Women who return to abusive partners

[BertieBotts]

I notice a lot of people on here saying frequently that they don't understand why some women keep returning to violent or abusive relationships, and I read this book on the subject recently and found it really interesting, if hard going. It's written by Erin Pizzey, the founder of Women's Aid and is about women who are drawn to abusive (predominantly violent) relationships time and time again.

There are graphic descriptions of abuse in the book so just be warned if it is likely to upset you. If you think you can cope though it's well worth the read - it's quite short, 183 pages in print.

The book is called "Prone to Violence" and the whole text is available online here, (which is where I read it) or amazon link here.

Yeah, arfafa, but what I did there was the correct anti-abuse response. Even if I did have to go for a walk before making it

I have come across such closed minds before - mainly in abusive men.

Can i ask, im aware theres some dispute going on here , but how do you lot cope with knowing what you know, reading that book for instance ?

I feel traumatized , what ive read will haunt me, i feel like crying. What do you do with it ?

"Donald G. Dutton and Tonia L. Nicholls, from the Department of Psychology at the University of British Columbia also undertook a meta-analysis of data in 2005. They concluded:

Clearly, shelter houses full of battered women demonstrate the need for their continued existence. Moreover, outside of North American and Northern Europe, gender inequality is still the norm (Archer, in press). However, within those countries that have been most progressive about women?s equality, female violence has increased as male violence has decreased (Archer, in press). There is not one solution for every domestically violent situation; some require incarceration of a terrorist perpetrator, others can be dealt with through court-mandated treatment, still others may benefit from couples therapy. However, feminist inspired intervention standards that preclude therapists in many states from doing effective therapy with male batterers are one outcome of this paradigm. The failure to recognize female threat to husbands, female partners, or children is another (Straus et al., 1980 found 10% higher rates of child abuse reported by mothers than by fathers).
The one size fits all policy driven by a simplistic notion that intimate violence is a recapitulation of class war does not most effectively deal with this serious problem or represent the variety of spousal violence patterns revealed by research. At some point, one has to ask whether feminists are more interested in diminishing violence within a population or promoting a political ideology. If they are interested in diminishing violence, it should be diminished for all members of a population and by the most effective and utilitarian means possible. This would mean an intervention/treatment approach based on other successful approaches from criminology and psychology.[95]"

Sorry it's from a wiki link but interesting nonetheless.

Since when was the conversation about general levels of violence against men or women? I thought we were talking about domestic abuse.

And, yes, I'm assuming that at least some of the perpetrators of domestic abuse against men are women, yes. Homosexuals make up, what, 5% to 10% of the population so that doesn't square with the 20% figure the BCS found. Or are you suggesting that the 20% of men who have experienced domestic abuse were exclusively the victims of other men?

Incidentally, why the fixation on how many posts I've made under this name? Is that an attempt by you to undermine my credibility and to put me in my place?

Well, I take on board your offence at "silly" and apologise for it. I have told you I was at the demo(s), is it so hard to believe I'm a 55-year-old feminist for goodness sake?

Elements of this thread highlight very strongly why I no longer align myself with feminist movements. Since I still haven't finished the kitchen DIY, I don't have time to get into all the whys of that, but feel sure we'll discuss again on the women's rights board!

Seriously, as you are concerned about this issue - and clearly passionate about it - why don't you do some training and volunteer at a refuge or helpline? Genuine suggestion, meant well.

The bits I quoted were abusive, Dittany. Not full-face venom, granted, but belittling nonetheless. As an abuse survivor, still recovering, it's important to me that I challenge it where I find it.

I'm not a new poster.

So believing the statistics that show that some women are violent and that some men are victims is anti-feminist and anti-woman?

So if we don't believe that women are always the victims and men always the perpetrators then, to you, we cannot claim to be feminists?

Wow.

Do you really see the world in such black and white terms?

What have I said that is anti-feminist?

Thank you.

You've disagreed with ditanny, Moros. That's enough.

At least she hasn't called you a man, yet.

Er, no, the statistics I pointed to was in response to your claims that such events were "lies".

Nobody here is claiming that, as some women are violent towards men, that makes male-on-female violence acceptable or otherwise excusable. I read Pizzy's book and felt sick to my stomach. I don't agree with everythin Pizzey says but, as the survivor of an abusive relationship, I do think that sometimes the victim of the abuse also needs to look at her (or him) self. That's not to cast blame or responsibility, either, but to help her to understand why she ended up in an abusive relationship, what made her stick it out for as long as she did, and think about what warning signs were missed.

I say again I'm not claiming that the victim is in any way to blame. I am saying that sometimes (as in my case) the victim has past experiences that made her more susceptible to being taken in by an abuser and that it is in the victim's best interests to at least consider that possibility.

I'm proud to call myself a feminist. But I'm glad I'm not the kind of feminist who sees any disagreement with what I say as not only wrong but also tacit evidence of general hatred of women. But if you want to dismiss me as an anti-feminist troll then go ahead, knock yourself out.

Is my own fault for reading it, there was a clear warning ! Will admit to having had a little cry .

I find it hard to follow these discussions sometimes as i dont know much about these issues but the book was horrifying for several reasons.

Obviously there was the horrific detailed abuse of women, but worse, the idea that women are addicted to violence , that the men were nice guys , that men were coming in and out of the refuge ( what sort of refuge was that ?) and the women suffering abuse were the ones with the problem, not the men.
Wtf !

And is it me, or is there something sickening and creepy about the interveiws with the women , the leading and insistant questioning for details of sexual abuse ?

I am finding this mind-boggling.

I am a feminist and in my view that has nothing to do with hating men, nor with placing women on a pedestal and pretending they are incapable of violence. As far as I can see, to say the latter is to buy into an old argument that restricts women's moral capacity.

Violence towards women is horrific, but that is no excuse for pretending that violence by women never happens.

Reading that book, it appears that the author seems to be suggesting that women who repeatedly return to an abusive partner seem to be engaged in some kind of extreme form of S&M. I feel sick to be honest, the view that a woman will return to a partner or end up in a cycle of abusive partners is down completely to her inability to find sexual gratification unless practically killed is shocking, it's pretty much re-enforcing the view of people who take the stance that women are asking for it!

Having gone through the court system in order to free myself of an abusive partner, personally I can tell you why I didn't leave immediately, because nobody would have believed me, I feared I would get the blame that my children would be taken from me, and you know what that is pretty much exactly the scenario I faced, even after the barrister and judge had police statements and documents saying I had been subjected to severe violence I was still told I was a liar, ex's barrister even told me that my fear for my honour was a lie as I showed no shame or embarrassment in describing the abuse under oath that day standing in the dock! And this was all in England (last year to be exact) not in some god forsaken backward country with no women?s rights.

The women I have met along the way who have suffered, most definitely worse than I have, did so because they suffered huge financial loss, and the fear of having to set up life alone and that their ex?s would find them and kill them as promised.

One woman I know faces having to declare herself bankrupt as the joint property she had with her abusive ex, altho she left it, he continued to live there and racked up a huge debt before he scarpered, as the law abiding citizen, the banks are coming for her!

It's not as easy as just walking away, I am not into s&m at all, I hated being touched by ex at all I lived for the times where he would work evenings so I could enjoy some semblance of a space to breathe. Walking away from everything one has ever worked towards building is a horrific thing to have to face, I could have phoned refuge and left with nothing but my babies and the clothes on my back, but I just could not face that, I could not face the finger inevitable pointing and vilification of my character amongst my community, I just couldn't.

Maybe I'm shallow and materialistic, but it's my life, after all the drama is over, the daily drudgery is mine to face alone. I most certainly however did not ask for it in any shape or form.

Women who are unfortunate enough to end up in one abusive relationship after another do so, because in my opinion after a while one loses ones self esteem, one feels like one does not deserve any better, and if subsequent partners treat one abusively one start to think, that maybe there is something wrong with oneself, after all the common denominator is oneself isn't it!

No woman or man asks for it, not ever, not unless they do vocally ask to have the crap beaten out of them, if and unless that happens it's all the abusers fault, he/she crossed that line ot physically and mentally harm the one person they are claiming to build a family unit with.

As for me, you know what, I am terrified of ever entering into a relationship ever again, the very thought of putting myself into such a position where someone has the power over my financial and emotional security makes my skin crawl.

Going back to the OP topic, and Ms Pizzey's controversial "addiction" theory:

The cycle of abuse leads to a rollercoaster existence, thoroughly documented in this forum (by people living through it) as well as in psychology texts. It's like living in a Brazilian soap opera - there are no dull days: only crisis, aftermath, reconciliation and anticipation. It's non-stop emotion.

The neurological effects of this ARE the same as those associated with addiction. Just as a recovering addict is challenged to acclimatise to 'normal' life, in which the highs & lows of substance abuse no longer colour the days; so it is for many (not all) who have ended an abusive relationship. I don't need to find citations for this, because you can read first-hand accounts in the NPD thread here.

It's proven that people who were traumatised as children are more likely to suffer trauma in adulthood. The reasons for this are to do with the fact that childhood abuse affects brain development: in short, those of us who were abused as children have, as adults, brains that are specially adapted to abuse. It's not a theory that most abused children go on to become abused and/or abusive adults: it's a physical, neurological, measurable, statistical fact.

The reasons for that are very similar to the factors which make certain people more vulnerable to addiction.

Neuropsychology is a new science. It didn't exist while Pizzey was doing her work; there were no PET scanners and neurotransmitters were largely undiscovered. Her intuitive alignment of the abuse cycle with addiction was impressively correct, in the light of ongoing discoveries.

If you were to deny this aspect of the abusive process, you'd be diminishing the suffering of those still trapped within it - and discounting the efforts & achievements of those who, like myself, decide to challenge it and recover.

Have you thought about doing some volunteering yet, Dittany?