MARCH 2026 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.
This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.
The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!
One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;
'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'
Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."
Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.
Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."
6

@Eeriefairy I second what ManchesterMonkey advises about being careful what you take on with your parents. You have no obligation to do anything for them, especially as they are not supporting you in safeguarding your child. Even if you decide not to go NC over this, neither they nor your sister can force you to do any more than you want to for them or with them. Even if your sister decides to become their default helper, she does not get to dictate that you must step in to provide help that she can't manage. If there are things they can't manage between them they must find alternative ways to do it. Having fallen foul of this with my mum and brother my advice would be not to ever start doing anything for them that you would not be happy to continually do. I've found that when I've stepped in to avert or deal with a crisis it has been taken as evidence that this is something I can do more easily than anyone else and should be expected to do for ever. There are lots of options for paid help, local authority help, other organisations etc to assist elderly people with getting to appointments and lots more- just because they refuse to use them does not mean you have an obligation to step in. Now I've started just agreeing with them that whatever they are complaining about sounds very difficult and asking what their plan is to deal with it and what other options they've considered.

@ManchesterMonkey Your brother's 'I'll lose my job if I don't do this' comment sounds very familiar. I am also self employed and GB2 repeatedly tells me that he can't do things for mum because he has to go to work and if he doesn't he will lose his job and his house. I've tried to explain so many times that being self employed does not equal being retired and that I also have a mortgage to pay. I know your brothers aren't like mine but there does seem to be a theme that they assume employed son = important work with important bills to pay, self employed daughter = sitting around all day drinking tea and earning a bit of pin money on the side. It sounds like your mum is quite sensible and amenable to a retirement home when she could get the support she needs on a daily basis, so your brothers need to understand that if they are not happy with that they will have to take a full share of the work involved in the alternative.

Oh no, @Foodfumbles absolute nightmare. That sounds really controlling of your mum. It’s really bad of her to ‘tot up’ your time. Not on. So bloody ungrateful.

Is your brother normally helpful? Could you consider getting a care package for her? I used to marvel at how polite my toxic MIL was to the carers whilst being so incredibly vile to us.

Can you pretend to be ill one day this week? Cos you are actually going to get ill as the body really does keep the score.

My brother’s remark was absolutely off the scale annoying. Mr Monkey just laughed - he’s a former full time trade union official - and said there is no way he would lose his job over taking his frail 80 year old mother to a key hospital appointment. His country’s unions are shit hot, he’s senior and very well regarded by his boss and the board of a pan-European company and - oh yes - 16 years ago when he was being bullied by some twat, when he was lower down the food chain, the HR department in his company took VERY seriously his complaint as they knew it could end in a costly and nasty tribunal. He managed to get a relocation package to the lovely country he now lives in with his flat PAID for a year, PAID weekend flights back and to the UK to see his wife. He’s never looked back.

He just doesn’t want to do it. He could rearrange the appointment. If Baby Bro refuses to do it, I’m going to refuse too. I get it. They are both terrified by what is happening to our mother, but the only way to deal with this is to communicate, not make pathetic excuses and to share the load with me. They both know I have bipolar. If I go under triggered by stress they will be taking on all of it. And I think my very mild mannered partner would go absolutely Fucking medieval on them.

i hope @formalwellies that you have a day of massage, manicure, pedicure and lunch with the girls tomorrow cos as we know that’s the life of a self-employed woman, right? I’m just booking my day at the spa…😂😂😂😂

@ManchesterMonkey Yes, I think it’s very common for people to “drop the mask” as they get old, and be the real them. Fine if you’re a nice person, but not great if you’re not. My dad has become more outrageously argumentative and difficult. My mum just shows zero interest in me.

The emotional immaturity thing is basically that they can be day to day intelligent, sensible and caring (particularly of physical needs), but if something triggers them emotionally in a way that’s overwhelming or makes them uncomfortable they can be volatile and unreasonable (or cold/rejecting). And if they can’t handle their own feelings, they can’t handle their children’s either. They can say “I love you” and I think they can even mean it, but they can’t handle any real emotional connection or especially pain.

When I was a teenager I struggled with self harm. My DSis could tell something was wrong and one day she asked me what was going on and over a few hours she got it out of me I’d been self harming. When she told my mum, my mum had a massive screaming tantrum about it saying things like what did I have to feel sad or angry about, my childhood was so much better than hers had been.

At the time (and for 20+ years) I felt terrible for hurting her. I thought I was a bad daughter and she was right, my parents looked after me, what was my problem? There was no attempt to connect with me emotionally about why I felt the need to self harm. I was told to stop doing it and that was that. I did, because I didn’t want to hurt my mum, but I struggled with the same feelings and ended up with alcohol problems when I was older. (They did not support me in any way when I stopped drinking either).

I can see now that her reaction was part of a pattern of getting me to keep my feelings to myself. She never wanted to know how I was feeling (before or after that incident) and that’s why I felt so lonely and had low self esteem - I was always treated like I didn’t matter. That moment became about her pain instead of mine. And that had actually been my life all along. And my DSis. I really think that’s why she ended up in an abusive relationship. We were always putting our parents feelings first and not acknowledging our own.

My DSis and I have been her emotional support for as long as I can remember, but it’s only very recently that I have even questioned the fact that maybe she should have been ours and never was.

@Eeriefairy that’s really interesting. My close mate had that from her dad. She parentifed him through his divorce from her mum. She is now - rightly - NC. So grim for you and your sister.

Oh, here’s my baby brother back. We’re ringing The Corporate One to agree the care package, so we can talk to my mum. Pretty sure he’s been doing a secret call. I am extremely intuitive. But I’m getting my hair done tomorrow and going to a work - supportive and very kind client - event this afternoon which will REALLY cheer me up.

Call with both siblings done. Better call. But a slightly chilly atmosphere as I said goodbye to Baby Brother. We usually hug.

I really don’t want this shit to affect our relationships as we’ve always had a good one and the last thing my mum needs is a fractured family.

I didn’t get to the medical appointment in June but I will.

i just don’t get why this has happened. I’m disappointed in them. I
normally go to see Europe brother in the summer for a holiday, but rethinking that.

I’m meeting our US cousins at the end of May in Europe and i
wsnf this shit on an even keel as i don’t want a bad atmosphere. My cousins )women) are amazing and they get it. My wider family - all women - do as they get the flipping patriarchy!

@formalwellies Thank you for your advice and the info here - I was not aware of other options etc. It is something we’re going to have to talk about and look into over the coming years I think. I had always imagined I would have my mum come and live with me (there is a big age gap between my parents and my dad’s health has already been in decline for a while so it’s likely he would go first). My DH and I had even looked at places with annexes or that kind of thing so she could live with us and have her own space.

I feel somehow like I would be abandoning her. I never realised before how much I have always felt like it’s my job to look after her. The thought of saying no to this makes me feel guilty, even in spite of everything. She actually started prepping me when I was about 8 or 9 for the future in which I would look after her as an old lady.

@ManchesterMonkey It’s one of the reasons I thought “well we took you to stately homes” was so relatable. You’ve had your physical needs apparently looked after, so what could you possibly complain about? I recommend the book.

I hope you manage to maintain your relationship with your Baby brother and the chilliness was just stress and not personal.

Can I join? I don't think my parents were abusive, more clueless really. I'm an only child, small family anyway, always felt my dad was disappointed by me. I didn't achieve much academically, haven't had a career, just jobs, divorced twice. My mum is now 87, lost my dad ten years ago. My mum is hopeless, cries at the slightest thing, spends money on things she doesn't need and doesn't have very much money at all. I don't like her, I never have really, but as an only child I'm having to go once a week to take her out. In return she buys me lunch. I run a car so that I can ferry her around to appointments and shopping. I do her online shopping because she won't attempt to do it herself. I count down every minute I'm with her and am fuming by the time I leave. It's nothing big, just her asking what I'm doing on my phone, telling me to put a coat on, do my coat up, stupid stuff. She prattles on about stuff that doesn't interest me like her favourite TV shows, what her neighbours are doing etc etc. I know I sound heartless but I really don't want to go round again. I can't stand her. But there's no one else. No other family. None of my children live nearby and none of them really like her. She doesn't think anything's wrong, thinks I love her and like spending time with her. I tried to touch on a few things last week, like why we moved around so much, did she know how difficult it was for me to make me friends at various new schools etc but she didn't understand. I can't be bothered to bring any more up with her, she won't get it at all. I'm ashamed to say I'm hoping she doesn't live much longer but she's healthy and her mother lived to 93 so she'll probably live longer than that.

I'm sorry, I just had to let it all out. I wish I had a valid reason to go no contact but I haven't. She didn't abuse me, just didn't know how to spend time with me, and that was repeated with my children, she couldn't play with them and only spent time really with my eldest .. which I'm also angry about.

Sorry, sorry .. I'm ashamed to write all this down, I just needed to get it out of my head.

@Eeriefairy It sounds like you've spent a lifetime being taught that it's your role to look after your mum/keep the peace. I can relate to that- I was always 'the sensible one'. My parents always made a big deal about supporting family no matter what and I foolishly assumed this meant that they would support me if needed, even if it was difficult and that as 'the sensible one' I would be believed and my decisions respected. Like you, it was only when I made a stand to protect my children (and myself) that I started to realise that my parents' primary motivation was protecting the image they wanted for our family and they were prepared to turn a blind eye/deny there's a problem if acknowledging a problem threatened that. My advice is to put yourself and your child first. Looking after an aging parent is challenging in any circumstances but even harder when the parent only thinks of themselves, extended family have unreasonable expectations and there is not a close bond. I'd start being less 'available' for helping your parents and get everyone used to you not being the default helper. I certainly wouldn't entertain having your mum living with if/when she's on her own and if the subject is alluded to make it clear that won't be happening.

@catshatsandchats Many people who post on this thread start by saying that their situation isn't that bad really, and almost all of us feel some degree of shame or guilt about our situation. This is the right place to come and vent with people who will never tell you 'but they're family!'.

Catshatsandchats

You only need to give your own self permission to walk away. Your mother was not a good parent to you when you were growing up and she has not changed. Your own now adult children don’t like her either. Stop doing stuff for ungrateful people who don’t thank you like your mother. Deal with your fear obligation and guilt here through therapy.

It’s ok to say no more because you nolonger want to do stuff for her. I would start here by reducing the frequency of visits to once every two weeks rather than every week.

Thank you and also @formalwelliesfor your replies. I couldn't sleep worrying about it all and in the end wrote her a message saying I won't be coming at the moment and I won't be reachable on the phone. I did say she can message me if she needs cat food or something ordering. She has no idea that she has done anything wrong. I know guilt will get to me eventually because she's elderly, but she's not a child and I'm not going to mother her! She has a cleaner and someone who will bring her shopping so she really doesn't need me. She just wants to talk at me. She doesn't even listen to me most of the time. I can't forgive her fire the things she's don't to my children and said to them ... not feeding my 17 year old son when I was on my (4 day) honeymoon and she was babysitting ... starting to cry when my 7 year old daughter said she missed me when I was on the same honeymoon and saying to her she also missed her mummy who was dead!! Ffs!! Even the fact she refers to her parents as mummy and daddy still! She's so infantile! I'm just discovering how much I dislike her. My partner thinks I owe her something because she's my mum.

@catshatsandchats That sounds difficult and I think you are in the right place. The book I have just been reading talks about being allowed to feel what you feel and think what you think - you don’t have to pretend anything to yourself. Get that clarity for yourself first. You can even write it all down “I don’t like when my mum….” etc. It was eye opening for me. I’m sure she’d be absolutely devastated if she read my list, but it’s how I feel and I don’t have to tell her in order for me to understand and validate my own feelings. This is obviously new to me too but has been really helpful.

@formalwellies yes, the sensible one! I was always praised for being so self-contained and never needing any help or support and for being supportive to others. I also think if I had said what I have said about any one outside of the family my parents would have no trouble backing me 100% it’s only because it’s a sort of conflict of interests for them that they undermine my feelings about it. I have told three people about what happened to my DD (including the charity worker) and all three the first thing they said was “Have you been to the police?” I know it isn’t me overreacting but speaking to them it’s like I’m making a mountain out of a molehill.

Yes I think that's what I need to do, write everything down. Can you recommend the book?

@catshatsandchats I just read your update too. I’m so sorry your partner doesn’t understand. Often, when people have normal relationships with their parents they just can’t get their heads around it. I know this already from my DH and his narcissist mother, but I never realised my own parents had been that bad. You don’t owe her anything and I hope it helps you talking to others here who definitely do understand that families aren’t all the same.

Thank you. It's definitely helping to talk about it and read everyone's posts. I feel I haven't anything to complain about because I wasn't abused.

Cross posted again! Yes, it’s called Adult
Children of Emotionally Immature Parents and it’s by Lindsay Gibson. It was recommended on another thread here a few months ago by a few posters and I’m really glad I’ve read it.

Absolutely - it can even be hard to put your finger on what was actually wrong. I’ve had similar feelings about my mum droning on about tv etc. I think it’s a “safe” topic that fills the time so you can’t talk about anything that might make them uncomfortable.

Thank you, I'll look for that!

catshatsandchats

Your partner is wrong. You owe your mother nothing least if all a relationship here and your now adult children do not like her either. This person likely comes from an emotionally healthy family and does not get it, it’s really incomprehensible to them.

@Eeriefairy Minimising/denying/ignoring anything that doesn't fit the image they want to present is a key tool for parents like ours. Mine also act like I am over-reacting when I have expressed very reasonable concerns/unhappiness and put up entirely sensible boundaries. I remember my DM claiming that 'These things happen in every family, but other people are loyal enough to keep quiet!'

@catshatsandchats Your partner is definitely wrong. Does he see first hand how your DM treats you and your DC?

No he doesn't really see it and we've been together three years, a lot of the stuff is back further than that. I tell him but he maybe thinks I'm exaggerating.

Trust me when I say that some parents are lining their kids up years in advance to be their carer. Mr Monkey can remember very clearly folding sheets, cleaning and doing shopping aged nine. This seed was planted by his mother.

Before she went off to the very hot place 😈 she actually said that he should move in with her!

The ‘kind’ invite didn’t include me. I absolutely pissed myself laughing.

She clearly hadn’t considered that he’d been in a 25 year long relationship with me, had his own life and a career. “That doesn’t matter. I can pay you.”

We were at the stage with her where she could have offfered millions and we would have said no.

I think living with abusive / neglectful parents or moving them in with you is a mental breakdown waiting to happen.

I’m not really thinking about moving her in anymore. It’s just that I had always thought I would - before I realised the true nature of our relationship. When I was 8/9, a close family friend had their elderly mother move in and they looked after her until she died. At the time my mum said basically “are you going to look after me like that?” At that age I’d never considered that I would one day look after an old woman, I hadn’t even really thought about having kids. Then my mum said what would happen to her then if I didn’t look after her? So I said well of course I’ll look after you. And since then it’s been at the back of my mind, and obviously more at the front of my mind as she’s got older, that I would do that.

She also used to get my DSis and me to do the laundry and ironing, washing the dishes, hoovering etc. We would do all sorts and then she would say things like “I’ve been at work and done all of the house work” and we’d be thinking, well, actually we did all the house work… but it obviously wasn’t enough. But then, we had a sort of teenage rebellion type feeling against it but afterwards felt like we had been out of order and we had been wrong not to do more or see it her way.

I don’t think I can fully get across how genuinely true I felt it was that she had sacrificed so much and worked so hard and we didn’t do enough to help. I really, literally until very recently, thought that I was the selfish one. It’s a bit tough to get my head around but the more I think about this stuff the more evidence I see that something wasn’t right.

@ManchesterMonkey My DM and GB2 act like my relationship with DH is a bit of a silly phase, and my real loyalty must clearly be to them. I think they both truly believed that even after nearly 30 years together I would leave and move back with mum if she wanted me to. They both say unpleasant things about him to me (GB2 is particularly vile) and the usual theme is that DH is thick, 'common' and vain. They are both really nice to his face (DM because she wants to keep the facade of being lovely and GB2 because DH is bigger than him). DH and I have agreed that DH getting involved in an argument with them won't help us (can't argue with stupid etc) and will just be used as 'evidence' of how unreasonable we are so instead we amuse ourselves by him quoting their comments back to them (out of context) and watching them squirm. (For context, DH is none of those things and I'm sure there's a huge slice of jealousy that he is more successful than GB2 despite being from a very working class background. DH is also not someone that most people would be afraid of but he has been known to escort GB2 from the premises when he's been aggressive in front of him).

@Eeriefairy I don't think it's unusual for children in dysfunctional families to grow up thinking their parents are wonderful and they themselves are somehow lacking. I've seen on this thread, and from my own experience, that once we start to see that this was not true we slowly start to see more and more things that were a bit 'off', especially when we have our own children and are considering how we bring them up. I think you need to give yourself permission to question their version of the past and time to process that.