem plausible to me that one could get in a scrape.

Mnet thread only gives but a snippet into your marriage after all.

I do wonder though, given that you said he has such strong feelings should it be the other way round (ie you meeting exPs), whether you also talked about future proofing any repetition regarding any rules re exs.

A slight cynical alarm rang with the facebook login (given that I recently discovered a secret account). Just - well - if the account is so open and will continue to be so - but your DH has the capacity to think through erasing call history - just don't forget that 1 open account can be a red herring.

Meanwhile - I am frankly humbled by a mature and thought out approach with a good ending.