For those with narcissistic parents - care to join me?

[roseability]

How have you come to peace with this situation, knowing they will never be able to give you normal family love?

How do you keep an emotional distance and protect yourself?

Should they be allowed access to your own children?

Are they abusers?

I gave the card back in the end, it came up via my Dad (whom she is divorced and now hates) and I just thought it felt so wrong to accept anything from her, it was one card addressed to all three DDs, not even one each. I am going to tell my brother to tell her if she wants to give them money, she should open a bank account for each of them herself. She probably won't as this would require effort on her part and she is the laziest person I know.

I think part of it is that she is actually jealous of me, maybe she feels I was given more opportunities than she was (generational thing), she has remarked that I make her feel beneath me even as a child and that she didn't have the benefit of a uni education (a uni education I had to move out of her house to complete as she did everything she could to make me fail). She never has a compliment of anything nice to say about me, she will always make some comment on my appearance. I see her as a emotional vampire, she sucks all good out of everything, her phonecalls were either all about how ill she was, how poor she was trying to make me feel sorry for her or slagging off someone else, very negative. I think she feels that she was made redundant as a mother having this opinionated, independent little daughter who wouldn't agree with her so she focused all her energy on my brother who in her words was "slower" than me. To me that's just little girls and boys.

The other thing is that all she has done with her life really is have 2 children, me and my golden boy brother. She was very negative when I told her I was pregnant the first time, completely negative the second time as she had told me I had to wait 2 years before TTC again like she did, when I had a mc with DB3 she told me it was for the best as 3 DC would be expensive, she has never bothered with DD2 or 3 and I think as I now have 3 DC I have bettered her at being a mother (rubbish I know) so she uses the well I have hit the jackpot and have had one of each stick to beat me with, even down to telling me DP will leave me if I cannot give him a son as all men want sons apparently.

DD1 hasn't even mentioned her this Christmas, she knows she is my Mummy but that's about it really, she never had a relationship with her, when she did visit, she sat on the sofa and practically ignored her after 10 minutes, it requires effort to talk to and interact with a small child.

Sorry to have a rant, I agree distance is a key factor, we live about 60 miles away from my Mother now and that's great not that she visited much when we didn't.

You just have to refocus on something else, and that's so much harder than it sounds when you've been trained from birth to be the satellite of a N.

When it comes to small, defenceless children, Ns show their true colours, imo. Because they are motivated primarily by fear, they can't imagine a win-win situation. They must come up on top in every interaction, or else lick the boots of someone they idealise. With children, they assume they are superior, and behave badly, in general.

There's no give and take for them with other people, no happy medium. The only give and take that they are capable of is possible while they figure out if you're an alpha type of not. They do this with everyone, children to the very old. They do not behave as adults. This is why children are not safe with them. Time spent with an N will usually leave a child feeling as if something was amiss. They feel insecure.

Hello

Just joining in, because they fit. Actually my Mum has recently decided she's Asperger - and I agree with her (looks & sounds like NPD, but without the malicious intent). Daddy was fucked up from head to toe, probably more a fully-fledged PD (psycho) than anything else.

It's no coincidence, I'm sure, that my life imploded - and I started therapy - the year after he died.

We did manage to get on quite well once I'd grown up enough to get some distance and 'manage' him. As the downside of that, he then turned the full force of his malice on my mum

You all have gallons of my sympathy. Trying to learn how 'normal' people live & love, when you grew up with such a twisted version, is a task and a half! I couldn't have done it without scads of professional help - in fact, I haven't finished doing it yet

Love, hugs, patience and optimism!!

happy new year to you all.

may we all have a drama free 2010.

xoxoxoxox

(i will add this was the first christmas and new year where i havent missed my mother, i think i may have turned a corner, and i feel this thread has helped me towards that, so a huge thank you to you all and like i said i hope this next year will be drama free and a happy one for all of us.)

Hi

Going to join on this thread ask for some advice. Mum is probably narcissictic as is my exh so have been living with it all my life and am now preconditioned to being controlled and critisiced that I have huge problems setting boundaries.

I am mixing with a lot of "normal" people now so starting to really see the difference but still struggling with me mum.

I can't work out if there is some truth in what she says or whether I should ignore if completely and how to do that!

I still look to her for emotional support - always get hurt but also enbd up feeling that I am bad or wrong. I would like to stop looking for support (I sometimes don't even realise that that is what I am doing until I get hurt)

Current problems are to do woith exH. He was emotionally and physically abusive and am si much better off without him. Most people ( i dont have alot of support) tell ,me that but my mum treats it differently.
She describes the abusive behaviour as "hearsay" which I find upsetting as I have never made things up.
She believes fully and told me recently that if she had been married to my husband she would have tolerated his bahviour - very possibly true BUT she claims that she ( and oher people) would have made him into a normally functioning persona and therefore have a good marriage.
When I talk about selling our house and getting divorced (separted 2 years) she sayd "so your not getting back together again. Bascially she undermines me and maked me feel like I caused all the problems. My son last year (he was 4) was a bit demanding and childish - similar ot exH behaviour that was apparently confirmation that I was the cause of the problems as I had allowed it to happen in my son as well. I believe his behaviour was acceptable for his age. I want her to show me some emotional support - I know I will never get it.

There are lots of other problems as well. I was mentioning difficulty getting ds2 a speech therapy appointment and that reassuringly nursery were not concerned. I mentioned that 2 friends (a GP and a teacher) had also had difficulty getting appointments she then announces that she will sort it out as she will manage the first time she phones and will not back down

I tend to try and stick up for myself and say things like - no I will sort it out I am made to feel unreasonable.

I get so upset when my ex H is discussed I have to end the conversation and vow never to mention it again but enevitably it gets mentioned again.

She tells me that she is only doing what mums do and I am over-sensitive but she makes me feel useless.

How cam I deal with this?

urgh, popcorn123, how very miserable for you.

I'm sorry if I've missed other threads of yours but am bloody glad you're "mixing with normal people and starting to see the difference"! The world we grew up is a kind of distorted version of the "normal" one - a bit like those old fairground mirrors. Even when you do start to notice the distortions, it's not a simple matter to "straighten it out". Our family is our family; they made us in their image. When we decide we'd rather be less convoluted, it's up to us to do the work - and we ain't gonna get much help from our nearest & dearest as they'd much rather we stayed "in-game" with them!

Sorry for the mixed metaphors. I'm trying not to write you an entire thesis!

It's no secret I'm using therapy to try and 'restructure' myself from the inside out. It's heavy going but not everybody wants or needs to take this root-and-branch approach. I can certainly offer you a few tips on your mum. I might seem harsh in some ways. But I hope something helps.

As you've observed, the big problem is that you want your mother to approve of you, understand you, sympathise, care and make you feel better. This isn't going to happen because she's not built that way. She hasn't asked you to change her so it would be both stupid & interfering to try.

Your only option is to nurture, love, understand, forgive & care for your self. Get help from friends, therapists, books & forums but accept that you've already missed out on the unconditional love you should have had as a child - sadly. Now you're an adult, the only place you will find this unconditional love is in yourself. For as long as you crave permission, approval, acceptance & love from other people ... you remain the out-of-shape soul your mother created

This isn't to say you never will be loved, accepted and all that! I'm trying to stress that the needing of those things is what weakens you and makes you vulnerable to bullies & other fucked-up individuals. People who came from a stable, secure, loving & accepting environment don't NEED those things; their families infused them with a lifetime's worth. Ours didn't. Everybody does need them, though, so we're left with providing our own emotional back-up. It can certainly be done

So your mum can't do that and, meanwhile, you need to protect your fragile heart from her manipulations, whilst you mend yourself. I am sure your mother has many excellent & valuable qualities; anyway, she's your mum. So, while you accept that she hasn't got the know-how to support you as you'd wish, you still need to protect yourself.

The first part of your self-protection is to understand what 'game' she's playing. I am a HUGE fan of TA (Transactional Analysis) where this kind of thing's concerned. You don't need to know very much about it to get started, try the Wikipedia page.

From your snapshot, a big part of her 'game' is something like "I am a powerful woman. And you're not." She gets her 'strokes' every time you express a problem that, of cours, she would have sorted in a jiffy. So what's happening, when you tell her about an issue is something like this:-

You: "I've left boyfriend, he hit me"
subtext: I'm really hurt & distressed, make me feel better (wounded Child)
Her: "Well, I wouldn't have let him hit me!"
subtext: Because I'm better than you (competitive Child)
You: "He really hurt me"
subtext I'm wounded, be sympathetic!
(wounded, needy Child)
Her: "You always let people get the better of you"
subtext: I'm better than you because you're weak
(competitive Child in winning position)

... which is a 'game' you can get locked in until one of you is screaming.

A very good way to neutralise this is by simply not playing. Remind yourself you don't expect 'strokes' from her - and decide not to give her any, either. Simplified example:-

You: "I dumped my boyfriend, did you know he hit me?
subtext: Hardly any. It's a statement of fact with a conversational opener.
(neutral Adult)
Her: "I wouldn't have let him hit me!"
(competitive Child)
You: "Maybe not."
(neutral Adult)
... the next part ("You always let people walk all over you") cannot happen, because you didn't let him. And you are not playing her childish game.

After that essay-and-a-half, I may still not have explained this well enough. At the end of my Mum thread, I resumed 'neutrality' with mine. It got instant results - her phone calls reduced from 3-4 a day to 0-1, and hasn't dropped in once
There's some great advice from others in there, too.

Thanks ItsGraceAgain - I did your thread and identified alot with it - particulalry with the cast off clothes, I get bags of the stuff!

I had a quick look at the TA page - too tired to take it all in at present vut like your transcript.
I struggle not to yet the wounded child come up now and then -I do try and be neutral and am managing not to sucked into my mums dramas and listen with neutral comments and try not to comment to much - often mean holding the phone away from my ear from long periods so I don't get too stressed.

Finding it a bit hard to deal with the "wounded child" - trying to be kind to myself and slowly getting better but sometimes need reassurance.
I feel like having notes all over the place saying reminding me not to expect emotional support.

Your right everything is a game to her and she always has to be better than anyone.

She does have lots of good points if I can learn to handle her better - although my dad often acts as a buffer I don't know what she would be like without that.
Have to learn not to play the game.

Any advice anyone on how to stop being "needy" - in public I am overtly very independant so it only comes out in certain circumstances - i suspect I will have to have counselling, anybody write a diary or something else?

popcorn

Why not have notes all over the place?! Make them notes of emotional support for yourself, though.

The neediness will continue to surface until you've filled yourself up with love (god I sound like a Californian self-help book )

That's what my posters are for, though. I've got flash cards in my handbag, too!! I love me

Diary helps loads, I find. As well as using it to vent, write lists of all your good points. Other valuable advice I was given was to write down any compliments I receive and achievements I'm pleased with (large and small). Oh, and use all kinds of creativity that appeal. I sometimes make collages; lots of people draw & paint in their journal.

Well done for making your choices, popcorn. And GOOD LUCK!!!

Evening all,

I am not sure that Narcissim is what I have experienced, though I have had a troubled relationship with my parents.

My situation is :

Alcoholic father for as long as I remember. He held down a job but would really drink when not at work.

I could never have friends round as worried that he may pitch up drunk, though mainly drank at home. Many years on and in my own place with MrSS I still am funny about visitors, especially unexpected ones. I almost panic when the doorbell goes.

Other hideous scenarios: Father went through the living room window whilst drunk, was found drunk and passed out in the street by the other kids. Would regularly fall asleep in restaurants at the table. Answer the house phone drunk. Play records really loudly. Have complete control over the tv.

I remember being thrown up the stairs once by him when I threw a paddy cos my mother was going out one night and I was left at home with him.

One time we went out for dinner with my now husband, to have my Father offer him out at the table. Making MrSS very uncomfortable around him for fear of violence. Never did hit him, the slury sleepy drunken threat was enough.

Mother looked after us kids. Obviously knew Father was not the greatest but never did anything about it.

I sought refuge elsewhere for as long as I can remember as I couldnt bear to be at home which I think hurt her, though all she could think about was how my Father was hurting her.

I would call her and say Hi, how are you, to be met with a conversation entirely about herself, how bad her life was, how disgusting my Father was. If the conversation ever turned round to me, all she could do was pick on me, or be mean, criticise or be all woe is her. Actually now I remember everything got turned back round to her.

Understand she needed to let off steam but I was her Daughter and I couldnt handle it.

Whenever I asked for advice about anything I was always met with why I couldnt do something not how I could do something.

After many years, I have now cut them out and I feel better. If we have DC MrSS wants me to contact them so they can be grandparents. Honestly I don't want to. Will cross that bridge when we come to it.

My friends don't understand, at all. Hard having to avoid topics involving parents in case someone asks "oh and how are yours?".

Mother has been seriously ill and this is sad, but it doesn't change anything. I am sure that this makes me even more of a bad person in some people's eyes.

I have come to the conclusion, life is for living and its about time I started to live mine, with my demons and all.

Indeed I have not escaped unscathed as I have severe highs and lows, find hard to communicate, get very hurt very easily, bad mood swings, boy can I swing!! Not pretty and I cant stop myself sometimes. Wonder if I am Bi-Polar?

As others have said, I feel like an orphan.

I long for that Mother / Daughter relationship but not with my Mother. Does that make sense??

Nice to meet you all BTW.

Hi, SilverSky. What you have in common with us is 'emotional abandonment'. You need to build up your self-approval, and your own sense of security, like all of us whose parents didn't parent us all that well.

I feel sympathetic towards your mother. She handled her situation badly, but she probably didn't have Mumsnet to support her whilst she was suffering!! Which is not to imply, in any way, that she was right to expect her child to 'parent' her and it's perfectly reasonable that you feel angry about this. However, have you ever tried, as an equal adult, to offer her affection & sympathy? How does she react?

There's nothing wrong with lying (they're okay) or telling the truth (dad's still drinking, mum's still stressed) when people ask. Sounds like you feel ashamed, which is a needless burden tbh.

Don't know if you've visited the Addicts thread in this forum? You could find quite a bit of appropriate backup there.

Hi ItsGraceAgain,

For some reason, not sure why, but I really cannot bring myself to be affectionate towards her.

As kids, I don't really recall any affection of really any sort. No hugs hello or goodbye and certainly no kisses on the cheek or anything.

My Father, a few years ago, hugged me and told me he loved me, cant remember if he'd been drinking. I remember going stone cold and not knowing how to react and not being able to get out of the house quick enough.

Most people don't know about my Father and I don't intend to enlighten them either.

I used to keep a diary throughout my early teens to my twenties and reading it through now is really sad. Nearly every day had an entry about my Father drinking or the effect that his recent drinking had on us.

If anything, they have turned the situation that its now I am in the wrong and they are keeping me at a distance.

I just hope that when we have children that I am the best I can be and I don't put any of my emotional abandonment onto them and drive them away by being all consuming all loving and all controlling as I am frightened they may do to me what I have done to my parents.

Thanks for the tip to find the Addicts section. I will go and have a read over there.

Well I had another run-in with my NPD mother yesterday and it just ruins me for a couple of days.

She sent DS a card saying 'kisses from granny and grandad'. Sounds innocuous enough obviously but she has only ever met him briefly and he is 2 now. he does not know them and he calls someone else who is more obviously and regularly in his life 'granny.'

I rang her to ask her why she sent the card (I know that this is a fruitless exercise and that staying NC is really the only way for me but hey ho)

Conversation ended with her using her hissing black nasty vicious voice (witch-like) to tell me that I always play the victim, I should look at my own behaviour, I always look for other people to blame, I am a 'grown woman' blah blah.

I have spent the last 2 years sort of standing up to her/them (father is a hand-wringing enabler who can be a nasty shit perfectly well without her help if he feels like it) because I discovered NPD. I have come to see that they are classic cases who have trained me very well to fall into the crap relationships I have had.

Of course standing up to them gets nowhere. She can strike me down with a few hissing vebally abusive comments and slam the phone down on me.

But what I really resent and loathe are her attempts to 'write' to my toddler. She rides rough shod over me as his mother and what I may want for him. It is as though, just as she did the head-bending stuff on me growing up ((as in
'you are wonderful and special/you are a gross tart,
you are unique/you deserved to be hit by your boyfriend
You failed to get into Oxford because you are a thick lazy tart/you failed to get into Oxford because they are wankers etc etc )) she is somehow trying to do it on my boy. Her message seems to be 'I think your mother is a bitch but I am still your granny. I love you and your mother is just a bitch. Look at this pretty card. Oh, I am not bothered if i never see you again anyway because you are the son of satan'

I just wish it didn't still bloody hurt. Anyway, I emailed them after this call and posted lots of links to NPD. Not that it will make a shred of difference. They think I am a fuck-up and will just ignore ignore ignore me. I am used to being a piece of shit on their shoes now. grrr

unlikely My mother does this and it drives me batty. She has taken to writing direct to my two year old dd .
'I hope we will meet some day soon...' she wrote last time.
(subtext) 'but probably not if your wicked bitch of a mother has her way.
She is Bonkers. '..Still hurts though'. Yep

Wow!! I had the most classic NPDers card in the post from my mother yesterday. I am going to write below exactly what it says....then I want all of us NPD survivors to join in a virtual group hug, while holding onto our ribs and belly-laughing session.

First, the front of the card has that 'poem' printed on it about A Smile - 'A smile costs nothing but gives much...' To me this is just classic in itself - remember what we have all noticed about the Narcissist's rictus smile??

The message inside is this:

Dear UA
This is just a card to ask you not to call us and make vituperative remarks - unkind, untrue and uncalled for.
I was once just as beautiful as you are, had my first real boyfriend at 13 years, my first genuine offer of marriage at 16, I got myself into awful scrapes, was taken advantage of and exploited over and over again - BUT, I -never- -never- -never- blamed my mother for my mistakes so don't you dare blame me.
Smile girl.
Mum

The underlined words are hers. She is 80. She married my father at 24, had five children never had to work and is still married to him.

I particularly like the empathy she shows for me in my situation - my husband left me and our baby son and ran away to bangland to shag whores a year and a half ago. I am 46. I am not beautiful.

She is bonkers no?

Discuss

never never never

Just because she is insane & self-obsessed doesn't mean everything she says is incorrect! I bet you are beautiful ... ask your baby

Loving the "rictus smile" - just looking up some pictures of my mum.
...
...
...
... oh yes, there it is! And there! And there, too!!

ps: mime hasn't spoken to me for 3 days (hurrah) - since I responded to one of her pointless complaints with "it's not always about you, you know."

Silly old bag.

Yes, classic postcard - could have been written by my NPD mum. I used to get a series of cartoon-style postcards with whimsical, uplifting sayings on the front and her ranting, irrational scrawl on the back. Interesting how they choose postcards and not letters. As if the postie cares.

BTW, I have seen your profile pictures and you are very attractive, so your Mum is both bonkers and wrong.

Heavens above! We must all be related. My mother is 89 extremely sharp witted, and sharp tongued and a sufferer from NPD. My 3 sisters live in Australia (they "abandoned" her)and when my, lovely, father died in 1987 my mother remarried and went out to live in New Zealand with her new husband. She had "never had a chance" to travel before. Her new husband died and my mother then went to live near my sisters. In fact, she went to live with my younger sister (huge mistake)after a couple of years my mother returned to the UK because of the horrible treatment she had received from her daughters. Their sin? They had wanted to live their own lives. If my mother is not the centre of attention, then what is happening is bad. She gaslights everything, tells me that everything I remember is made up or a lie. This is while she lies to my face about, "meeting the queen" "having a personal secretary" or "I could have been a doctor or gone to university but I had to sacrifice my life to help my family". This is the mother who never spent a Christmas day at home because she was needed at the hospital. She was a nursing sister. We were known as the neglected children and she rarely came to school events but if she did it was to tell people that they did well because they (my sisters and I) got their talent from her. She has never said sorry to anyone or asked anyone about their own feelings. When my poor, abused dad died the funeral was about her and was as if dad never existed. But his legacy is long lasting because he passed on to us his warmth and wit, he was a gentleman who believed that women could do no wrong. We were blessed to have him but my mother called him "ineffectual". My sisters have all grown up to be warm, wise women and my mother lives on her own with few friends. She has rows with her neighbours and alienates people. This problem is incurable for the perpetrator but entirely curable in the victim. Bless you (I am not a christian by the way - my mother is a public one and has a card on her bedside table which proclaims she is praying for me and my family to become christian - I haven't got a mind of my own of course)Keep Strong

Heavens above! We must all be related. My mother is 89 extremely sharp witted, and sharp tongued and a sufferer from NPD. My 3 sisters live in Australia (they "abandoned" her)and when my, lovely, father died in 1987 my mother remarried and went out to live in New Zealand with her new husband. She had "never had a chance" to travel before. Her new husband died and my mother then went to live near my sisters. In fact, she went to live with my younger sister (huge mistake)after a couple of years my mother returned to the UK because of the horrible treatment she had received from her daughters. Their sin? They had wanted to live their own lives. If my mother is not the centre of attention, then what is happening is bad. She gaslights everything, tells me that everything I remember is made up or a lie. This is while she lies to my face about, "meeting the queen" "having a personal secretary" or "I could have been a doctor or gone to university but I had to sacrifice my life to help my family". This is the mother who never spent a Christmas day at home because she was needed at the hospital. She was a nursing sister. We were known as the neglected children and she rarely came to school events but if she did it was to tell people that they did well because they (my sisters and I) got their talent from her. She has never said sorry to anyone or asked anyone about their own feelings. When my poor, abused dad died the funeral was about her and was as if dad never existed. But his legacy is long lasting because he passed on to us his warmth and wit, he was a gentleman who believed that women could do no wrong. We were blessed to have him but my mother called him "ineffectual". My sisters have all grown up to be warm, wise women and my mother lives on her own with few friends. She has rows with her neighbours and alienates people. This problem is incurable for the perpetrator but entirely curable in the victim. Bless you (I am not a christian by the way - my mother is a public one and has a card on her bedside table which proclaims she is praying for me and my family to become christian - I haven't got a mind of my own of course)Keep Strong

Heavens above! We must all be related. My mother is 89 extremely sharp witted, and sharp tongued and a sufferer from NPD. My 3 sisters live in Australia (they "abandoned" her)and when my, lovely, father died in 1987 my mother remarried and went out to live in New Zealand with her new husband. She had "never had a chance" to travel before. Her new husband died and my mother then went to live near my sisters. In fact, she went to live with my younger sister (huge mistake)after a couple of years my mother returned to the UK because of the horrible treatment she had received from her daughters. Their sin? They had wanted to live their own lives. If my mother is not the centre of attention, then what is happening is bad. She gaslights everything, tells me that everything I remember is made up or a lie. This is while she lies to my face about, "meeting the queen" "having a personal secretary" or "I could have been a doctor or gone to university but I had to sacrifice my life to help my family". This is the mother who never spent a Christmas day at home because she was needed at the hospital. She was a nursing sister. We were known as the neglected children and she rarely came to school events but if she did it was to tell people that they did well because they (my sisters and I) got their talent from her. She has never said sorry to anyone or asked anyone about their own feelings. When my poor, abused dad died the funeral was about her and was as if dad never existed. But his legacy is long lasting because he passed on to us his warmth and wit, he was a gentleman who believed that women could do no wrong. We were blessed to have him but my mother called him "ineffectual". My sisters have all grown up to be warm, wise women and my mother lives on her own with few friends. She has rows with her neighbours and alienates people. This problem is incurable for the perpetrator but entirely curable in the victim. Bless you (I am not a christian by the way - my mother is a public one and has a card on her bedside table which proclaims she is praying for me and my family to become christian - I haven't got a mind of my own of course)Keep Strong

Heavens above! We must all be related. My mother is 89 extremely sharp witted, and sharp tongued and a sufferer from NPD. My 3 sisters live in Australia (they "abandoned" her)and when my, lovely, father died in 1987 my mother remarried and went out to live in New Zealand with her new husband. She had "never had a chance" to travel before. Her new husband died and my mother then went to live near my sisters. In fact, she went to live with my younger sister (huge mistake)after a couple of years my mother returned to the UK because of the horrible treatment she had received from her daughters. Their sin? They had wanted to live their own lives. If my mother is not the centre of attention, then what is happening is bad. She gaslights everything, tells me that everything I remember is made up or a lie. This is while she lies to my face about, "meeting the queen" "having a personal secretary" or "I could have been a doctor or gone to university but I had to sacrifice my life to help my family". This is the mother who never spent a Christmas day at home because she was needed at the hospital. She was a nursing sister. We were known as the neglected children and she rarely came to school events but if she did it was to tell people that they did well because they (my sisters and I) got their talent from her. She has never said sorry to anyone or asked anyone about their own feelings. When my poor, abused dad died the funeral was about her and was as if dad never existed. But his legacy is long lasting because he passed on to us his warmth and wit, he was a gentleman who believed that women could do no wrong. We were blessed to have him but my mother called him "ineffectual". My sisters have all grown up to be warm, wise women and my mother lives on her own with few friends. She has rows with her neighbours and alienates people. This problem is incurable for the perpetrator but entirely curable in the victim. Bless you (I am not a christian by the way - my mother is a public one and has a card on her bedside table which proclaims she is praying for me and my family to become christian - I haven't got a mind of my own of course)Keep Strong

Heavens above! We must all be related. My mother is 89 extremely sharp witted, and sharp tongued and a sufferer from NPD. My 3 sisters live in Australia (they "abandoned" her)and when my, lovely, father died in 1987 my mother remarried and went out to live in New Zealand with her new husband. She had "never had a chance" to travel before. Her new husband died and my mother then went to live near my sisters. In fact, she went to live with my younger sister (huge mistake)after a couple of years my mother returned to the UK because of the horrible treatment she had received from her daughters. Their sin? They had wanted to live their own lives. If my mother is not the centre of attention, then what is happening is bad. She gaslights everything, tells me that everything I remember is made up or a lie. This is while she lies to my face about, "meeting the queen" "having a personal secretary" or "I could have been a doctor or gone to university but I had to sacrifice my life to help my family". This is the mother who never spent a Christmas day at home because she was needed at the hospital. She was a nursing sister. We were known as the neglected children and she rarely came to school events but if she did it was to tell people that they did well because they (my sisters and I) got their talent from her. She has never said sorry to anyone or asked anyone about their own feelings. When my poor, abused dad died the funeral was about her and was as if dad never existed. But his legacy is long lasting because he passed on to us his warmth and wit, he was a gentleman who believed that women could do no wrong. We were blessed to have him but my mother called him "ineffectual". My sisters have all grown up to be warm, wise women and my mother lives on her own with few friends. She has rows with her neighbours and alienates people. This problem is incurable for the perpetrator but entirely curable in the victim. Bless you (I am not a christian by the way - my mother is a public one and has a card on her bedside table which proclaims she is praying for me and my family to become christian - I haven't got a mind of my own of course)Keep Strong

I don't know about labels but what I do know is that my mum always wants to be the centre of attention all the time. It all has to be on her or she starts being nasty. She is controlling and always wants her own way 2 or the nastyness starts.

My mum never makes me feel good about myself but then expects me to run around after her.

This thread hurts me too much tonight