Found out some brutal stuff

[wrinklyraisin]

Over the last year I have found out from family member loads of things I didn't know about my mother. The main thing being she squirrelled away most of our child support payments (amounting to way over 75k) and is now living off that in a foreign country. All of her children are now adults.

After our parents divorced, our father bought a house outright for us to live in. Then the courts ordered he pay a substantial sum to mum each month for us. He earned a lot so we got a lot of maintenance. BUT from the age of 11 to 18 I have few memories of being allowed to buy new clothes, we had to wear second hand shop clothes, we had no holidays, no school trips, cheap food... meanwhile our mother took up several expensive habits, and complained to us all the time that our father NEVER paid maintenance thus we had to suffer and to blame HIM not her. She bworked very very part time so I know ashe never earned enough to fund her lifestyle at that time.

Since then I have seen court documents, bank statements and solicitors letters. So I know for a fact our father DID pay thousands and thousands for us every year. This was years ago now and I am FURIOUS at my mother for lying, for keeping the money, for letting me destroy my relationship with my father, as I believed he never paid or cared. I don't know what to say to my mother now. I want to sue her or something for years of deceipt, for withholding the money that was supposed to benefit us children. Our father lived 400 miles away and we hardly ever saw him, so he was never truly aware of the fact we did not reveive the full benefits of his maintenance. Now he knows the truth he is astounded and angry too. He says he paid a LOT so we would have a good life despite his not being a part of it any more.

I am so angry and so sad. I don't want to rehash old issues but this knowledge has made everything come back to the surface. FFS Mum made us go without shampoo and conditioner and deodarant as teenage girls as she "couldn't afford it". We had to use cheap supermarket soap to wash our hair. I used to steal friends body spray at aleepovers. We lived in a lovely house though and no one ever really knew what went on behind closed doors. My clothes were embarassing. Thank God for school uniforms.

My mother is unstable, I suspect bipolar. She's made some very poor decisions in raising us. Yet now we are adults her memories of our childhood are VERY different from ours. Apparently we were raised free and liberal and wanted for nothing. Ok. I remember cutting mouldy crusts off white bread to make sandwiches for school. She would buy a certain amount of cheap and nasty food on a Saturday and by Thursday we'd often have to choose lunch or dinner as we couldn't have both.

Now she lives in an amazing house in a lovely country. She "retired" at 45 with her new husband. She considers herself the victim in life as she never wanted a cheating husband, or ungrateful children, etc etc...

I work bloody hard and earn a fair amount. She is now demanding I start contributing towards a savings account for HER and her DH as they want supporting once they are old. and apparently I OWE her.

I am so messed up over this, I know I need therapy or something. But I am also wanting to see what recall we children have for the maintenance that we never benefitted from. It was years ago. But the ramifications of her actions have affected all of us children as adults.

Ugh what a mess.

If you've read this far thank you.

That's what I keep reading and I find that tragic too, it means she will never redeem herself, never make amends or seek forgiveness - just as I will never be able to tell her I forgive her (not that I do) or get her to see just how badly she has treated us. In a way I feel sorry for her. It's just so final.

Whoah there Crinkly! Just remember that you don't have to make any decisions about dealing with your mum or building bridges with your dad just yet. You have half a life's worth of information to absorb. That will take a long time.

At the moment just look after priority number one - you. A visit to the doc and perhaps some couselling when you feel ready are a great start but don't panic about how to deal with all this. That will come clear in time.

Take care.

Just a quick one to say that my Dad had a messy divorce from his first wife and she did poison his kids against him (she had metal health issues). My dad and my SB & SS lost touch for more than 15 years until my Dad and SB bumped into each other in a pub (they were working across the road from each other). They did rebuild their relationship gradually - think years not weeks. Not only has it been very good for my Dad but also for my SB & SS as they understand more about where they come from. It also helps that they can have a proper relationship with a Dad who is normal bloke not a pantomime villain.

Arrgh need more coffee
HB & HS not SB and SS

Its probably inappropriate but pantomine villain made me laugh. That's what she is like. Everything is always so melodramatic, so out of proportion. Even a small slight or criticism causes a major reaction. She cannot have a rational conversation unless she's the one in control of the subject matter or we are placating her in which case she is delightful. In company she is perfectly normal. She saves any displeasure later for us.

I'm glad you're starting with therapy, wrinklyraisin. This is big stuff, and it's going to take a long time to unpack it all. Don't try and think through everything all at once and work out what's the best course of action (you overachiever, you!). Just make an appointment to talk to someone. And then go and talk to them. And then go and talk to them again.

Especially since you believed your Dad was a bad guy who didn't care about you, you've had to defend your mother to yourself. To be an emotional orphan is just too great a burden for most of us.

But some good stuff will come out of this. It really will. Just...one step at a time, for now.

LOL tortoise, I am totally the type of person that wants to have everything planned and sorted yesterday so as to cause minimal disruption to anyone else. I hate open ended situations. I hate not knowing an outcome.

One of the reasons I love my job and am so good at it is that I do what I know works, and I know what to expect at any given time, and I know how to deal with most situations that arise. I concentrate all my time and energy into my job and the results/rewards are visible and appreciated.

I have this huge gaping unknown around me in my personal life now. It's unsettling to say the least. I don't like not knowing where I stand or what's ahead. With my relationship with my mother I have always behaved a certain way to maintain the status quo, including defending her even if I knew deep inside she was wrong. I just always refused to believe she would choose a course of action that would actually deprive or harm her children. Now I know differently I am floored.

Anyway, before I start too much thinking again I should get back to work. I have that song from Finding Nemo in my head "Just keep swimming, just keep swimming..." Who'd have thought Disney/Pixar would actually provide a bit of therapy for me LOL.

So the inevitable shit has hit the fan. My mother and sister had a huge row. Mother sent us all an email outlining the row but it was all twisted to suit her, make her look the victim. Now all of my sibs and I are up the creek as she is losing the plot and we are (as always) to blame. She's saying awful, terrible things to my sisters. My brother is the golden boy so just gets to hear her sobbing and wretching on the phone. I cannot even bring myself to phone her as he email demanded we all did. I am so angry, so hurt. Also a little relieved that her true colors are out for us all to see. She is not right in the head. The things she is saying are just awful, blaming us for everything, saying her life would be better if our father had just accepted it when she said no (WTF???!!!).. and that if we don't want to hear the answers we shouldn't ask the questions. Oh God I am so glad I am thousands of miles away. I only wish I could be there for my siblings as they have dutifully called and and had to listen to her rip them to shreds

Bloody hell.

You can't make it better - she needs professinal help. I think the 'kindest' thing to do would be to recommend she see her GP as she is obviously distressed (not the response she is after as we all know) and bow out, firmly saying that you have your own issues to deal with at the moment, sorry mother dearest.

In a similar situation to yours I appointed Dh as a 'gatekeeper' at first. If she called, he would answer the phone, and to be honest I don't think I answered the door either for a few weeks after I told my mother I didn't want anything to do with her.

I did get counselling and to be honest this has got me to the stage where if she did turn up at my doorstep she would regret it! I feel I can hold my own now - I'm not terrified of her disapproval anymore.

You are not in control of her happiness only your own (I swear I just made that up, and it seemed less 'oprah' before I typed it!)

I hope your siblings can do the same?

Wrinkly, you seem to so want to make everyone feel better, and so horrified about the dramatic turn of events, all the drama in general, but this is out of your hands. Your mum's attempts to drag everyone in and take sides against your sister (triangulating) are best answered by you and your sibs making a vow to stick together through this, and ditch your mum, together. I love Nemofish's suggestion of a gatekeeper.

I guess I am not really shocked by the turn of events, it was always a case of when not if. My role of peacemaker/peacekeeper is hard to break free from even though I know it's not up to me to solve this.

I really just wish she would get help. It's frustrating that she won't. And it's heartbreaking to hear what she has said to my sisters, God only knows what she would say to me if I called. I don't want to hear it. All the sobbing and hyperventilating and empty threats of look at what we've reduced her life to, is it even worth it.

I always knew our family was dysfunctional, broken by various events, and she put us through a hell she now insists was all in our minds and how dare we all conspire together and make her out to be a monster, if only we knew what she went through for us... blah blah blah... am sick of hearing it and sick to my stomach of all this drama and vitriol she is creating. it is makimg me so stressed out and I do not have time for the physical affects of this, insomnia and anxiety and all that fun stuff. I really am scared I will have to quit my job and run away to a retreat somewhere and be completely alone. I can't handle it. It's like she has been possessed all of a sudden and it's bloody awful, unrecognizable.

OP, how about just giving yourself a break and not dealing with this at the moment? Get caller display on your phone and don't pick up if your mother calls. Delete her emails before reading them. Refuse to engage in the drama any more - and encourage your siblings to do the same. You don't have to respond to all this you know.

One of the hardest lessons to learn in life is that we cannot 'fix' everything. Another one is that we cannot make people love us. You've been unluck to have a mother that - to put it mildly - isn't much good, but don't let that damage the rest of your life as well. It's perfectly possible to come to terms with having toxic parents, you just need to do a lot of reading and be kind to yourself.

Your mother is a damaged and dangerous person, but that is not your fault. She needs help but she is an adult and it is up to her to seek it. If she refuses to help herself, seek help or even, in the end, if she chooses to do the worst to herself, then that is her decision.

I feel for you because I feel you are standing on the edge of a vortex and in danger of being sucked in. Don't let this happen to you. Your mother has done enough damage and caused you enough harm. You aren't responsible for her. Life is short and you deserve to be happy.

Take care.

Raisin

I feel so sorry for you. Only advice I could give is to let it go. Bad feelings eat you like cancer. If it were me I would go see mum, tell her (both face to face & followed up in writing) that you forgive her for being an evil selfish anti-mother or however you want to phrase it and confirm that you will not pay a penny for her old age and then walk away & go give your dad lots of cuddles & love and attention. Some people need forgetting. Maybe if ur mum comes back in the future & apologises or somesuch then you can evaluate as to whether it's genuine or not. Don't let this soulsucking attitude get you, you are better than that. Forgive & forget and give your dad a soppy wet daughter's kiss.

Your mother probably does not know she has a problem. She does not know that she sees things one way and the whole world sees them another way. She has her own reality and its as real to her as ours is to us.

She is like a toddler - she the centre of her own universe and anything she has to do to get her own way is perfectly acceptable. The only thing that matters is that people agree with her and give her what she wants.

It is unlikely that she will ever acknowledge this or seek help. Therefore the only power you have in this situation is how you react to her. You either carry on letting her run the show, with the occasional hiccup, or you don't.

The only positive note might be that if she were to see that the hysterical wailing and melodramatic abuse was no longer achieving her objective she might, just might, try another tack. To achieve this you would need to put on a united front with your siblings - as long as one of you is willing to listen to her she will have an outlet.

You must try to put her in a box in you mind and not let her contaminate the rest of your life. Put her and the situation out of your mind when you are at work. Allow yourself some time in the day to think about the problem and then put it away until next time.

Wrinklyraisin, have you seen a therapist? Have you talked to anybody about what is happening? Do you have a close friend/partner/doctor you could talk to about this?

What you are going through is huge and you deserve help to be able to cope with everything. It will hurt a lot. The problem is, once you become aware of what really went on, you cannot un-know it. All you can do is deal the way it makes you feel and try to recover from what you have been through.

I don't know if engaging with your mother is the most helpful thing to do. Hurtful as it is, there is very little chance she will acknowledge what she has done to you. But that is, unfortunately, often the case with abusive parents. It is heartbreaking and final and there is a lot of grief one needs to get through, but you can get through it.

I know it is difficult to imagine, but finding out the truth can be quite liberating. Once the panic attacks and the shock are gone, you will slowly start seeing things for what they really are, you will slowly start shedding the role of the peacemaker, you will stop making excuses for things which are indefensible. I really like that word and I think it applies to a lot of things you have been through.

But before that happens, give the SupportLine a call on 01708 765200. Phoning a helpline was for me the first step in recovering from abuse and I did a lot of crying then.

I would just write her out of my life completely. Too bad if she is in for a rough retirement, you reap what you sow.

Wrinklyraisin, I've only just found this thread and read through it. There's not much I can add to all the good advice here, I just wanted to post and say that the panic attacks will go. Please try not to be scared by them, your brain/body is just reacting to the shock, which is perfectly normal and healthy. I hope you are seeing a counsellor, that's the one thing that saved me from going over the edge, I won't say I'm at the point where everything's worked out with my mum but I've learned to love and care for myself, and that I wasn't to blame for anything that happened. I wonder if you, as the peacemaker, somewhere deep inside feel responsible in some way for your mum, or for what's happening to your siblings? It's a common feeling when you're abused, to somehow feel like you deserve it because you didn't do anything about it. Be kind to yourself, look at what a success you are, and your own family, you did this in spite of (or even because of) what has happened in the past. You sound to me like a strong person, someone who's learned to survive, don't let what she's doing now undermine you. All she deserves is your pity, if that.

Sending you some very non-MN hugs and good wishes!

'I really just wish she would get help. It's frustrating that she won't.' Wrinkly, the only person you can help is YOU. Don't get sucked in by guilt, responsibility, affection, fear of rejection, or a desire to help. Save yourself.

Wrinklyraisin, your story really hit a chord with me and I am so sorry for what you have and are still experiencing. I have two narcissistic parents, my father sexually abused me, my mother knows and still lives with him and was very angry with me when I finally told her what happened - all about her of course.

It is very difficult to escape the patterns of behaviour we learn from our parents and childhood but it can be done. Please try and find yourself a good therapist, someone who is able to work with the past and the unconscious. If you can afford to it might be worth going more than once a week but only if the therapist is trained to do so.

I haven't seen my father for almost 4 years, it hasn't been easy and I still sometimes get caught up in guilt (what if he dies?)and now see my mother in a way I am able to manage. I have had many years of therapy which has helped enormously and I now don't get caught up in the hysteria and drama that my mother still displays. I was even able to really shout at my brother recently when he had a go at me for not seeing my father (he knows the story), which was so liberating. Sadly my brother is still very enmeshed with my damaged parents. I am only saying this because I know how difficult it is to leave the web we can get caught up in. One step at a time.

Thanks again all of you for your repsonses. I had the harshest of harsh emails this morning basically blaming me for everything. I can't go into details on here but suffice to say everything SHE has done that has had a detrimental affect on my youngest sister in particular, is now MY fault and SHE is demanding I now fix all the fuck ups that she says I have made. She says my sister is suicicdal because of ME (bollocks, she is depressed because of what MUM did to her!) and that if my sister kills herself she hold me entirely responsible. I have spoken in depth with my sister who is not at all suicidal and CANNOT fathom what has made our mother say all this! SO I replied basically saying this is the end of the line. No response yet. I don't want to see her or speak to her for a very long time. To blame me for HER despicable and selfish acts is just unbelievable.

I will be getting some therapy as soon as I am back in my home country, am travelling with work on the other side of the world so have a bit of a distraction thank God. But I am not in a good way emotionally. I really think when I get back I will need some time off work to process this, start to deal with it all. In less than a month my whole life has come crashing down around me and apart from my siblings the only people I have been able to talk to are on an internet forum. That alone is just tragic even though you are all so lovely to take time and respond. I need person to person help now but I do appreciate all of your support in the meantime. it really is keeping my chin above water. Thank you.

Thank goodness you're overseas, Wrinkly, I thought you were staying up all night over this!

Even for those of us who've known how mad our parents are for some time, it's a tough thing to get your head around. The hardest part is (arguably) the implications for your own identity - if we grew up believing X and now we find it was Z all along, what then? As you must be discovering by now, that's where therapy comes in. It's very helpful to have an experienced guide, who is both qualified to validate your perceptions and to work through your disrupted psyche with you. Don't worry too much about this now: you're handling yourself very well and I'm confident you'll respond quickly once you can access the right help.

However desperately you want it, you simply aren't going to get the "answers", apologies or anything else you may desire from your mother. I know I'm repeating earlier posts - it bears repeating. The woman is very unwell. If you can raise a smidgeon of pity for her, do so because it's better for you that way. Your siblings are all going through the same shock - and, likely, processing it in different ways - so "clinging together loosely" would be the very best you can hope from each other right now. As things move forwards, you will find that your individual processes support one another - this happens automagically, you can't push it.

It's great that you've plenty to occupy your energies. Your emotional 'processing' will have already begun subconsciously, so let that happen while your conscious mind gets on with the here & now. You'll be okay. Take care

Very wise words from Grace. Also, don't judge yourself for only being able to talk to people over the internet - the most painful secrets, even if they are not your own, are the hardest to reveal. You are doing extremely well because I think it is very hard to keep a lid on it all when your world comes crashing down and somehow you are still expected to carry on. When it happened to me, everything had to go on hold immediately, so I really admire your composure.

Best of luck and plenty of support coming your way!

Thank you.

I am on autopilot. Youngblowfish, what you said about everything going on hold is so relevant for what I am feeling right this instant.

I didn't want to reveal too much real life job info IYSWIM as I am all too aware the more i say the more I could be identified in real life but I could actually do with some advice on that very thing. Basically I work as a nanny 6 days a week for a fairly HP family. I am on a few days break after working in Country A (where I used to live, and still have friends with whom I am now staying) for a few weeks. But I'm due to fly back to Country B, where I live and work normally, on Thursday night. I do not feel I am in any fit state to do my job. I set my standards really high and I know I am not capable of meeting them any more. I need time to breath. I am already panicking about letting my bosses down but I really wouldn't want to have a nanny in the mindset I am in. I don't know if they will understand, I like them but I don't want them to know all my personal problems. I would never take time off if it wasn't serious and in my mind I can hardly look after myself right now let alone a wee baby that needs me every hour of the day. How the hell does someone say to their boss they are not able to work, but not explain really why? They'll probably fire me as they need someone there for them no matter what.

But I really could do with some guidance on how to approach my bosses ASAP. They are expecting me on a flight on Thursday. I have very good friends here who I used to live with and am staying with, who are insisting that I stay here for a while where I feel safe and have their support. My work place is in a different country to the place I call home, so I am now torn as I feel like I need to be here at home, not away in a foreign place at work.

I've spent the last 3 weeks or so getting by, keeping busy, but until my time off started just in the last few days I have realized keeping busy isn't actually helping me. I have been really ill with a chest infection and generally feeling run down as I have not slept properly in weeks now. I've jst kept powering on and until I stopped I didn't realize how bad I feel and how I cannot continue. I cannot keep working the intense hours and job, AND be going through this hell inside my head and heart. I can't do it. So when you talk about putting things on hold, youngblowfish I know EXACTLY what you mean. I need to do that now I think.

Wraisin, just to say I've been following your thread and feeling for you a lot. I'm so sorry that you're going through this and there has been so many wonderful and supportive responses I didn't really know what else to say, but now, with your added dilemma over your job, I just wanted to send some support to you ...

I really do sympathise with your situation. It must be so hard to know that you're not in the right frame of mind to do your job properly but at the same time, not want to let others down. And I think, that not-wanting-to-let-others-down is symptomatic of your mum's selfish parenting and being made to feel responsible for others.

You know yourself best. If you can't do your job properly now, then you just can't. Your employers, fortunately, are nice people. They will understand ... but you have to inform them now, otherwise, if its the last minute and if they are put in a sticky situation of having to find a replacement at the last minute, then it won't do you any favours. I say it, not in the sense of you-have-to-do-it-now .. just that, again, if you don't want to let them down, this is the least you can do for them and yourself, if that makes sense.

In terms of telling them the truth, I can't say for sure if it might be the best option. TBH, I would prefer to cook up something (perhaps a physical health related issue, something like an ongoing migraine that really needs to be checked? ) .. as it is more transparent and when you are feeling better, you could say that you've treated and feeling better now. So then, it's end of the matter, iyswim.

From an employer's point of view, their children would be their priority. TBH, I'm not sure how they would react/think if they knew you were emotionally unstable at the moment. But you know them better ...but just a thought. I hope I'm not sounding harsh or giving you more to worry about than you already are.

Whatever it is, you definitely deserve a break and to find help and to help yourself. Sending big hugs to you ...

Oh my, just re-read my post .. I didn't mean 'that's the least you could do for your employers' in the way that you could do more but you're not!!

Argh, sorry!! And I don't know how to re phrase it without it coming all wrong again.

In a nutshell, I meant ... put what's best for yourself and don't let anyone pressurise you otherwise.