Life post DH that refused to sign the post nup!

[mamato3rascals]

I’ve been so grateful for all the advice and support on here over the past year. It’s helped enormously in giving me the strength to leave, and to make sense of the situation along the way. So this is the continuation thread which I’m hoping will be a little calmer and less eventful..!

And this…

Do NOT show him those post its. He would weaponise them.

At the moment he is using her to manipulate you. He thinks that he can make you come back if he can distress her enough.

When he realises that won't happen he will drop the fake upset routine and either start with your character assassination or just drop her completely because she is of no use to her.

You need to take professional advice on how to support her now and how to best help her as he changes tactics.

I’ve been through similar with young children. There were upset for months but they also knew deep down it was the right thing. I would stop seeing exdh if he tries to manipulate dd when you are there. The difficulty will be what he says to her compared to you. What is your routine is she with you more? If he keeps confusing her I would be tempted to cut down the days she is there. Manipulative relationships often transfer to the children when the partner is no longer available. I found I needed to be honest in a childlike way at times but aware that they didn’t need to know everything. However sometimes I was left with no choice due to exdh behaviour. He will move on manipulative men always do, there will probably be a new women who will accept his sad story. I would definitely consider counselling for dd to help her process.

OP, I am 100% supportive of you but I do think you are going to have to detach, harden up and get a grip.

Your husband is an abuser.
Your husband has been abusing you and your children for a long time.

Your husband doesn't care a whit for your children and is continuing to abuse you all.

He wants to punish you and them for this move.
For years he could have stepped up.
That you would entertain his ridiculous texts is bizarre.
They are lies, manipulation and pure bullshit.

They bear absolutely no connection whatsoever to the reality of his fathering of his children.

I would be emailing the school the absolute truth, that he is weaponising the divorce to cause more pain and upset for the children and your eldest is very distressed. Give examples.

In your place I would source therapy asap.
I would also be very very calm.
Don't buy into this hysteria from your child, as it will only prolong it.

Keep with your narrative, daddy will be fine, mummy left because she was very sad as daddy was very nasty to her for a long time, and now both he and mummy will be happier.
That you love her and everything will be ok.

Then move on with the day.
She needs to learn to manage her emotions and your consistent reassurance and then getting on with the day.

Your children need protecting from him.
Encourage her to speak to a teacher if she likes.
Perhaps if the teacher hears what a horror her father has been for years, she might involve safe guarding.

Your daughters remark about not marrying a nasty boy and hurting her children is surely something you should be very proud of.

She HAS made the connection between being badly treated, leaving and that children are impacted by a nasty man behaving badly.

You are modelling strength to her.
She will get through this.

The very very worst thing you could do now is take on his manipulative bullshit and parent her though guilt.

This went on years and years, THAT should be your regret.

Your younger children are going to be fine.

Do not allow yourself to continue to be played by such an awful man who thinks NOTHING of emotionally abusing his old children.

Start texting him back how his behaviour is hurting the children.....every single time.

Nothing else.

You can do this.

DO NOT show the notes to dh. You are her safe space. Keep it that way. Dh keeps making her feel like she has to pander to him and make him feel better. That’s not a good thing. With you, she screams her pain. That’s a much healthier situation. It’s your job to accept it.

For what it’s worth, I have a collection of very long letters from dd detailing how awful she felt over stuff. And all my faults. And they started from about age 9 - when her handwriting became fluid enough to keep up with her thoughts and lasted until into her teens. She’s behaving in a very age appropriate way, in my uneducated opinion.

A really tough read, so can’t imagine your stress levels right now, but WELL DONE!
YOURE doing amazingly, and when your DD comes out the other side of all this, she’ll realise which of her parents stepped up for her.

Good Lord do not show the post-its to ex !!!

I feel he needs to see these so he knows how important it is to be supporting her through.
He already sees. He already knows. He just doesn't care.
He is too immature and selfish to put his DD before himself. The post-its will just become more ammunition for him to attack you with. Because attacking you, and using his DD to do it, is more important to him than her welfare.

Buy her a really nice hardback blank notebook for her to use as a journal to write whatever she wants in. Never read the journal yourself - that would be a huge betrayal. And certainly never show the journal to Ex.
Encourage her to show the journal to her counsellor (when you get a counsellor).

Why on earth would you show him proof that his abuse is working?

Honestly OP, you really need to wake up to just how badly abused you are and your child is.

Please do not become a party to his abuse of her.

IMO you showing him those messages would be you allowing yourself to be used by him, to abuse her futher.

Let her write her notes.
Let her feel the control of writing her notes.

Stick to your narrative above, everything will be fine, this is best for mum and dad, and then just crack on with the day.

No drama, no dragging it out.
Brisk, calm and firm.

If she sees you coping well and not falling apart, she will follow your lead.

She has been living in chaos for so long.
She desperately needs the calm security of a peaceful house and a mother in control.

Fake it till you make it.

Get some therapy asap for yourself.
The suggestion of showing him proof is working is madness.

You need to realise this.

Your DH is going to actively undermine your daughter's mental health to try to force you to stop the divorce process.

Don't let him. Start writing down every single thing he does to undermine the break, to undermine your daughter's emotional well being and engage a child therapist, and a really good divorce lawyer.

Definitely don’t show him the notes. You’re doing really well, just keep reiterating that she is not responsible for him, and that this is best for you both. Then show that with your actions, listen and validate her feelings but don’t play into them like he does, instead model a calm and happy home for her.

if the size 6 thing is serious part of helping her is showing that you are ok. Eat properly, take time to sleep and rest. As a pp said, fake it till you make it.

Don’t ever show him these notes

Yeah don't show him the Post Its. You need to stop treating him like an adult. His emotional response to all of this is like a child's. You wouldn't show a child those Post Its and expect them to deal with them rationally. You can't show him.

I am so sorry that your daughter is struggling so much with this, but you continue to be a very impressive human doing all the right things. This period of her life will profoundly affect her, but with your support, it won't define her. I have every faith that you'll continue to be amazing, and she will get through this.

Much love to you.

Sympathies, OP. I went through something similar with dd and her dad. It was tough and in the end it was just time that made things better. DD got older and harder for her father to manipulate and eventually she decided to stop seeing him. I do remember one conversation with dd that helped. She was saying that she was worried about each of her parents when she was in the other one's house, I said quite casually "Well, if we're both a bit crap socially, it's up to us to make more effort. It's not up to you to fix". I saw her little shoulders relax. It was a re-framing that dialled back the drama and took the solutions away from her.

This.

Also, you need to enlist a family therapist who will speak to DD separately but also (from experience) I know they can write to DH and tell him that his behaviour is hurting his child.

He is being a terrible parent by weaponising this against you and DD.

Don’t show him the post it’s that would be like showing someone her diary

This is long, but your situation brings up so much for me.

My parents split up when I was very small. I remember feeling responsible for their emotions. Especially feeling sad for my father who seemed unable to do the basic things to take care of himself or a home. He sounds like your ex in many ways.

Mom never said a bad word about him. She was sad and cried at first, but didn’t put us in the middle while he was endlessly telling us she’d screwed us up by getting divorced. I absolutely believed I was screwed up, for years, but didn’t blame her.

So he eventually turned that same cruelty toward us, his children. It took decades to really grasp that he’s just not mentally well. I wondered if it would have helped for someone to just explain that to me when I was young.

Now I view him simply as an immature child. Selfish and without any coping mechanisms. We have a decent relationship but it’s because I learned to set firm boundaries (and moved very far away). He will still talk about “the divorce”, 50+ years ago if I allow it.

I think you should explain things to your daughter in age appropriate ways as she grows up. You’ve begun doing that by explaining you couldn’t live with someone that was unkind.

I would also begin gently letting her know that Dad is really competent and it’s his responsibility to take care of himself. That he is able to do that, because he is an adult. That it’s his job.

Then teach her to focus on her own emotional needs and responsibilities. That we each need to be doing that. That we can learn how to regulate ourselves emotionally. I would look for a therapist that with that focus.

If she shares anything he has done or said, ask her questions like “How do you feel about that?” “Why don’t think he told you that?” Focus back on her and her feelings.

You saved your kids by getting out.

I just want to pop back and reinforce OP that you are still in the right and NOT unreasonable. You might have instigated the split but he is the cause of this. Not in front of the kids obviously but don’t forget to keep reminding him of this. Every gushing text or snide comment just grey rock him, or if you need to then reply with “don’t forget you caused this”.
You didn’t leave out of nowhere. It’s a result of his behaviour.

Kids whose parents stay together “for the children” are not happy.

"At the same time I feel he needs to see these so he knows how important it is to be supporting her through."

Don't show him this! That's a reaction, and he wants that reaction, because the target in all of this is YOU. He knows he's upsetting her, he doesn't care. He wants to hurt you, and he'll instrumentalise DD to do that.

Don't feed him, it'll just cause him to persist with this tactic, to DD's detriment.

Once he can no longer get to you via DD, he'll switch to something else that will hurt or distress you.

Btw have you sent a firm flat cold email about his inappropriate behaviour with DD? You need to do that to establish a record of his behaviour in case there are legal issues later.

Once you have sent that, gray rock his manipulation of DD. Focus on helping DD through this.

Firmly this.

My life changed when I began thinking of my father as a petulant 12 year old boy with no emotional maturity. I feel sorry for him, but it’s not sane to expect more from him at this point.

Don’t expect him to change or treat him like he’s rational. He’s not and he is unlikely to evolve.

The good thing here OP is that her worries are normal and natural and at least she's emotionally in tune with her feelings. So she can articulate them.
Therapy will bw the best way for her to process this. You can't fix it all especially when you have him to deal with

Well done on getting your children and yourself out of an abusive household.

A previous poster gave a great response to refute the claims your husband made- I would definitely consider a written email/ text response along those lines.

Definitely look into counselling for your daughter. I would contact her school in the first instance , and ask whether you can speak with the pastoral lead about the current situation and your daughter’s well being. They may have a trained counsellor in school already , and if not they may be able to signpost you to suitable services in your area.

I would also raise your husband’s emotionally abusive behaviour as a safeguarding concern. You are quite rightly concerned that he can no longer emotionally abuse you , and he now seems to be deliberately causing your daughter to become emotionally distressed in order to manipulate and attack you.

You know your daughter is sharing her new circumstances and feelings with others, so it’s best to let school know so that they can be alert to the need for pastoral support.

In the meantime, continue to reassure your daughter that you understand her sadness and fears, and the move is the only way to manage a situation which was causing unhappiness for the whole family. DD observed for herself that Daddy was unhappy when the family all lived together. Both parents are responsible for making sure that children are loved, safe and cared for , even if there are times when that safety, love and care doesn’t look like what children expect or are used to. Remind her that children are never responsible for providing an adult’s happiness- it’s an adult’s responsibility to take care of himself/ herself.

Perhaps you should use one of those parenting apps to communicate with STBXH with, to keep communication with him to the absolute minimum.
Thank you for keeping us updated.

I also reported it and fan can see they have changed it.

What others especially turtle says. When he says it’s damaging her you say /write very firmly ‘you are damaging her. Your insistence on making sure a 7yo child knows how sad you are is you putting your feelings onto her instead of parenting her. You are her dad, you must stop harming her and start parenting her. Reassure her. Tell her it will be fine. Be a parent. Stop calling and messaging me, you’ve happily gone weeks without speaking to your children before and you know I take great care of them.’