Its got so bad, but I need some perspective.

[Jazzicatz]

Hi all, I gave written on here a few times about my relationship with 'd'p but things have gone from bad to worse and I just wanted some sense that his behaviour isn't acceptable, or that i'm the one that needs to step back.

We have been together for 10 years and we have two gorgeous little boys. Our problems together go back years, but were particulaly bad after we had our first son. I suffered with PND and dp was very dismissive and left me just to get on with it. He had a business at the time that failed and we ended up living with him parents.

His family are wealthy and very controlling of dp, they want him to stay in the area and continue the family fortune. Everytime dp has got himself into financial difficulty, which is numerous times, his family bale him out. He had never really taken any real responsibility for his actions, he knows essentially his family will sort it out. This has put immense pressure on us as I hate the area we live in and don't really like his families interference in our lives.

I however, have neen trying to finish my PhD and worked sporadically and therefore was not in a position to pay for us to move, dp insisted we stayed and kept pressuring me to get a job and finish the PhD. I have now got a job, but work miles away. I have to stay away during the week and come home at the weekends, but the boys are now at school and dp is supposed to have flexibility in his 'job', which is with a family member.

Dp has a very traditional semse of gender roles and finds it difficult that I work away and that I focus on my job so much. He is currently 'punishing' me for being away and although I am home most weekends, holidays and for most of the summer, he still is being, in my opinion, unreasonable.

Now that I am back from work for 3 weeks, dp won't do any thing at all around the house - not that he does much anyway, he comes in really late, and leaves really early. He has taken the car so we are stranded in our village,when he does come home he is usually pissed. He insistes I either sleep with our youngest son in a single bed or on the floor or very small sofa. He won't contribute anything.

Every weekend when I get back he just disappears off and usually rolls in pissed around 7pm. I have to do all the housework left from the week, all the washing, the homework with the boys, shopping - basically everything. However, now he is off, and won't contribute anything.

My job is pretty full-on and I have no time in which to 'recover' before beginning again.

I'm knackered because of our sleeping arrangements, and just feel like a general skivvy.

Do I 'deserve' this behaviour for going away to work? What can I do?
Sorry its long - any advice very much appreciated.

Rycie - your post made me cry. Thank you for your kindness. Almost forgotton what its like to have someone be kind!

Jazzi - you really do have the support of a number of us here. I am so so sorry you have so little experience of kindness being shown towards you, but you need to start now being kind to yourself. Loving and valuing yourself enough to make positive changes in your life.

I have said before that I think its amazing what you've done with your life given the terrible things that happened to you as a child. And I honestly believe that you have the strength and the skills to do this, you just don't realise it. Your dp does, which is why he tries to undermine you constantly, and your self-doubt is his best weapon.

What are your plans for this week Jazzi, what are thoughts about taking action?

Have a look at this and see if you recognise your DP anywhere. Trying to resolve things together with someone who lacks any sense of empathy or even decency is going to suck the life out of you and leave you reeling; this situation cannot be resolved. You are not dealing with someone who possesses a better nature. What you see is what you get and will continue to get. And what the boys will continue to get. (He really does not love them. His behaviour towards them is controlling and abusive too, otherwise your oldest wouldn't be starting to be insolent towards you. He is emasculating the boys by mistreating you in front of them.)

Could you try a different Women's Aid center? Here's a link to Refuge if you don't want to go to WA again.

Yes his behaviour does seem to be controlling and unacceptable - I have today found out from my eldest that he has been asking lots of questions, and saying some rather unpleasant things about me to the boys. I am actually shocked, as I really didn't expect him to behave in such a way. I am now starting to realise the man is irrational and has a very unhealty attitude towards women.

It does worry me, and I do worry he will start being really nasty - I hope to god I'm wrong, but it would seem his behaviour is getting worse rather than better.

I am taking the boys away for a day or two, just to get away. He isn't happy about it, but we all need a break from the constant tension.

I will let you know what happens once I get back - and thank you again for all your advice.

Good luck Jazzicatz.
You know there is nothing at "home" for you. You can use these few tensionless days to formulate a plan - even jot it down in a notebook in little steps. It may clarify your thoughts and may help you build up momentum.

All the best xxx

jazzi
Taking the boys for a few days sounds like a good idea.
he is being nasty because he feels 'trapped' and has lost his control over you - so is now looking to the boys to have some control.
Take comfort in the fact that he is not a happy person - but you do not have to justify yourself to him just now.
Explain to your boys that it is because he is angry that he is saying such things.
Good luck.

I hope you have a great break Jazzi, and give some serious thoughts to your next steps. It will also give you an opportunity to spend some time with you boys without him and to get a sense of how things are at home for them.

I must say love, when you say "i do worry he will start being really nasty" - it underlines to me that you need to reassess your expectations of acceptable behaviour. The way you are treated seems to have long long ago transcended the boundary of nasty, and to be honest he sounds as if he could be borderline dangerous.

One becomes so immune to being treated badly it is possible to normalise it, and I think you have done this. I'm a bit that you're surprised he's bad mouthing you to the boys, I would guess that most of us assumed this was going on during the week while you were away. Perhaps you should re-read your own posts Jazzi, and remind yourself of who you're living with.

Not sure if you've heard this nature story before, but do you know how to boil a frog? (just bear with me!).

If you put a frog straight into a pot of boiling water, it will jump straight out again to safety. However, if you put a frog in a pot of cold water, and slowly start turning up the heat, the frog gets used to the increasing temperature and stays in the pot until it dies. It doesn't realise how unsafe its environment has become.

I really hope you have a wonderful break, and give some serious thought to what you're going to do to change this situation for you and your children. Good luck Jazzi!

this sounds horrendous! I myself have some similar difficulties and they have also been going on for many years and i can approeciate your feelings from being on the 'inside', although if honest you would prob admit that it has been 'bad' for a longer amount of time that it was ever 'good', for many this in itself is enough to know you should leave ut its difficult breaking up a family no matter how chaotic and difficult it is.
I think the 'wealthy parents always bailing him out and him never having to stand on his own two feet' is exactly one of my problems with my dp and its never gone away and is so frustrating.
The sleeping with child or on sofa is ridiculous and he has no right to ban you from your bed! FFS!!!
Also he has no right to piss off out everytime you come home nad come in drunk leaving the house in a mess for you to celar up when he has bene home all week, thats disgraceful and childish.
There has to be a limit to what you can accept, rationalise and ignore and I think he has crossed the line on all three

Hi Jazzi, I just wanted to chime in with some more support. I left my emotionally abusive H just under a year ago, and I know how horribly overwhelming a prospect it is. Like any mountain (like a PhD) it is much less daunting when it is behind you!

Some suggestions:

1. Your energy is precious to you right now, so be careful how you spend it. Do not spend it on trying to reason with your H, trying to get him to see the harm he is doing, trying to make him act nice or at least normal. Accept who he is.

2. I'm sorry Women's Aid didn't help, but it is really important to find some real-life help. This is a very hard thing to do alone. Can you confide in a friend? Even someone you don't know that well might be willing to help if you explain what's going on. Another poster has mentioned Refuge. It knocks you back when you don't get help after screwing up your courage to ask for it - this happened to me when I tried to tell my health visitor and GP what was happening. But you need to try again.

3. Definitely get that legal advice. Mongolia is right that you need to be careful about your working away situation so that you're not at a disadvantage.

Lastly, never doubt that your DCs belong with you. Soon after I left ex, I was seriously contemplating letting my DD spend most of her time with her father, because I felt so much self-doubt. Now I know that that would have been the wrong thing to do. She sees her father a lot, and the good things about your DCs relationship with their father can survive, even with them living with you.

It is really hard, but the only way out is through. You can't live like this.

Hi all, well went away and had a lovely time. Just nice to be free of the tension.
He wouldn'y let us have the car so we had to go on the train, which was fine, but on the way back I called him to pick us up as it was late and there had been engineering works on the train - at his mother's pissed. It was about 3pm I called. So struggled back, got in around 8.30pm - no partner, still out, nothing in the house had been done and eventually he turns up around 10pm, steaming drunk.

The boys really wanted to see him and the eldest was still awake when he came in. He didn't want to see him, and told him to go back up to bed. Not through good parenting, just that he was pissed and didn't feel like it.

Next day he takes the eldest out - purely to glean information about what we did and with whom. The boys then came back and went out-side to play, he cooked a sunday dinner, we ate around 6pm he wouldn't eat with us, and as soon as he finished his he went to bed.

Monday morning, up and out first thing and didn't get in til late and pissed, same this morning.

The problem is the boys idolise him. For the last few days I have had a mild bug and felt pretty grotty, yesterday I felt really unwell, the boys were moaning about how little I do with them and how great he is. Makes me so angry, when he has done so little with them, and picks and chooses when he will be the 'great' dad. I hate him so much, I can't bear it.

Jazzi

Your children are more likely afraid of him than anything else. They are likely also to be very confused as well by his behaviours towards you and them.

Your man only regards them and by turn you as mere possessions. He does not love them at all; he is more than prepared to bring them up in his own hateful image. You cannot leave that damaging legacy to them and they won't ultimately thank you for staying with him. If you do not act these two young men will end up just like their Dad in the way they treat women. Is that what you want for them?.

What are they learning from you both about relationships here, well two words actually suffice. Damaging lessons. You're both imparting damaging lessons to the next generation.

Time to act jazzi and you need to stand firm now for both you and them to make definitive plans to leave. Too many others have held the power for too long; abuse is about power and control over others.

BTW did you tell him you had contacted WA?.

Womens Aid contacted Social Services and he found out because of that. He is so angry because of it and won't forgive me for calling WA

Jazzi, it doesn't matter whether he forgives you or not. Women's Aid must have done what they did - indeed they have an obligation to do so - because they perceived there were children at risk. If you are compelled to leave them in his care all week and he cannot control his drinking, they have a point. The question is now, what can you do to keep your children safe? That is more important than their father's feelings or for that matter yours, though yours do count. It is also a whole lot more important than whether they love him or not. He is not good for them while he is living like this. You are the better parent. Try to work with social services and don't worry about Mr Angry. He is already behaving extremely badly; his resentment of you looking for help to deal with it may have escalated things in the short term, but they were heading there anyway.

SS did their checks and deemed him fine, which just adds fuel to the fire. He is so angry with me because they went to the school and dr, both of which came back fine, as I knew they would. The boys always go to school and are well looked after.

Jazzicatz I have just read through your thread - what an awful situation you are in .

Can I ask - how did you come to get a job in East Sussex when your family home is in Oxfordshire? I am wondering if your partner somehow facilitated this and wanted you away in the week.

Is there some way that you could work from home for part of the week - and/or apply for flexible hours and then be away from home less?

I think that you need to seriously consider being at home more in the week.

Could you look for a job nearer home?

Is your partner regularly drinking and driving including with the DCs?

I think that your partner is trying to alienate you from your boys .

SS are not saying that he is "fine" they are saying that they haven't found any evidence.

You need to find some strength from somewhere. I get a lot of help from some self-hypnosis downloads.

I've found this one called Getting the Courage to Leave an Abusive Relationship.

I think that you need to sort out the sleeping situation. At least buy a blow up matress or camp bed.

I also think that you should be talking to the police about the drinking and the fear that your partner will be violent - eg if you were in the bed when he got home.

Is there anyone in his family who is sympathetic to you?

You can and you will get out of this abusive relationship.

I'm a lecturer at a University so its not always easy to get jobs nearby. I was applying over 2 years before I got this job and really think its our way out. I'm not going to give it up as I will be totally dependent upon him as I was before and I'm not going back to that!

"the boys were moaning about how little I do with them and how great he is. Makes me so angry, when he has done so little with them, and picks and chooses when he will be the 'great' dad."

Ha, get used to it - it'll be more of the same once you're seperated. When I don't instantly gratify my DD's every wish, she starts to wail "I want my daddy!"

And you are going to seperate, aren't you? As far as I can see, all that's keeping you there now is fear.

Jazzicat - I think that you should close your profile.

Surely you don't want people who might know you seeing these posts?

I would think that your profession and location would make it possible for you to be identified.

I have had a look at some of your past posts and I am shocked and horrified at what you have been putting up with for years.

You are intelligent - you know what to do - you know your rights/the law etc.

One of your previous posts from over a year ago says that you will take the boys to your new job...

You need Mumsnet to give you the will do to this.

Could you set out what are the main practical and emotional reasons which are stopping you and then the wise MNers with experience in this area can help you.

I have taken my profile off tabouleh - thank you for they suggestion.

Hi Jazzi,

I just wanted to see how you were doing and how things are going. This thread may have died, but the support is still here!

Just thought I would add an update and ask again for advice as you have all been so great!
The situation hasn't improved, I am still sleeping on the floor and 'd'p treats me as if I am shit on his shoe. I have now finished teaching for the summer, so am pretty much home til September. If he is around we argue and the boys are really picking up on it. With our elder ds telling me he hates me and I should leave daddy's house. I think the only option is now to leave. Now not sure what I should do with my ds's. They have both said they don't want to come with me. They are in a good school with his family around to help him. If they come with me I have nothing and no support.
But the thought of leaving them with him and his awful family makes me feel physically ill. What should I do?

Jazzi, I remember this thread. My heart goes out to you. I agree that you should leave, but the situation with your dcs really complicates it. I think the first priority is to talk to a solicitor and perhaps also Families Need Fathers. Your leaving needs to be planned very carefully to deal with the residence aspects. It may be a situation where you're looking at joint residence (doesn't have to mean 50/50). Think of what the best-case scenario is for you - boys at school and staying with father during week, with you at weekends?

However much your dcs kick against you, don't be browbeaten into feeling that they'd be better off without you. Get that legal advice as a priority.

Thank you Nicknametaken and yes you are right. The problem is if I settle where I am working then as I have no car and live so far away it is logistically going to be a nighmare. Ex won't help with transport or anything. Just think everyone is best off without me!