Found out some brutal stuff

[wrinklyraisin]

Over the last year I have found out from family member loads of things I didn't know about my mother. The main thing being she squirrelled away most of our child support payments (amounting to way over 75k) and is now living off that in a foreign country. All of her children are now adults.

After our parents divorced, our father bought a house outright for us to live in. Then the courts ordered he pay a substantial sum to mum each month for us. He earned a lot so we got a lot of maintenance. BUT from the age of 11 to 18 I have few memories of being allowed to buy new clothes, we had to wear second hand shop clothes, we had no holidays, no school trips, cheap food... meanwhile our mother took up several expensive habits, and complained to us all the time that our father NEVER paid maintenance thus we had to suffer and to blame HIM not her. She bworked very very part time so I know ashe never earned enough to fund her lifestyle at that time.

Since then I have seen court documents, bank statements and solicitors letters. So I know for a fact our father DID pay thousands and thousands for us every year. This was years ago now and I am FURIOUS at my mother for lying, for keeping the money, for letting me destroy my relationship with my father, as I believed he never paid or cared. I don't know what to say to my mother now. I want to sue her or something for years of deceipt, for withholding the money that was supposed to benefit us children. Our father lived 400 miles away and we hardly ever saw him, so he was never truly aware of the fact we did not reveive the full benefits of his maintenance. Now he knows the truth he is astounded and angry too. He says he paid a LOT so we would have a good life despite his not being a part of it any more.

I am so angry and so sad. I don't want to rehash old issues but this knowledge has made everything come back to the surface. FFS Mum made us go without shampoo and conditioner and deodarant as teenage girls as she "couldn't afford it". We had to use cheap supermarket soap to wash our hair. I used to steal friends body spray at aleepovers. We lived in a lovely house though and no one ever really knew what went on behind closed doors. My clothes were embarassing. Thank God for school uniforms.

My mother is unstable, I suspect bipolar. She's made some very poor decisions in raising us. Yet now we are adults her memories of our childhood are VERY different from ours. Apparently we were raised free and liberal and wanted for nothing. Ok. I remember cutting mouldy crusts off white bread to make sandwiches for school. She would buy a certain amount of cheap and nasty food on a Saturday and by Thursday we'd often have to choose lunch or dinner as we couldn't have both.

Now she lives in an amazing house in a lovely country. She "retired" at 45 with her new husband. She considers herself the victim in life as she never wanted a cheating husband, or ungrateful children, etc etc...

I work bloody hard and earn a fair amount. She is now demanding I start contributing towards a savings account for HER and her DH as they want supporting once they are old. and apparently I OWE her.

I am so messed up over this, I know I need therapy or something. But I am also wanting to see what recall we children have for the maintenance that we never benefitted from. It was years ago. But the ramifications of her actions have affected all of us children as adults.

Ugh what a mess.

If you've read this far thank you.

Wrinkly, I am shocked by your story. I have a website you may find useful Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers

You have every right to feel shocked and angry. By every means write her a letter detailing what you now know about your upbringing. However, toxic parents tend to lie deny everything or at best try to minimise it all by saying "I tried my best".

I would see a councellor before going down the legal avenue.

Your mother is clearly obsessed by money and does sound mentally ill. I think it would be a very good idea to take a break from home - no contact whatsoever - to give yourself time to process everything and discuss with your siblings. I doubt if any future relationship with her can bring you anything but more pain but you probably need to feel a little stronger before deciding whether to cut off all contact permanently.

My DH suffered from panic attacks very similar to yours to the extent where he was convinced he was having a heart attack. Breathing exercises and meditation helped him a lot and he was prescribed beta blockers for a while.

for you

from 'her' not 'home'

wrinkly your posts have made me cry.

what a terrible thing to have done to you. she robbed you of your dignity and of your right t a decent relationship with your father.

she sounds truly toxic and very narcissistic. there's lots of good support threads on here, including the "stately homes" bunch over in relationships.

i had a similar experience with divorced parents where everything was always my fault - my parents' divorce (when I was 4), the fact that mum now had to work to support us, the fact that we couldn't always afford new stuff/holidays. i never had the right school uniform bits or a proper lunch for school. then when my stepdad came along ( a truly lovely man) we could never make any noise/ask for any money for trips etc as it might "upset" him and he wasn't our "real" dad so we were always reminded......the catalogue of stuff is endless...if I ever got upset over anything I was laughed at and teased.

I grew up feeling inadequate, insecure, worthless. Even when i was the victim of a serious crime in my teenage years it was implied that it was my fault.....

Now as an adult I have a seemingly ok relationship with my mother but we are not close. It's all very polite but I feel nothing. I have had several years of counselling and feel i have detached myself from it all. I've accepted that I can't change the past but that I will never forgive the way I was treated.

I haven't seen my dad for close to 30 years and suspect he may no longer be around. I also suspect he probably want the evil person I was always told he was. I will never know now and I find that the hardest part to accept. I don't even know his name or date of birth as he left when I was tiny.

Good luck whatever you decide to do; it won't be easy but hopefully eventually you will make peace with it all before it's too late in your Dad's case.

That's my mother's most frequently uttered line, TheCrackFox "I did my best"...along with "I must have done something right, look at you all now" and "You've no idea, NO IDEA, how hard my life has been. You have nothing to moan about"

Whatever we do, she is always one upping with a sadder, more tragic, more woe is me story. and she totally negates/denies/fluffs over anything we say happened in our childhood. The cliff incident was because my sister remembered seeing her hitting our brother again and again and again at aged 3 because he wouldn't lie down in bed and go to sleep!!!! 10 years later she confronted our mother about it as our mother made a comment about she had never hit us kids (yet another reason we were to feel "lucky")... My mother freaked out screaming and crying and ran out of the house and drove to the coast (only a short way away) and we got our neighbour to drive after her and we literally had to placate her and tell her WE were wrong so she would come home. I wish then we had got some proper help, from the police or the doctors or someone. But we just dealt with it and nothing was really the same after that. It's not a good situation

Oh Raisin, this story is so terrible. I think you should cut all ties with her for your own sanity.

I'm a hypocrite saying that though. I have a stepmother who I lived with from the age of 6 onwards. She sounded simular in personality to your mum only without the money issues (there was no divorce etc). The link posted about emotional abuse by cansomeonehelp is also relevant to me-the gaslighting being very relevant. I havent cut ties with my stepmother (she's still married to my father). She abused me in the most horific ways as detailed in that link. According to her I had the most wonderful childhood.

She has mental heath issues. She was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder-(although she's forgotton about that as well
Could your mum have something simular? The blaming and the 'poor me' stuff and the suicide threats certainly fit the pattern.

I know the only way to move on is to cut contact but I'm too chicken. Everytime I visit them the sweat literally runs down my back.

Oh this is just heartbreaking .

Do check out the Stately Homes threads- I think you will find a lot of support and understanding there.

I will check those threads BitOfFun, thank you for letting me know about them. It's sad but I do feel a little better knowing there are others who have got this kind of thing going on in their lives. I feel like it's so gigantically wrong, it's just NOT what mothers are supposed to be like.

My mother is definitely mentally ill. We have thought that for a very long time. But she lives a very isolated life, and does not seem to see a need for help IYSWIM? She and her DH live their lives and she just sends her poison from afar. Phone calls make me sweat. I always feel the need to lie about my life, amke everything all happy and smooth so she doesn't start on her stories. But even then that backfires as she goes onto the whole "you earn more money than us" and "it's about time you started thinking about paying me back for all my hard work"...

I know what you mean about being too chicken to cut contact. I cannot imagine doing it as the ramifications would be terrible and I am scared of rocking the boat. I know I'm not responsible for how she acts but years of conditoning have left me afraid to do anything other than be the Peacemaker.

I think it's because in that situation you become adept at staying out of the line of fire and you learn to placate people,- as the ramifications of not doing so are so horrific.
As a result you're left in a situation where it's second nature for you to absorb things rather than express your distress/anger. I think your panic attacks are an extension of this

I think you've hit the nail on the head victoria, I have spent years absorbing things, making things "better"... I can't remember a time where I ever got verbally cross at my mother, in her presence IYSWIM. I always made sure I bit my tongue, took a deep breath, pushed the anger etc to the back of my mind. I've got so much going on in my head now, it's all so negative and angry and festering and bad. I feel like I might literally lose the plot if I start speaking to anyone about this.

i agree with sending your dad a letter. yes, he's not been a saint, but he's been a lot better than your mum.

i would like to say 2 words to your mum: fuck you.

but i really really think you need to get some counselling to start dealing with this abuse. and i do think you need to try and cut contact with your mum. she is responsible for herself, not you. it is her decision to act the way she is. you could call the authorities if you suspect she will attempt suicide.

i also strongly feel that she had no intention of driving off the edge of the cliff. it's all part of the melodrama that envelopes her life and gets her all the attention. she will probably do something similar if you cut contact again as it's worked in the past. but you have to keep strong and remind yourself that it's HER CHOICE, just like it was her choice to deprive you as a child.

I can't fully get my head around the realisation that for so many years she CHOSE for us to live off crappy white bread (that often went mouldy and we'd have to cut the mouldy crusts off) and tins of tomato soup (can't go near the stuff now) and the cheap harsh soap... When in her bathroom she had Nivea and stuff that we were banned from using. I remember when I started getting breasts and periods she bought me 3 bras too big and said I would have to make them last. She would buy me sanitary pads, like a pack of 16 and if they ran out I would use bunched up cheap toilet roll. When I got a Saturday job at 15 with our neighbour, she had our neighbour give the money to her and then my mother would tell me it was my bed and board. A few times I got a tip and wouldn't tell my mother and I would get a school lunch or two.

I am so sorry to harp on and moan it must make for boring and depressing reading. But it is very cathartic to get it out and I really do appreciate so much all of your replies and support.

Another voice to validate your anger and grief.

I very much hope for you that you and your siblings can stay united and that your father will be heartened that you finally have the truth.

I think the Stately homes thread will give you great ideas and support about how to extracate yourself safely from a woman who appears to be cold, calculating, deeply selfish and devoid of empathy.

Your story has shocked and saddened me wrinklyraisin. I have no advice, just wanted to say that my heart goes out to you. I simply CANNOT get my head around how a mother could be so unutterably selfish. And to expect you to start saving for HER old age??? Unbelievable. That is the last thing I would expect of my children.

Sorry for not saying anything more constructive.

I dont know the full details of your relationship with your Dad but what I do know is that friends who had their relationships with their dc sabotaged by exp(usually wives sadly) have all been pleased when their adult children have started to get in touch again and resumed the relationship.

I think its important to remember that you have both been manipulated by your mother, you were only a child and it would be unrealistic to expect you to behave as a mature adult in those circumstances.

Similarly when you get talking to your Dad you may well find he felt powerless over the situation. Many do.

I hope you do manage to reconcile with your father and salvage something from your childhood and your mother.

finally I dont think your mum will kill herself either - her sense of self worth sounds too strong.

I feel so sorry for you and also but not at all . I am well aware how vile some mothers can be.

Do you have a good relationship with your father now?

Does your mother know you know?

Obviously you must not give her anything and tbh I wouldn't be having any contact with her at all if I were you.

I am not sure you can do anything but it would be worth seeing a solicitor.

If your mother did kill herself (and imo she won't. Far too much ££££ left to spend) it would not be your fault. Mine threatened to kill herself if I didn't invite her to my wedding. Unfortunately she didn't oblige.

Cant add anything of use, apart from my support to your anger, sadness and horror that a mother could want to see her children live like this

She won't kill herself, people like this would rather kill everyone else in the world than put themselves at risk

am quite shocked at the similarity between your memories and mine actually! My mother is scarily close to yours in her behaviour and attitude, including the suicide threats

and if she is stood up to she tantrums like a spoiled toddler, alternating between vicious, hurtful rages and fits of pathetic heart-broken crying at how hard and cruel we all are

I fucked her off four years ago and I haven't looked back. I finally have a LIFE - a job, friends, hobbies - things couldn't have when I had to carry her all the time.

Get shot, is my advice. She's an endless vortex of need which you will never, ever satisfy even if you grind yourself into the dust and die trying - so get shot of her now and save yourself the grief.

What an awful discovery - but also one that should open doors to a relationship with a proper parent - your Dad. I imagine he would be only too delighted if you got in touch. Why not write him a letter telling him what you have told us?

Conversely I would cut your appalling mother out of your life since she only brings woe and is no mother in the real sense.

Take comfort in immediate family, friends, siblings and your father.

wrinkly your mum sounds like she is driven by power. power to decide what you and your siblings were/weren't allowed to eat-deliberately not letting you use her nice soap etc because she COULD,she had the power to control you, quite simply....then when she sensed you were breaking away from her as children by criticising her actions she used her power to threaten suicide to control you all - the threat of abandonment being dangled by her threatening to leave you all for good as a kind of punishment....now she wants the power to control your happiness, your finances by guilt-tripping and emotional abuse.

please get some counselling - it is so useful for taking charge of your own life again and finding the strength to deal with all of this stuff. you have the power to choose not to take any more of her crap.

Thank you all so much for your replies, I am a bit overwhelmed with all of your support. I have always downplayed if not outright denied my own feelings on things and this is the first time I have really acknowledged everything in black and white and had to face it. I have finally told myself the elephant in the room does exist.

I am scared witless. I have moments where I can't breath. I want to run away and never see anyone again. I know I can't do that so my next step is getting in touch with my father. I am too wobbly to talk to my siblings at the moment as I will regress back to my peacemaker "oh well, things can't have been that bad" role, as that's what I have always done. Even during the pow wow my sister wanted to punch me as I would start to defend our mother! I know what she did what indefensible (is that a word)and I have got to stop covering for her, stop being so bloody nice and woolly and blind. It's so hard though. She's made me feel like I am totally responsible for maintaining her happy existence on this planet. I can't do it any more.

I am sorry some of you also have vile (great word) mothers. if I am completely honest I think a lot of her treatment/words/choices have made my 30 odd years of life very, very difficult. I will never get that time back and I think it's the grief of that loss that takes my breath away

My mother made choices that have fucked up my whole life even though I haven't lived with her since I was a baby and haven't seen her for over 15 years. It is really hard to deal with. I am so sorry for you.

You're absolutely right wrinkly, you are grieving for what could have been and you have every right to do so. Although my experiences were of a different sort, I also had terrible things happen during my childhood/teens that sent my life on a very different course to the one I feel it should have had, and I also can't helping grieving - with all the anger, denial, questioning etc. that entails - for things that never were. I'm so sorry for you and I genuinely hope that this painful start can lead onward and upward to the life you deserve.

wrinklyraisin I just wanted to say that I'm so sorry you had to go through this but I'm very happy to see all the support you've had here.

You do not need to justify your actions to your mother or any negative poster on this board.

I think therapy will be wonderful to try and help you come to terms with this.