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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

SUPPORT THREAD FOR PARTNERS OF ADDICTS - PART 2

985 replies

ginnny · 08/05/2009 11:36

I thought I'd start us a new thread since the old one was going strong for over a year and I know a lot of people find it helpful.
DP did go on a bender Monday and Tuesday, which although I wasn't happy about, I understood why. He is lost and can't cope with the grief of losing his Mum.
Since then though he's been great, so once the funeral is over I'm hoping we can put it behind us and get back to normal.
I've suggested bereavement counselling, but he's not convinced.

OP posts:
ginnny · 18/09/2010 13:51

BUMP!!!
Quick update from me!
I have finally got rid of my useless drunk! Very long story but he hit the bottle again big time few months ago, and this time he turned his venom on my oldest and best friend. She is like a sister to me, and had never said a bad word about him, and he turned on her, accused us of being lesbians Shock. He also started picking on ds1, and lying all over the place, so finally I decided enough is enough and have ended it for good this time.
I am happier than I've been in years. I've got great friends, lovely kids and my family are brilliant... there is a new man on the scene too but I'm taking it very very slowly.
I'll read through this thread later and catch up - I'll need a few hours for that.
In the meantime, I hope everyone is doing OK.
x

OP posts:
Calyx · 18/09/2010 20:58

Well done Ginnny! :) I was just looking at the x factor thread and checked 'thread's I'm watching' and noticed a new post. What good news that you're happy and that there's a new man on the scene... good luck!

My DH has been behaving mostly very well since I went to al anon and read the codependent book, he does still have a drink now and again but is on the no alcohol beer in the house. And the one or two times he's come in pissed I've just not engaged with it at all and it's been easy. I'm feeling hopeful.

Well done and good luck again :)

Calyx · 18/09/2010 21:00

'threads' arghhhhhh

kitcat83 · 20/09/2010 00:23

Hi everyone I am new to mn and I was just reading your older thread as I have been fighting with admitting to myself that my dh has problems with alcohol. We have had countless discussions about hid drinking and I am actually in tears now after reading some of the old posts as they are so close to what I am going through mith dh. He drinks every day without fail even if it is only two beers, but most nights it is at least three or four. I just dont want this sort of life for me and my ds (3.9) where he thinks this is "normal". Dh humours me constantly if we talk about it and I get the nodding and a week of less beer and visits to the pub and then it all starts again. How do you cope? Any advice? Am I over reacting?

kitcat83 · 20/09/2010 00:26

I forgot to add that it is not only 4 a night. He will get totally off his face at least twice a week and its always because " I've had a hard day" "want to unwind" "something has pissed me off" excuses excuses .....

AttilaTheMeerkat · 20/09/2010 09:17

kitcat,

You cannot help him but you can help your own self here.

Talking to your alcoholic H about his drinking is a waste of your time and effort so do not do this. He has just uttered guff and empty promises on his part; the excuses are all the same. Do not drink alcohol with him either under any circumstances. He does not want to hear your message re his drinking and is in denial of the whole problem. He is likely underestimating badly how much he is actually consuming. Unless he wants to face up to his alcoholism (and you could be waiting years here before this happens if it does at all) there is nothing you can do to help him. Denial is a powerful force here and he is mired in denial. The excuses he has given for drinking are just those - excuses.

His primary relationship is now with drink; you and everyone and everything else comes a dim and distant second.

There are also codependency issues surrounding all this as well on your part and it may be helpful for you to read "Codependent no more" written by Melodie Beattie. You have probably ended up in this as his enabler; enabling him only gives you a false sense of control.

How many people know about his drink problem; are his employers aware?. He could end up losing everything because of his alcoholism. There are no guarantess here.

You are NOT, repeat NOT, responsible for him.

You have a choice re your H - your child has no say. He won't ultimately thank you for staying with his drunkard Dad if you choose to. He will see it all and your reactions to his Dad. You won't be able to hide the realities of his alcoholism from him let alone yourself. Do NOT let your child be further subjected to all this dysfunction going on within your own home because it could well affect him badly even in adulthood. Home should be a santuary.

You need to remember the 3cs re alcoholism:-

You did NOT cause it
You CANNOT cure it
You CANNOT control it

I would also suggest you talk to al-anon as well as they can be helpful to family members of problem drinkers. Their details will follow.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 20/09/2010 09:18

www.al-anonuk.org.uk

kitcat83 · 20/09/2010 10:57

Thanks Attila x
I am struggling with my own belief that "things will get better" but am now, even though it breaks my heart, that they probably wont and they will probably only get worse.
DH and I run our own business together so there is no "boss" to answer to so if anything goes wrong it is only me to berate him which obviously being his wife goes down like a lead balloon! His family are the same as him so he and them see nothing wrong in what he is doing.
I stopped drinking altogether after having our son as I feel like I cant and shouldnt drink with him and now dont even enjoy it as I have seen what it does to him, it is sooo unattractive. Also for my son, I really dont want him thinking this is normal for adults to do. At the moment I am going to bide my time as DH is a lovely person and want to give him a chance, for all our sakes. However I have said to myself that I am going to retrain in a career and when my son starts school next year, if nothing has changed I should be a more independant person able to build a life for me and DS alone. However scary that may be, it has to be better than the chaotic life we have at the moment, not nowing what each day will bring. Sorry to all for the long post. I hope that you are all coping Smile

ginnny · 20/09/2010 11:03

I second everything Attilla said. Do try al anon. It saved ny sanity in so many ways. Also there is an excellent link on detachment on here somewhere. I can't link to it as i'm using my phone but its well worth a read.

OP posts:
AttilaTheMeerkat · 20/09/2010 13:01

Hi Kitkat,

Re your comment:-

"At the moment I am going to bide my time as DH is a lovely person and want to give him a chance, for all our sakes".

I would not be giving him any chances at all. What about your own self here?.

You have probably clung onto the thought that "things will get better" now for a long time. In the cold light of day though they have not have they?. That above thought anyway is a triumph of hope over experience.

The longer you stay within this situation the harder it will be for both you and your son. It will not be any easier for you a year on down the line, perhaps even harder infact and its not looking at all good from here now.

Am not suggesting at all he is not a lovely person but the drink is his mistress now and its a cruel one. You cannot help someone who does not want to be helped and your H is mired in denial. He does not want to admit he has a problem and alcoholics as well can be the most selfish people in the whole world. Your life is in chaos now because of his alcoholism:(.

As for his family being the same as him (not totally surprised to read that) alcoholism can be learnt behaviour too.

Sorry to sound so harsh but you cannot afford to give this man a (or perhaps yet another) chance before the emotional well being of your own self and your child. You DO NOT want your son growing up in a household where one parent is alcohol dependent. Truly you do not; it could well affect him badly (many children of alcoholics are more likely to become super responsible as adults or even choose alcoholics as partners) and he won't thank you ultimately for staying with his drunkard father.

Re the business can you seek financial/legal advice re this in terms of buying out his interest?. Can you run it day to day without him?. You probably are doing most of the legwork here anyway. Presumably as well his alcoholism problem is not helping with your business either.

Do contact Al-anon as they will help you; you certainly need outside support. Also read "Codependent no more" written by Melodie Beattie.

kitcat83 · 20/09/2010 18:35

Thank you for your words of experience. I am going to check the Al anon out and see if it can give me some comfort and I am also going to dig deep and try and tell my mum everything as she only hears lies and half truths. I feel if I let her know what I am going through she may not be as horrified if we end up splitting.
I spoke to DH this afternoon as I have barely spoken to him since thursday and he actually said to me "is everything ok you have been very quiet for a few days?!!" I told him that I was incredibly ashamed, fed up and unhappy with our marriage and his drinking problem and if he didnt pull it together and admit there was a problem and start to do something about it then I was going to call it a day. He looked genuinely shocked even though there have been similar talks in the past! He said "that was it I am going to stop drinking!" I soooo want to believe him although I dont have the energy to keep believing he cares more about us than the drink, thats awful isnt it? I just dont trust a word anymore. Confused

bobblehead · 20/09/2010 19:25

Hi Kitcat

I was in your position 2 years ago and sadly the drinking did get alot worse, as will your dh's. I am still with my dh (for numerous reasons) and it is only now there is a small chink of light at the end of the tunnel. It took until fairly recently for my dh to consistantly admit to being an alcoholic and he has now checked himself onto a course and has done a whole 5 days without drink- a record for him! I'm neither hopeful nor pesemisstic, just take each day as it comes. I am not the one with the problem-HE is and I live my life for me sidestepping his chaos along the way. Not ideal, but then neither was leaving.

I can understand why you don't want to leave yet, but believe me there may come a time when you have to. Until then, definately confide in your mum and others if possible. I got to the point where I refused to keep it secret and while I don't shout about it from the rooftops quite a few of my friends, and all my family are aware and supportive. You'll probably find everyone has an alcoholi in the family somewhere.
Don't drink with him. He will only use it against you and to manipulate you. Don't try to reason with him/bargain/threaten. Just don't engage with him when drunk.
Definately retrain, sock away money where you can and build a life for yourself and your son. And go to al-anon or at least read their litrature!

Sorry for typos and spelling mistakes-trying to eat lunch and entertain dc!

kitcat83 · 20/09/2010 20:08

Thanks bobblehead I hope that your okay and coping with the stresses of living with your DS and his addiction, how do you cope? xx
I really appreciate evryones words of advice and support its only hit me today whilst reading and writing these posts how bad DH is and how i've been accepting this for far too long. Cant believe my life and DS's has come to this, so very low Sad. But from tomorrow I am going to start to put into to place measures to ensure me and DS are okay from now on Smile
Thanks again everyone, I am sure I will be keeping you up to date with progress too ...

Calyx · 21/09/2010 00:02

Hi Kitcat, you sound a bit like I was feeling in April, please please do try al-anon, give the number a phone first if you are nervous (I was and I did)! I was very upset and cried mostly, but they were so nice and really I did feel better almost immediately. I understand why even thinking about leaving is so difficult. I was told not to make a decision right away but to take care of myself until I was thinking more clearly, so don't be afraid that they'll tell you 'leave him' or anything like that (they won't :)). I hope you manage to get to a meeting but even reading the literature can help you understand some of what you are feeling. Good luck x

Hi Bobblehat, it sounds brilliant about your DH and well done for 'living your life for you and sidestepping his chaos', I really hope things are coming good for you.

I peeked back on to see how Ready4anothercoffee is getting on with furnishing the new house? Hope it's going well Ready!

Hi Attilla :) hope you're enjoying life, still can't thank you enough for your advice and help back in April and since.

kitcat83 · 24/09/2010 10:19

Morning everyone, thought I would give you an update on whats been going on this week....
I hope that you have all been having a good week?
Well DH has had no alcohol since sunday and is doing very well although I think secretly he is finding it a struggle. He has had a mood on all week, tired all the time and I know is struggling to sleep!! I have been talking to the al anon councilor this week and told DH this morning about going as I felt he should know how much his drinking has been effecting me and DS. He went mental saying that he cant believe I went behind his back, that is there a group for men to go to for dealing with hormonal women who are never satisfied and moan constantly?!!!!! Charming. I told him he was being out of order and talked a little about it with him and said that I felt I needed to talk to someone about it outside the family as it is not just his problem! He was calm but quiet after this and went to work with a little crushed face on, I feel awful for him. Is that wrong? I dare say that is the last I hear about it though, I am sure I am going to get " its all your fault" next....

Calyx · 28/09/2010 17:51

Aww Kitcat, don't worry any more about what he says about you talking to/going to al anon. I was really worried about telling my DH about going the first time; I almost didn't go in case I would come back all red-eyed from crying and he would see. I was advised here on MN just to go because it's not for him or even about him that you're going - it's for YOU and no-one else.

I told my DH that I was having a hard time with his drinking, which he could see because I would nag, cry, get angry, go silent etc etc every time he went near a can of lager. I asked him if he could see that I was going mental and he said yes, he could see that 'something' was bothering me. I told him that I had been doing some reading and been on an internet forum and had realised that my problems with his drinking were MY problems. Not his problem and in fact nothing to do with him.

I told him that I realised that he didn't have a problem with drink, I did. Then I said that I needed to learn how to stop focusing on his drinking and start focusing on making myself feel better, and to do that I was going to start going to al-anon meetings.

I also told him I had read a codependency book and realised I had issues with drinking long before I even met him (true) and that if I didn't go to al-anon and learn how to deal with my feelings then I would end up continuing to take it out on him whenever he had a drink, which wouldn't be good for either of us.

Once I had been to the first meeting he did kind of ask whether I had talked about him. I told him the truth - we didn't talk about our alcoholic, we just talked about ourselves, how al anon was helping us, and that each person at the meeting would stand and 'share' experiences which helped others, like how he or she had dealt with a problem that week and then how he or she felt that al-anon literature or meetings had helped them to go about the problem that way. My DH could see from day 1 that I was feeling a lot better and so he never had a problem with me going.

Try not to feel bad about his 'little crushed face' because it may be this that helps him to actually see that he does have a problem. My DH actually cut right down on his drinking from then on, without me discussing it with him. I still can't believe it as I thought the minute I stopped nagging him he would take that as carte blanche to just drink all the time. The opposite has happened and I'm still stunned.

I am learning to let him make his own decisions and mistakes. I have learned that if he does come in late and drunk it's nothing to do with me and I am learning to let him deal with the consequences of his drinking (I don't get up early to set his alarm for work while he's sleeping any more for example - he has slept in once but now he always makes sure to set it himself).

If he does say 'it's all your fault' you just tell him that you don't make him drink. You can tell him that you don't like him drinking but that from now on you're taking nothing to do with it. I told my DH when he was sober, that al-anon recommended I don't engage with him if he's drunk and that if/when he does come in drunk and start annoying me I will leave the room. I've only had to do that once and he didn't follow me to annoy me in the spare room (he did swear and moan but he didn't follow me!) and the next day of course he didn't remember anything - the difference was that I was in a good mood as I hadn't put up with his drunken gibberings! The whole point is to make it so that you just don't take anything to do with it.

Once you're feeling on an even keel, some time down the road, THEN if he's still drinking too much you may be in a position to decide whether this is what you want to live with. I think my DH has stopped getting really drunk purely because he now realises that I have more self-esteem and that I could actually leave him at some point if needs be.

I hope my ramble has helped! Lots of luck. Spend time just looking after yourself. I just stop and think "what do I need to do right now to look after myself" when I'm feeling uptight/upset. Oh and well done for speaking to the al-anon counsellor! :)

secretsquirrel1 · 29/09/2010 11:08

Well said Calyx!

Life sure brightens up when you start living yourself and not 'through the alcoholic'.

And, as Calyx has shown, the world didn't end when she took the focus off what the alcoholic was doing and started to put it onto herself.

Hope everyone else is ok (waves at Ginnny, Ready & Atilla!)

ginnny · 29/09/2010 12:13

I'm better than OK - for the first time in years I'm very very happy Grin
Ex P has sunk to a whole new level of vileness since he found out about my lovely new boyfriend and as a result I've completely cut him off. If he calls I hang up or reject the call, if we see him in the street I turn around and walk off.
A few weeks going out with someone normal - who is capable of going out without drinking has made me see the total chaos that my life used to be.
Finally I am free from all that madness and have never felt so good!!!
Sorry if I sound smug - but there really is light at the end of the tunnel for all of us, however long it takes you reach it.
Smile

OP posts:
kitcat83 · 29/09/2010 16:13

Thanks Calyx xx
Thanks Everyone .... Ginny I am glad for you that you are in a very happy place, its good to hear that it is possible Grin
In fact even though it has only been a week and is still very early days my DH is doing really well, is happier , easier to talk to and the family home is much more settled at the moment. Long may it continue!!!

simpson · 29/09/2010 21:28

Hi

Just wonder if I can gatecrash your thread and ask for some advice?? Smile

I split with H 14mths ago (my choice) due to his mental health problems and his drinking which imo was causing his MH problems in the first place...

We have 2 Dc who are now 5 & 2.

Basically he moved back to Ireland (where he is from) and came over to see Dc every few mths or so...

The first trip over he got pissed at sunday lunch and I had to beg ask him to stop drinking as he was ignoring Dc etc...

The 2nd time he came over he turned up so pissed he could not stand up Angry but was ok for rest of visit...

The most recent trip he came over a few wks ago and was ok and actually engaged with DC the most for ages However on the morning of him going back (he stays at my mum's) he sneaked a bottle of something and got so drunk he was arrested at tube station Angry

My parents (who are doing this all for Ds 5 who adores his dad) said enough is enough he cannot come over anymore which is fair enough so H has been told he cannot see Dc till he sorts himself out, cue phonecalls from his toxic mother saying he is a broken man etc (wtf!!)

Anyway against my better judgement I have let him regularly call DC every wk which I don't beleive is in their best interest and delaying the inevitable tbh and today I rang him for him to speak to DC and he sounded drunk AngryAlthough he denyed it (of course!!)

WTF do I do?? Does there come a point where I say enough is enough iyswim. How do you explain to a 5yr old he cannot speak/see his daddy? Sad

ginnny · 30/09/2010 10:03

Hi Simpson,
I think enough is enough already. He has been given lots of chances to be a good dad and screwed up every time. The answer is in his own hands - if he sorts him self out he can see the dc, if not then he can't.
Sod what his mother says - your children are your responsibility, not him.
As the daughter and ex of an alcoholic your dc will thank you in the long run for protecting them from him.
Good luck!

OP posts:
simpson · 30/09/2010 23:14

thanks ginny Smile

I have appt with solicitor for divorce on Monday and I am going to instruct him to write to H saying there is to be no contact with Dcs until he sorts himself out...

I just cannot see that happening any time soon, but that is up to him I guess....Sad

ginnny · 01/10/2010 09:11

Well he has to hit rock bottom before he will do anything about it. Maybe losing the dc will be his rock bottom.
You are absolutely doing the right thing. Alcoholics don't make good fathers, however much the dc adore them, they still need protecting from it all.

OP posts:
bealzebub · 10/11/2010 09:46

this is rather old but i wanted some guidance about my teenage ds.
i did start a thread yesterday but still don't know what to do

he woud like to drink, he is 16, just, recently on holiday he wanted a dirnk as other teens were - i relented but it is strange as DH has given up earlier in the year after a battle with the booze. i dont drink now either, in an aid to dh.

ds had soem frineds round recently while we were out and had drink. dh was annoyed with me that i wasnt more annoyed with ds.
in retrospect perhaps i should have been annoyed.
i will link my yesterday's thread.
here for some suggestions.

ginnny · 10/11/2010 10:59

Hi Bealzebub.
I'd be wondering why he wants to have a drink to be honest if he's seen how it has affected his dad. Is it peer pressure or something more deep rooted?
I think if you come down heavy on him he will rebel and is more likely to binge drink. If you let him know it is not acceptable in the house or in front of you but advise him how to drink in moderation when with friends that is all you can do.
Unfortunately he should not be drinking at all until he is 18, but these days that is not realistic at all Sad
I have all this to come with my boys - I'm dreading it.

OP posts: