All these Mother-in-Law postings

[Extended]

When I read all these Mother-in-Law postings it makes me sad. Not that I doubt the sincerity of what people write but because I think they don?t appreciate what it is like for young couples when there is no parental support available.

In the three years we were at university, this was prior to getting married, we lost all four parents (two in a motorway crash, one in a accident on the farm and one with cancer). Quite a lot to cope with in your late teens and early 20?s!

Try having no parents at your wedding, no grandparents for your children and no sources of emotional support available 24/7.

The loss of our parents was life changing for both of us so just remember that in the vast majority of cases any parent is better than none.

Its 6 of one and half a dozen of the other really, both have to work at it. I agree with NanaNina about the close bond. I think it is very selfish of DIL to say that they need time alone and MIL can't see the new baby for 3 weeks, because the baby doesn't know (as said on these threads). A new born changes a lot in 3 weeks and it is such a shame if the DIL is selfish. At the same time MIL has to stand back a bit and not be set on claiming 'rights'.
It is a good idea for both sides to have put effort into the relationship before children come along, if the relationship isn't good it is likely to get worse with DCs. I think very often each side tries to ignore each other and it isn't possible once DCs arrive.
I think it best not to have expectations about the sort of partner you want your own DC to have, you have to accept that they are an adult and their choice might be very different from yours,and then you make friends with the one they choose (not the mythical one you wanted!)The best way to do it is to set up a relationship that is independent of your DC and see them on your own. I am very surprised by the number of people who would never seen ILs on their own.

NanaNina - I'm not denying that there was a man involved in the process, but the MIL can never be 100% certain it was her DS

With my evolutionary biologist's cap on, the DS would benefit from impregnating as many women as possible, whereas the DIL makes a massive investment in each baby. After the DS has done his 2-3 minutes, the DIL has 10 months of growing the baby, followed by gruelling labour, followed by breastfeeding. And these days we can add sacrifice of career, body and social life to the list. DS carries on pretty much as normal, and can always bog off when the going gets tough (see relationship boards on this site, or my own father - leaving my mum with a 3, 2 and 6 month old, for examples).

So yes, I think the DIL and her mother have more interest in the baby in a biological sense, and any DIL is going to care more what her own mother - who has known her for 20-odd years - thinks about the baby, than a woman she has been thrown together with as a side effect of her relationship with her partner or husband.

I don't know why you're staggered by my comments above all others - several posters have said they'd rather their MILs were dead!

Oh dear Porcupine 11 you are one of the people on MN who confirm my belief that some MILS are just never going to be able to get it right and may just as well give up.

I don't follow your comment "DS would benefit from impregnating as many women as posible"?? And yes as a mother I am very aware of the differences played in procreation by men and women thankyou. BUT again I think you are making sweeping generalisations "Any DIL is going to care more what her own mother - who has known her for 20 odd years thinks about the baby, than a woman she has been thrown together with as a side effectof her r/ship with her P or H" .......I'm sure this is sometimes the case but not always by any means. As it happens it is certainly NOT the case with 2 of my lovely DILS. It was the case for me many years ago when my babies were small BUT I certainly never ever thought that my MIL would not be as interested in my babies than my mother, and even though she was a bit overbearing I rode it out and knew she was just excited about the arrival of her Grand children.

You have had a very bad experience with your own father and that must have affected your greatly in your life. I suspect you don't have a very good relationship with your P/H and I may be quite wrong here (so forgive me if I am) but it seems that you are somehow blamingyour MIL for this.

I thought your comment that MILS never know if it was her son that was involved inthe process very unkind, even though you seem to think it is an amusing comment.

As for many people on MN wishing their mILS were dead, yes I have seen them but I have also seen many praising their "dear MILS" and feeling devastated when they have died. The point is that MILS (like everyone else) come in all varieties and I just think it is SO wrong to tar them all with the same brush. As I have said before on these posts, the r/ships between MILS and DILS can be fraught but with maturity and sensitivity on both sides it does not always have to be like this.

Can you not consider that there are good MILS and horrendous ones and some in between, just as there are with DILS, mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers etc etc.

And think on..........you will in all probability be a MIL yourself one day and if you have sons you will have a DIL, who might one day have a baby. I can only hope for your sake that that woman is more understanding than you are and will realise that you are as an importnat grandmother to her child as her own mother.

So yes, I think the DIL and her mother have more interest in the baby in a biological sense, and any DIL is going to care more what her own mother - who has known her for 20-odd years - thinks about the baby, than a woman she has been thrown together with as a side effect of her relationship with her partner or husband

I really hope that the person who can write this sort of comment has all DSs and that what goes around comes around!!
Of course a MIL has as much interest in her grandchild as the DIL and the DIL's mother.
It is blatantly obvious that my DH1 was the father of my 1st child and DH2 the father of the second two. You only have to look at them,apart from that they are alike in character, interests and mannerisms. DS1 is very like his father and has the same mannerisms despite his father dying when he was a baby-there is no way DS1 could copy-they were inbuilt.
DH1 died before he got to the age of 30yrs, any grandchild of his will be very precious to me and his parents (who are both still alive). Of course the baby will be equally precious to DIL and DIL's mother,but I think it is insulting, cruel and very, very upsetting to be told that the maternal grandmother has more interest biologically.
It is the whole reason why I post on these threads-insensitive DILs who have no idea!

A father and mother are equal parents, and the grandparents are equally important. You only get the situation where you have 1st class and 2nd class grandmother where the DIL allows it.
It always seems bizarre to me anyway, that people seem to think children can't be loveable unless they are blood relations. If my DSs were to adopt DCs they would be just as important and loved by me as a biological grandchild. My ILS from my first marriage are grandparents to my DCs from the second marriage-I would expect that they have a special fondness for their own, but they never show it when dealing with the DCs.Grandparents of the second 2 are now dead, but they welcomed DS1 as an equal grandchild. I loathe the whole possessiveness that people seem to adopt with my baby, my DC.
My favourite poem is:

On Children
Kahlil Gibran

Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,
which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them,
but seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.

You are the bows from which your children
as living arrows are sent forth.
The archer sees the mark upon the path of the infinite,
and He bends you with His might
that His arrows may go swift and far.
Let our bending in the archer's hand be for gladness;
For even as He loves the arrow that flies,
so He loves also the bow that is stable.

One that possessive parents and grandparents should take to heart IMO

I'm only trying to explain from a scientific point of view why the MIL-DIL tensions arise, lighten up ladies.

And I'm an atheist, so the poem is totally lost on me I'm afraid - my baby is mine mine mine.

You don't own anyone-you give birth to a DC and they are entirely free to have their own ideas, make their own relationships etc, etc-they are not blank sheets of paper to be programmed by their parents.The poem is nothing to do with religion-it is about your children coming through you but not being possessions.
From a scientific point of view the DC gets their genes from both parents. Maybe sometimes you would need DNA testing to find the true father, but often it is self evident. As I type this, I look at my hands and they are identical to my fathers, I look at photos of my paternal grandmother and I can see the resemblance.DNA testing would be a complete waste of money. It is utter rubbish to say that my maternal grandmother should have more interest in me biologically-merely because she happens to be the mother of a girl and not a boy.
It is very difficult to lighten up when you have all DSs and some women don't want to acknowledge that the father's family are equal-but are merely people who are grudgingly have to be included.

Admit, haven't read the other postings yet. But...

Just realised how bloody petty so many of these threads are about MILs and how they ALWAYS get things wrong. Not interested, too interested, too detatched, gives the incorrect advice.

I am not condemning, I have had some spectacular whinges about my (pretty lovely all in all) MIL.

Today she has told me she has cancer. Apparently a fairly treatable one, but still.

It has made me realise how I need to shut the f*ck up about the petty shite in life and get on with loving the people who are worth loving in life.

After all, one day our DILs will be moaning just as loudly as us, about us.

Sorry to ignore miss the debate.

OP it must have been so hard for you. Speaking as someone who had ghastly mil problems -- I still think you have a good point.

I think pagwatch said "vast majority", and my mil problems I'm sure fall into this category: absolutely awful and poisonous at the time, which affecting bonding etc -- but they passed, more or less.

Through most of it the children knew nothing of it and they benefitted from the relationship. "Benefitted" is a cold word to use when talking of all the love, comfort, security and affection they are lucky enough to have from her but I don't know what other word to use.

So while I wanted to shoot her at times, still do, the children need her.

I think it is a good point you make.

Sorry to hear about your MIL MOOB, hope the treatment is successful. I think we can all whinge about people-I have a very close relationship with my mother but I could certainly whinge! If someone was perfect they would be dreadful to live with.
Someone who thinks their DC is mine,mine,mine is going to be a problem MIL. A DC is a gift and you have a very short time, it is all about letting go. At the most you probably have 14 yrs, if that, before they have their own views and ideas on life. There are two ways they can deal with rigid parents-challenge or be deceptive-much better to give them freedom in the first place.

my MIL is coming over next week. Anyone want her? Am deading it.

oooooooops
I am torn between buggering off for the day and staying here to point out that her only child (my dh) has been told his dd wiont live and FFS give the man some support you emotionally distant bastards.
And bopping her round the head with the consultants letter because she always says I'm making things up.

I expect MIL will be pleased when dd does go as she has said, with dd sat on my lap, that disabled people are better off dead anyhow.
I wish I had a nice MIL

dd1 cant see why I don't like her.

yup she is, and lives with the PIL.

So sorry Riven-when I am standing up for MILs ,I am not standing up for the toxic.

porcupine 11 - I think you have a strange notion of science. Also you completely misunderstood the poem sent by PMoon, thinking it was religious, when it was in fact quite the opposite, so I suspect you may be somewhat intellectually limited.

Have just noticed an earlier post about the death of your mother and you actually admit that you resent the fact that your MIL is still around to see her GC when your mother isn't. (or words to that effect) I can understand this to some extent and does explain some of your comments, but it isn't fair really is it? It isn't your MIL's fault that your mother has died after all.

Hope you are able over time to come to terms with the death of your mother and in so doing will be able to feel a little les negatively about your MIL and accept that she should be able to enjoy a close connection with her grandchild.

"porcupine 11 - I think you have a strange notion of science. Also you completely misunderstood the poem sent by PMoon, thinking it was religious, when it was in fact quite the opposite, so I suspect you may be somewhat intellectually limited."

Are you always that rude to people who disagree with you, or is the anonymity of the internet, um, liberating?

While my MIL may have been "difficult" I miss her and wish she was still here, she adored dd even though she was not dps. I have to say NanaNina she was quite a gentle woman and would certainly never have spoken to anyone in the harsh tones you have used on this thread.

I think that sometimes on the internet you just get annoyed because people say things in the first place that they wouldn't say in RL. My DH was a fit and healthy, young man, killed in the prime of life, much loved by me,our DS,his parents,siblings and friends. He lives on in our hearts and minds, and hopefully in future generations. The thought that I might be told by a future DIL, who never knew him (and can't understand the trauma that we all went through)that she and her mother have more interest in the baby biologically, made me see red! Probably, unless very insensitive, no one would say it in real life.
A baby has 4 grandparents, they go equally into the gene pool, and it depends on the individual how much interest they have in a grandchild. The DC may develop a very close bond with one grandparent, or may be more comfortable with one set than the other, but that is entirely up to the DC-it isn't within the control of the DIL to dictate her DCs relationships.
Kahil Gibran was a Lebonese American,artist, poet and writer (1883-1931)his poetry gives insights on topics of life and does use spiritual terms.John Lennon has used his words. I don't see them as religious, if you don't like the word 'souls' replace it with one of your own. There is nothing wrong with the central message-your DC is a gift, given to you for a very short time-they are not your possession.
To my mind all the problems with MIL comes from possessiveness and petty jealousies. If a mother is opening her 6 yr old's post she is going to find it difficult to stop. If she doesn't knock on a 6 yr olds bedroom door before entering she may well think she has a right to enter her adult DSs home as if it is her own. If she thinks her DS should be a Christian/atheist/vegetarian/Labour voter etc etc because she is, she will be a problem. If she thinks she has the right to choose her DCs friends she will be a problem.
There are lots of these women about! Parenting is a process of gradually letting go, and respecting personal space.
The DS may well get around it by lip service and quietly doing their own thing-this may work on his own but once he meets a strong minded woman who doesn't want to be controlled there is a problem. There is especially a problem if DH has dared to choose a woman not approved of by his mother! Made worse if DH still refuses to stand up to his mother.
I have no doubt there are some very difficult, if not to say impossible, MIL- but equally there are some difficult, insensitive DIL who make no effort to get to know their DH's family, and given the choice would prefer him to be a foundling!