Found out some brutal stuff

[wrinklyraisin]

Over the last year I have found out from family member loads of things I didn't know about my mother. The main thing being she squirrelled away most of our child support payments (amounting to way over 75k) and is now living off that in a foreign country. All of her children are now adults.

After our parents divorced, our father bought a house outright for us to live in. Then the courts ordered he pay a substantial sum to mum each month for us. He earned a lot so we got a lot of maintenance. BUT from the age of 11 to 18 I have few memories of being allowed to buy new clothes, we had to wear second hand shop clothes, we had no holidays, no school trips, cheap food... meanwhile our mother took up several expensive habits, and complained to us all the time that our father NEVER paid maintenance thus we had to suffer and to blame HIM not her. She bworked very very part time so I know ashe never earned enough to fund her lifestyle at that time.

Since then I have seen court documents, bank statements and solicitors letters. So I know for a fact our father DID pay thousands and thousands for us every year. This was years ago now and I am FURIOUS at my mother for lying, for keeping the money, for letting me destroy my relationship with my father, as I believed he never paid or cared. I don't know what to say to my mother now. I want to sue her or something for years of deceipt, for withholding the money that was supposed to benefit us children. Our father lived 400 miles away and we hardly ever saw him, so he was never truly aware of the fact we did not reveive the full benefits of his maintenance. Now he knows the truth he is astounded and angry too. He says he paid a LOT so we would have a good life despite his not being a part of it any more.

I am so angry and so sad. I don't want to rehash old issues but this knowledge has made everything come back to the surface. FFS Mum made us go without shampoo and conditioner and deodarant as teenage girls as she "couldn't afford it". We had to use cheap supermarket soap to wash our hair. I used to steal friends body spray at aleepovers. We lived in a lovely house though and no one ever really knew what went on behind closed doors. My clothes were embarassing. Thank God for school uniforms.

My mother is unstable, I suspect bipolar. She's made some very poor decisions in raising us. Yet now we are adults her memories of our childhood are VERY different from ours. Apparently we were raised free and liberal and wanted for nothing. Ok. I remember cutting mouldy crusts off white bread to make sandwiches for school. She would buy a certain amount of cheap and nasty food on a Saturday and by Thursday we'd often have to choose lunch or dinner as we couldn't have both.

Now she lives in an amazing house in a lovely country. She "retired" at 45 with her new husband. She considers herself the victim in life as she never wanted a cheating husband, or ungrateful children, etc etc...

I work bloody hard and earn a fair amount. She is now demanding I start contributing towards a savings account for HER and her DH as they want supporting once they are old. and apparently I OWE her.

I am so messed up over this, I know I need therapy or something. But I am also wanting to see what recall we children have for the maintenance that we never benefitted from. It was years ago. But the ramifications of her actions have affected all of us children as adults.

Ugh what a mess.

If you've read this far thank you.

I didnt have a good childhood either.

BUT heres what I think,you are older and indeed wiser now-you cant get back whats happened and you cant be expected to forget it either - your mother is either very ill or very evil,reduce your contact with her dont even think about financing her old age.

Your Dad whilst hes still alive you can still build a bridge,a simple note from yourself to him saying you know more about your childhood and your anger and blame at him was misdirected,can you start again as adults....im sure will be welcomed by him.

Move forward in your life with your family and strengthen your bond with your dad,strong bridges take time to build.

Dont waste your time feeling bitter,you are far bigger than that.

Dear god, you poor thing, and your poor brother and sister.

I cannot recommend conselling enough - even though the reason I went and had it was not even in the same league as the things you have to pour out.
That is exactly what you can do, just pour out everything, every detail that you want to let go. And you don't have to worry about what the person you are talking to is thinking, because it is about you.

I agree that she has no intention of killing herself, it is purely an attention seeking mechanism.

Focus on your relationship with your siblings, and let that be your starting point for building bridges with your father.

I wish you best of luck in resolving your feelings.

for you wrinklyraisin. Sorry you have had to go through this.

I feel for your teenage self - it is a shocking thing to have your young self so neglected and dismissed.

I would probably cut all contact with her if I were you. From the story you told about her 'suicide' attempt, she is not going to accept any responsibility, and would continue to manipulate and use you. You don't need that any more.

I just wanted to add my voice to the others who are furious on your behalf and so sorry for what you had to go through.

Your mother is a horrible person. Please, please don't you or your siblings give her a penny. It seems like money is all that matters to her so that's the best way to get your own back. I'd cut her off completely to be honest.

I hope you can build a good relationship with your father now you know the truth.

This is a good NPD mothers link. Maybe it won't tell you the full story about your mother, but maybe it will?

The power imbalance is very striking in your relationship with your mother. Do you realise you can screen your calls and change your e-mail address or block her e-mails? You can simply choose not do this dance with your mother any more. How she reacts to what you choose is not your responsibility.

I've been up half the night reading about mothers with NPD and I cannot believe my mother has pretty much every trait on the list. I also cannot believe I fit the exact description of the over achiever child. I have always done everything to please her, to gain approval, and she has never once congratulated me on my success. Nope. Its all because of HER that I did so well and that's why I owe her. The only real attention I got from her (I thought) was when we had a car accident and I was injured in hospital. But looking back she was basking in being the poor mother of an injured child! Same when I had appendicitis! And I craved that attention so I self harmed but subtly so it always looked like an accident but I would end up in hospital and she would click over me. Fuck. Pardon my bad language. So much is making sense now. I'm both intensely relieved and furiously scared about what to do. I read so many articles that could have been written exactly about my mother. Its incredible. And I'm scared for ME. I have internalized so much but the things I have displayed to the outside world are so worrying. I really have a mental illness too because I went through what I did. I knew that, have known it for a long time. Just thought I was unreasonable, irrational and that I needed to get over it. I really do wish I could run away. Now I see what's really been going on its more real. More serious.

She emailed me last night too. Saying why haven't I contacted her she is feeling neglected by her children. She won't call me though. Just send guilt inducing little messages like that until I call her. And then its like I've done something wrong.

She's toxic, go get the therapy you need to get well from this and don't look back.

LivingWellIsTheOnlyThingYouCanReallyDoForYourselfTiggaxx

You need to see a therapist so you can develop the self-esteem to cut this person out of your life.

IF she is mentally ill, that is her problem to sort out, not yours.

I suffer from depression, it makes me sick when it's bandied about as an excuse for terrible behaviour, because it just stigmatises mental illness and those who suffer from them as dire people.

Bollocks.

DON'T save a penny for this gal and believe me, your life will be better once she is out of it for good.

What a waste of space!

When you're ill and you're a mother, you do whatever it takes to get as well as you can for your kids.

Very good advice on this thread, especially about regaining contact with your father and trying to build a relationship with him.

That relationship might help you rebuild your relationship with your sibs as well. From some of the things you have said (your sister punching you), it sounds as though they blame you as well, which is not fair on you. Managing that will be complicated, though, as no-one should tell them their feelings are invalid. They are not invalid, but misdirected. Perhaps your father could help with this.

What about your mother's husband? Have you met him? Is he complicit in all this?

you know what wrinkly, children learn to adapt and respond to the situation they are in - children are actually remarkable little beings! You were just adapting to the treatment you received. In fact, you sound remarkably resilient and the only one with the issue sounds like your mother.

Lean on your siblings in this too (if you have a relationship with them) as their recall of the situation might be enlightening to you too.

oh sorry winged, hadn't read your post before I made mine and see you have made a similar point!

My mothers husband worships the ground she walks on. She can do no wrong. In his view we children are ungrateful and don't appreciate what she went through for us. Even though he only entered the picture ten or so years ago. He drives me a little insane actually in that even when my mother has a ranting session its not her fault, its ours.

wrinklyraisin: a lot of what you have posted has been about money. This seems to be important to your mother and a defining influence in her life.

Is that how you want to live your life? Or do you want love to be the most important thing? Surround yourself by those who love you and make you feel good about yourself. Those who don't (you know who I mean) can be kept at arm's length.

Have the strength to live your life and don't feel responsible for your mother's health/wealth/anything else. It gets easier as the years roll by: just flatly refuse her demands without feeling the need to justify yourself, don't enter into debate.

Hello WR, how very upsetting for you to find all of this out. You can thank your lucky starts that your father is still alive and that you have a chance to build a relationship with him and get to know the kind and generous man he really is.

I am very for you that your mother has betrayed you like this, putting you and your siblings through so much hardship for her own benefit. It seems to go against the very grain of being a mum, to take something from your children and let them go without but stuffing it into her own pocket.

I am unsure if there is any legal recourse as I bbelieve the maintenance money can be spent as she deems it fit, but why not spend 30mins with a legal egal and find out?

Do your siblings know what's ben going on? Are you all on one page in regards to your mum? How did you find all of this out if you don't mind me asking? Can you tell your mother that you know? Maybe all of you could go stone silent on her and together pen her a letter to let her know how you all feel about her. Then cut her out.

Remember, hate is a very strong emotion and requires a lot of energy. I wouldn't waste that on a person that has done you so much wrong.

Try and be kind and reach out to your poor Dad, it's not his fault that it all ended up like this.

Oh my Lord. You poor thing. I hope one thing that you can salvage from this is a new relationship with your father - who obviously did and does care very much.

she won't kill herself. She will, however, use the threat of it to control you.

In your shoes, I'd send her an email, with scanned copies of as many of the documents you mentioned on here as you can.

And the words

Fuck
You

and then bin her forever.

Change email addresses. I would say just delete but, given your relationship of appeasement, the temptation to read them would be too strong.

Do your siblings get contact from her as well and also think that she is appalling? Or have they already cut her out of their lives?

You mentioned your father sending solicitor's letters re her harassment of him and I wonder if you will have to go down that path with her, although thankfully she is in another country so actually removing points of contact should be quite easy.

When someone is that poisonous you cut them out of your life and focus on those who love and care for you.

wrinklyraisin, I have an NPD mother who I cut contact with 12 years ago, which was the second best decision of my life. (The best was leaving my personality disordered, abusive ex last year). I have also the misfortune to have a very disturbed and odd father, but that's another story.

This book was very influential and my Mum conforms to the avenging angel type. She sounds a lot like yours. But it took me two years to make the decision. It's not easy and IME it's not as easy as telling her to fuck off and break contact.

Give yourself time and visit your GP tomorrow to get some meds prescribed. It will help you get through this enormous traumatic shock. FWIW I think counselling is not what you need, but proper psychotherapy with someone who understands child abuse and neglect.

There's plenty of us here who've experienced similar, you're not alone.

Thank you so much everyone again, for your input. It is so helpful to hear personal stories similar to mine. You've no idea (or maybe you do?) how I was isolating myself and beating my head against a brick wall again and again to try and make things "better"... and then when I finally saw the documents and everything fell into place I now know it's not a situation I can make better. I can't make my mother better, more to the point. God I have struggled so much, given up on a lot of my own dreams, in order to make her happy/proud. I realize this makes me kind of narcassistic in that now I think I sound all woe is me woe is me. And that scares me.

I can't remember who asked about my siblings but yes, we have all sat down and seen the documents together. We all have our own experiences of what our mother put us through. We all remember the deprivation. But then my sister remembers she was ignored, my brother remembers he was smacked a lot, I was pressured to be "good"... she used us all in different ways just like the articles described. My sister has her own children now and doesn't have too much to do with our mother, just the bare minimum really. I get the brunt of that of our mother as I get told that I need to sort my sister out. My brother just seems to get on with it, he doesn't let what she says affect him, he's polite and civil now but nothing more really. The three of us will hug and kiss her and be "good" children in her presence but as she lives abroad we don't see her that often. Which is yet another thing I am told to "sort out". Everything is my responsibility, she is not held accountable for anything.

One other thing that struck me as hugely significant is reading the traits was the overtly sexual behaviour. She flirts with everyone, and is totally inappropriate. I remember as a teenager stopping bring guy friends around as she would act so inappropriately towards them. I know from an ex friend of hers she makes passes at married men. She seems to act so entitled to everything and everyone.

I don't know how to deal wih cutting contact. I think my life would be infinitely lighter without her in it. But I still feel so responsible for keeping her stable/happy even though I know I am not meant to that I cannot see how I can just tell her to fuck off. Trust me though I would like to, in an alternate universe. I am cross at myself for feeling so weak.

Thanks again for all your advice. I really needed a place like this to tell my story where no one knows me and no one knows my mother, and there's no judgement. It's a good halfway house to actually having to physically tell someone what I feel. I will go to the Dr tomorrow, I do think I need something to turn my brain off for a while. It's spinning, and I cannot seem to just slow down and calm down now. I don't feel normal or together and I don't like it

Two really important things I have learned from this. Do not lie to your children about their Father and definitely keep court papers. Locked in a dreadful battle with a nutter ex myself and i have always been honest with my children, even to my own detriment and despite his dreadful behaviour I have always reassured them that he loves them. He doesn't pay maintenance and makes things very difficult and I made a decision early on to be kind about their father. I really feel for you, not only are you going to have to deal with the past and your perception of how things are but always working out a relationship with your Father. I would write him a letter, explain yourself and ask him to start again. If he has been decent and paid for his children all that time, this makes him a good man and I think you def, can work things out. I would forget the financial redress with your mother, it's just money and extracting it would be painful and unecessary, however, the idea of you contributing to her upkeep is outrageous. I am so sorry for you but I think all you can do is get yourself some help to reframe your childshood and accept it is done, the most important thing now is to be happy and to try to rebuild things with your dad.

You will need to do a lot of work on co-dependency issues and try to disentangle yourself. I agree with the psychotherapy suggestion; some of this stuff runs very deep. Don't be cross with yourself -- none of this was your doing. You did not choose this. You were unwittingly cast in a role, as a child, by an adult who was and remains a nightmare.

The fact that you are now going through such shock and feeling so bad about the role you have played shows you are a nice, normal human being who needs a bit of help because of the horrible hand she was dealt. Look back kindly on the child you once were and give her a mental hug -- she did the absolute best she could in that poisonous atmosphere and has come out of it with nothing to be ashamed of, and a good heart despite it all.

WR - so sorry to read about your childhood, sounds awful especially as it was not the childhood your father intended for you and which has put such a strain on your relationship!

One thing I noticed you saying was panic attacks, I used to suffer from these with stress and I have to say I went to meet with acouncellor about it and it made a world of difference, by expressing myself to someone who I knew could not repeat things it got them off my chest. I would say that this would be an investment in your mother's future so to think about paying for her dotage..............well I wouldn't be doing it.

I really hope you are able to start up a better relationship with your father, I expect he feels the only thing that can be done is to wait for you to make a move, please get in contact with him and just say hello even if you can't do anything else. The other thing I would do is write a letter to you mother BUT not post it, write it all down cathartically and keep it. Then if you need to when you are feeling more on track you can destroy it or post it without feeling guilty. I doubt she is going to kill herself, people who commit suicide don't really announce the fact before hand.

Good luck with it all.

I am so entangled with my mother, I don't know where our own threads begin or end. I hear what you're saying that as a child I didn't choose my role. But I carried it on as an adult for so many years, and I have always thought I was the problem so I just kept on trying to be "better". It's really hard to let that go, to stop being "me" if you see what I mean? I don't know who "I" am if I stop being the same person I have always been.

I do have an action plan though which makes me feel a bit less out of control. I am calling my Dr first thing tomorrow for an appointment. Hopefully he will give me something to at least help with the panic. Maybe he will know a psychotherapist too. I have to work this week, I can't get out of it. I am glad though as it means I have to concentrate on something else. Hopefully I won't have to speak to her for a few days. I will try not to.

I keep reading this thread and it is so helpful to feel your support. I can't say thank you enough.

No, you really didn't have a choice about how you behaved as an adult. Nor did your siblings -- they followed the roles assigned to them too, as children and as adults. In some ways, they have had an easier time because their treatment forced them to cut themselves off from her emotionally, whereas the treatment you got forced you to continue your role far into your adult years.

You should all go to family therapy together and try to forge a new relationship -- maybe your father could be included in this? You have all been shaped by your mother, not just you.

If she has NPD remember that she is unlikely - very very unlikely to ever be able to see it much less do anything about it. I think (someone correct me if I'm wrong) that it's seen as being practically untreatable. All you can do is distance and protect yourself.