Narsissistic personality disorder

[therealme]

I'm English, living overseas. I'm married for 17 yrs and most of that has been pretty awful. I recently 'came clean' about my abusive relationship with dh on a parenting site where I live and I have had my eyes opened for the first time that maybe it's not all my fault anymore. I have blamed myself for everything that has 'gone wrong' in my marriage - although I have genuinly messsed up on more than one occasion.

I received a lot of support from people but didn't believe I was worthy of it. Then somebody suggested I google Narsissistic Personality Disorder and that is the moment my whole world changed. For the very fist time I began to see that maybe it wasn't ME that might have all the problems. I saw my 'perfect' dh described in black and white and the words 'personality disorder' were attached to his behaviours. To say the ground shifted from under me would be an understatement.

So now I find myself at a turning point in my life. I know I have to end my marriage. It's emotionally, verbally and mentally abusive. I now recognise that I am a shell of the person that I once was, have had the life blood drained out of me, but still have enough of a spark in me to want to fight for some peace of life at 42! I have 3 children whom I love and adore - but who also love their Daddy. I'm living financially independently from my dh who refused to support me financially after ds 2 was born 6 yrs ago. I want him out of the house and out of my life!

I've made my mind up, but I am still so weak when it comes to taking action. I have spent so long living in a confused and guilt-ridden state, does that make sense?
Is there anybody out there who has experience of living with a narsissistic partner? How do you make the break? How do you ever find the strength to stand up to them in order that you might have some quality of life left for yourself? Please advise.....

10 weeks separated. I am still here and still surviving life despite being told I would never cope on my own....

My ex has found accommodation, albeit temporary. It means he takes the dc on regular access visits. We communicate via e mail, he keeps things civil, has to really with the Safety Order in place. Still can't resist the odd put down or reference to my inadequecies as a person, but hey, what's new?

He has informed me he is going to therapy. I have no doubts whatsoever that this is merely an opportunity for him to bleat about what an awful life he had with his f*ck up of a wife. A captive audiance who will hear one side of a terrible marriage, minus the abusive behaviour which he will conveniently leave out.

Oh, and he is looking into becoming a foster parent now. Yes, that's right. 10 weeks after leaving the house that he shared with his dc, whom he 'loved and adored' - he now wants to replace with a child whom will live with him full time, unlike the 3 kids he sees twice a week. I guess this is the start of the devaluing phase. He is slowly beginning to work at replacing us all. My poor, poor children - whatever will I tell them?

Therapists have heard it all before. And I think his application to become a foster parent would surely raise eyebrows, given his recent separation. Not to mention the Safety Order . I think he wants to do this so that he can use any foster parent certification he receives to prove to you that he is a caring, normal, Mr. Nice Guy. There might not be anything left to tell the children in the end, because his application is a long shot, imo.

He is also saying through his plans to apply that he thinks the Safety Order is just a piece of paper and that he believes everyone else who knows anything thinks so too, so this is quite a 'digital salute' to you. Ns suck up to authorities; they keep on trying to get approval from higher-ups whom they fear. But they can't fool all of the people all of the time.

You make sense, as usual, Maths! Yes of course, in his job as a child care worker to become a foster parent would be applauded by colleagues. It would be regarded as a status issue by my ex to 'prove' what a caring, unselfish saint he was
I don't know why I am worrying about it anyway (well actually I do, early hours insomnia induced mind wanderings as usual) as he doesn't have a permanent address, works overnights and has a Safety Order against him for 2 years. Would you give this man a child??

I have managed to avoid being dragged into his personal life despite his attempts to involve me. He still refers to me as his 'wife' and has a dinner waiting for me when I drop off the kids!
He is facing legal action from his car ins people because he didn't provide them with necessary documentation in time and this is my fault of course!
He is refusing to pay creche and other bills until I confirm through my solicitor that I will not be looing for an increase in maintenence when we go to court in Jan. I won't accept that ?300 is all he can pay until a judge looks at his income - I guess I want some recognition of his financial abuse over the years. His money has always been his biggest source of power which he has used to control me. I want him to know that he can no longer do this to me.
Most of his posessions have been taken from the house. He has had to negotiate with me about taking some items particularly his precious paintings. He spent thousands on his art collection in the last few years and has ants in his pants about trying to get them out of this house now.
Every communication I send through email is passed on to his solicitor. He is waiting to trip me up - still looking for validation that I am the abusive bad wife who has ruined his life. Yeah right, he can tell it to his therapist.

How about not sending him any more e-mails? Can you afford to just communicate via your solicitor? Or even have the solicitor recoup costs at judgement time?

How much are the paintings worth? Could you have someone come in to appraise them and document them before he repossesses them, because they are assets that he would have to disclose to the court. You might need to have a professional appraisal in hand in case he lowballs their value or sells them and claims he made far less than he really did.

TRM, wow ten weeks! great..

I agree with Math, the therapist would be able to read between the lines.... "so your wife threw you out on a whim, because she didn't appreciate you?" ummmmm, ummmmmm.

Despite his career in 'caring', I hope that they would speak to his wife first before giving him a foster child!

I agree it's delusional reinforcement though. It underpins his whole self-image as a caring, sharing, reasonable excellent Dad.

NOT suggesting that you should worry about what his colleagues think, but do they see him how he sees himself I wonder?

He really is a text-book case isn't he! Staggering!

Congratulations on the 10-week mark!

Hi everyone,do you mind if I join this thread. I only joined MN in the Summer and I so wish I had been on it when going through a lenghty divorce from someone who I now think may have this disorder.

I am mostly fine now but felt at the time that I had escaped from a cult but my cildren hadn't as they still see their father every other weekend.

I am worried that my 12 year old dd may develop this. I feel she has an unhealthy relationship with him. She goes along with anything he says or wants and although she does challenge me, she would never challenge him. I somestimes feel almost manipulated by her in the way he manipulated me.

Cahu, you are welcomed to this thread, get typing and join in!
Living with an N is a bit like being in a cult isn't it? I never really thought about that before, but I am certainly having trouble escaping the brainwashing that was done to me.

Maths, I am still (3 weeks after court hearing) waiting for his solicitor to pass on his propossed access dates to see the dc. Untill I have his rota I am forced to negotiate access through email. At least I am not getting 20 phone calls and 50 texts a day though, so can live with the 3 to 5 emails per day....
I never thought about the precious paintings in terms of value to me. I never had any rights in my marriage so wouldn't think along those lines now. If nothing else they prove he had a vast expendable income whilst living with me and my welfare payments! Honestly, he has shown more enthusiasm about getting his paintings back then he has about seeing the kids.
He also asked again for the 'intimate' photographs he had taken of me. I had great pleasure in telling him they no longer existed.

I would honestly say, that unless you have no children and can disappear from an N's life without contact, there really is no escaping their prescence in your life. I am tied to him through my dc. I cannot avoid him, he stays in contact. He finds reasons to contact me. I will never be shot of him will I?

I feel exactly the same. If I could have walked away and never had to have contact with him again............... if only. He is still telling lies about me, telling the childrem I will not let them see him or his family.

Unfortunately my eldest dd is 12 and I do not have that power. He is the one who has cut times and breaks endless promises to them which they accept with no argument because they are so brainwashed.

Welcome cahu.

With regard to your children...it is a total nightmare when you have a N partner/ex-partner who is their parent.

Have a look at thepsychopath.freeforums.org/ this forum. It has some scary language when you first read it, but there are people on there who are facing the same issues with their children that we are.

All you can really do is be consistent in your treatment of your children. Love them, show them the truth, never mess with their heads as the N parent does.

Sadly, I think that if they are going to become an N, there is actually not alot you can do to stop that.....but if you treat them as a normal, loving parent would then you have done all you can.

I think there are windows of opportunity with developing minds,
and if you can catch those then you perhaps have a chance.

It is very difficult though. My ex-HN devalues one of our children, and idealises the other. It's the idealised child who worries me the most. I am the only person who ever goes against this child, who ever disciplines him, and he doesn't like it sometimes... But I just keep batting on....there is nothing more you can do.

I have Ns and Ps in my family, and in my in-laws, so the odds are not good for this child. But I will not give up.

HTH xxxxxx

My story is we worked together and both got married to other people within weeks of each other. I found him just a typical slimy salesman. Anyway he was back from honeymoon and badmouthing new wife already! Obviously making himself out to be the martyr along the way and I fell for it.

I was absolutely hooked by the power of his personality and to cut a long story, we ended up married with 2 children.

I started to be suspicious of him around 2004 and when he started going out more and coming in in the early hours I knew something was going on and I suspected it was with his ex wife as he comes across as v. confident but isnt really, with women anyway.

He started calling me a gold digger as I had been a SAHM since the dc were born and wouldnt go anywhere with me.

This continued into 2006 and I knew I needeed proof as he would never be the one to leave as he has to maintain his public image as adoring father. He was so subtle yet goaded me at the same time, telling dc 'mummys off again'. He refused to let me or youngest dd go on family holiday, yet as soon as they arrived there he was on phone promising me he would change. I did think he was just hedging his bets though and going away alone was to prove to his girlfriend we were over.

His family hadn't spoke to me since xmas 2005, God knows what he had been telling them.

They are the same though and Since reading this thread am convinced they have it also.
He would actually say how selfish they were (mum and sister) and had had problems with his brothers wife for years. They moved to the other end of the country to get away.

Anyway, September 2006, am shopping in not my usual supermarket and am approached by woman who I eventually recognize as his ex. I would have walked away as I am not the confrontational type esp. in a public place
She started big row in fruit and veg saying I was blackmailing him with the dc and house, that I was a golddigger etc etc. Now I had my proof.

He denied having affair and still does to this day, would not move out of home and continued to live there till June 2008 when settlement came through and I bought other house.

Through this time his ex would drive past home, school constantly. She was 3 times divorced, he was her 2nd husband and she had a child with the third.

Life was hell but he would not go, called me cuckoo, nutter etc etc infront of dc. Went to court for divorce and had to come home to him telling dc I was taking all the money. Eldest dd was and is brainwashed and would say "well it is daddys house isnt it"?

A couple of weeks before my new house was finalised he took dc out and I heard footsteps outside. I ran upstairs and yes, it was his ex banging on front door shouting "come out you bitch". She was on her mobile talking to him, obviously. I called the police. She eventually drove off and when he returned the landline phone rang. He gave it to me and it was her! I hung up and she rang again but he told her I'd called the police and she couldnt talk to me because the dc were there.

All through this time I had not contacted his family or made a nuisance of myself. I had a brilliant solicitor which pissed him off, no end.

He promised the dc he would never sell family home then a few months after we moved out he sold and moved in with his ex. They now have big new house which dd1 told me had been in 25 beautiful homes!

Promised them a dog which girlfriend vetoed. Etc Etc. I have retrained and have a job after 12 years as a sahm.

Dear cahu. Welcome. Re-read your last post again, imagining that it is him reading it. Because, of course, it is a god-almighty dra,ma caused by him and is all about him. The wife screaming, the police, the family going blank on you...yes, it is all because of him. Honestly, pass the bloody peanuts. The poor woman/ex whoever he is now head-screwing will have the police called on her in the end....and his family will end up with myriad women they have to decide to talk to or not.

Gther up your socks, gather up your children, gather up your book of favourite lav jokes and stick two fingers up at the poor bawling limelight-seeking toddler that he is.

I too had police and a screaming ex and his family blanking me and our son. It is farking painful. It is unhuman. It is so damned spoiled. I bet they don't recycle. or if they do it is just to impress the neighbours....they willingly dump theirt shit anywhere when no one is looking.

I can't believe you said he was seeing his 'wife' when actually, er, you were his wife? Unless I have read it wrong. Quite possibly...dealing with the buggering head-fuckery these nuts visit upon you does implode one's eyesight.

Ignore him. Yawn in his face. Be vague and distracted. Be as hard as bloody nails. He will die either old and lonely or young and lonely.

Whereas you will be buying a bottle of fizz, a packet of popcorn, watching a good film on telly and thanking your lucky flippin stars that the twat you married had his ex on the scene too... She is welcome to the drama of these Queens. And yes i mean queens...they usually have some weird sex thing going on.

Keep posting. xxx

Also, which issue of 25 beautiful homes? I really liked that mag.

Not anymore.

I so wish I had been on MN when I was living through this, I really do. Since last Xmas, every couple of months or so, I get what I can only describe as begging, texts.

"He is the same man I loved at the start, children will be better off, please meet me to talk" so I think his new/old partner is not as comliant as me. Infact she is a hard faced woman who I see as his perfect partner!

I don't know anything about the new house eexcept he will be up to his eyeballs in
debt. He now drives a family friendly jeep but had porsche when we were together. He really is textbook isn't he?

Think she may be trying to get him down the aisle again and thats why he is texting me.
He is incapable of having a real life, everything has to be manipulated.

Just worry about long term effects on dc really......

That should be compliant! Cant type fast enough as it is such a relief to talk about it to others who understand.

Like Gettingagrip says, you can only do your level best. You are equipped with the knowledge and are not an N yourself.

Your children may go into therapy in their 20s 30s or 40s. They will be adults and have to reach their own conclusions.

Just be a loving mother with boundaries for them and remember you are only human. You are allowed to make mistakes.

Their father is inflicting problems on them not you. (if he is NPD he won't see it or give a shit anyway) So please try to start enjoying your life - with our support and encouragement - and do not let him steal the jolly-mummy you no doubt are, away from your children.

You are making it all about him - ie you cannot give them a decrent childhood because he will deny it kind of thing. He has made his thorny stupid dumb-arse bed. Let him lie on it.

PS/disclaimer I am not cross but I think sometimes it would have been better if the Crusaders had been girls.

He also said on the day the removal men pulled up outside the family home "you will be back in 6 months". I walked past him with no comment but thought to myself, you will be shacked up with your ex by then plus I hate you, how will I be back in 6 months?
Just do not understand the pointlessness of that remark?

Does the fact I am still talking about it on MN mean I am not over it?

Tbh, only thing that has any effect on me is him and angry bitch ex playing happy families with my dc every other weekend.

My first post on MN was something like "Why dont my dc begrudge woman who split up their family" back in July when they went on holiday together.

Unlikelyamazon, you are a great support!

Have you dated or whatever since your ex **ed off? I had not been single since I was 19, always in a relationship, but now I cant imagine being anything else.

No I haven't dated. He abandoned us a year and a half ago and I am only now and slowly getting over it. It doesn't matter one iota though. Knowing what I know now I can't look at men anyway. Not that I don't believe there are some lovely men out there, just that I am no way ready for such a person.

See it like this: he is her problem now. Your dc may not want to see them when they are a bit older and you will always be their mother and love you above all. If you are good to them (don't need to explain what I mean by that.)

So long as she is nice and caring towards them that is all that matters. For now.

He said that thing about 'you'll be back' because they seem to think you can't survive without them - which ties in with them having no respect for you, and only contempt towards you. They are so smug and at the same time insecure it's laughable.

My ex has said too many wtf???things for me to mention here.

Think duck, water an d dance around the room to celebrate your freedom. He will go throwing his weight around in someone else's head now.

You can fill your head with thoughts of chocolate, x-factor results, nail varnish and hugging your children in snow. xx

You are so right. Knowing I can live good life without a man in it is fantastic. I have been relying on food for comfort far too much in the past year, though. Couldn't eat or relax whilst eating when I was still living with him but have been overcompensating since getting my own place.

Feeling good about myself pysically would really lift me, but at the moment, can't seem to walk away from the junk.

"they usually have some weird sex thing going on." Oh, very true. And always in the back of your mind when the question of dating comes up.

TRM -- if there's anything else of your Ex's lying around, try to put a price on it before you hand it over to him. You are so right that it shows how much money he felt he could throw around while you were together, and the court might be interested in the value.

Cahu there's no time limit for getting over this miserable experience; sometimes it helps to hash it out have you had any counseling? Dealing with someone like this is a traumatic episode.

Hi Math, I had 1 session of counselling through my GP when we were still living together but it was hopeless.

Feel I should have moved on from the bad times...... I got enough money to buy small house outright etc etc.

Thanks to everyone here for posting with your advice and experience.....

Don't go around beating yourself up with "should" messages. This is the worst legacy of your relationship showing itself in your life -- that you are vulnerable to the critical voices in your head or coming from outside, and you don't try to find out what "the real you" needs, and take that as your starting point.

I think anyone who has been down this road needs some kind of counseling, especially the kind that Women's Aid offers, because a lot of us have seen our sense of self eroded significantly by these abusive relationships. Counseling helps to dig up a lot of the feelings and reset our inner compasses.

Do WA offer counselling?

This link shows some of their services, including counseling and support groups.