Am I the only person with a miserable mother?

[Rhiannon]

She lives 3 miles away, has never worked is not rich but lives comfortably. She is so miserable and so tight she nearly squeaks when she walks. We don't have much in common I know but just to get her to come to my home is a miracle. She's a saver me a spender. I like to go shopping, I like my house to look nice and I think my kids are wonderful. I don't think she has ever said a nice word about me or my family. She is always complaining about my son's behaviour, what I buy even though it's often second hand. My son is 6 next week my mother has never been in a shop like Mothercare (2 miles up the road parking right out side)for either of her 2 grandchildren. She has had an unhappy marriage for 45 years but it obviously can't be that unhappy or she'd do something about it. My Dad is obsessed with his two grandchildren and will tuck them in bed whenever he can, may be that's why she stays away.
Constructive criticism only please.

For all of you who, like me, have struggled with difficult or plain abusive relationships with our mothers/fathers, I can't recommend highly enough the book Toxic Parents by psychotherapist Susan Forward.

Rhiannon, Rhubarb etc.. I read your posts about your mothers some time ago. My mother has always been good in the sense of being helpful, like babysitting and just generally doing things to help us when we need it, which I am very grateful for. The only thing is that she has always been fairly critical and she has a knack of making you feel guilty for just about everything... I can remember this from a young age. These days when she gets a bee in her bonnet about something, she can get quite 'mean' - the problem is, I never know what's bothering her or what I've done to deserve it in the first place. She just gets an 'attitude' with me. If I try to confront her and ask her what's wrong, she pretends she doesn't know what I'm talking about. Then next time I see her or talk to her, she acts like everything's fine again. I've never really felt accepted by her and I'm just wondering how you all have coped with your own situations... has it affected your own self-esteem, because of the way your mothers have treated you? Or have you managed to move on? My dh says "don't let your mother's opinion/attitude affect you", but it always does. My mother and I are very different and I think maybe this disappoints her.

Liamsmum, try Deborah Tannen's new book "I only say this because I love you." Her books are great and help understand why people say/do things that are hurtful. I have a wonderful, but stormy, relationship with my mother, but it's taken many years to get where we are (i am 39) and we still work at it all the time. Communication is essential, though it sounds like your mother is not really open to it. Good luck. Just make sure you don't do the same to your children.

I think the age of your mother and level of education is quite relevant. It is much more difficult to talk reason with someone older (in their second childhood) like my mother with a limited education (not too interested in civilised discussions etc). SHe is often quite beastly to me and my DH, stirrs trouble, plays control games. At the same time very loving towards our child and fiercely protective of all of us, despite our endless failures.

I am the only one who can tolerate her most of the time because I forgive constantly and just put her down as a dear old biddy who likes the sound of her own voice and opinions.

Of course this would be totally different with more sophisticated witches that are not so easy to excuse

Liamsmum, in answer to your question yes it has affected my relationship with my mum. It used to affect my self-esteem too. My mum is forever throwing sarcastic comments our way, too keen to put us down, slow to praise. If I did any major achievements, such as get my degree, it would be all down to God's intervention, never my hard work - it's a miracle I still go to Church! Recently at my nephew's christening she put us down again - she told my aunt that me and my older sister were 'strange' and 'not a 100%'. This upset my sister, but I just shrugged it off. My solution was to marry a man who made me feel special, and wanted and capable of anything. I no longer have to listen to my mother, I moved away so I don't have day-to-day contact which helps. I'm not dependant on her in any way. The best advice I received was to stop expecting from her, as I would only be disappointed. And that is exactly what I have done, I do not expect praise and when she puts me down I simply laugh it off, I don't confront her, it's a waste of time. I know that I am a worthy person and there is nothing she can do to bring me down. She is the one who has my pity, she has lost the respect of her children and her grandchildren hardly know her, my dd is frightened of her! I feel so sorry for her that I no longer have any bitterness towards her. This letting go has enabled me to move on with my life and I am a much more confident person.

This is what my advice is to you. Cherish the love you have from your children, to them you will always be special and you can do no wrong in their eyes. Accept all compliments, never cancel them out by saying 'yes but...' and then putting yourself down, just say 'thanks'. List your achievements and be proud of them. And lets face it, who wants to be like their mothers anyway? Be proud that you are different from her, it means your children will have a better relationship with you. You are a special person, you just need to believe it. Create a bubble around you that your mother cannot penetrate, and any hurtful comments she makes will simply bounce off the bubble and not affect you.

I hope this helps.

Thanks Rhubarb, much appreciated. I've been trying to work out for years what's been bothering me, and a lot of it comes down to my relationship with my mother. My father was also very distant towards me in my teenage years (he was ALWAYS in a foul mood), but he is great now - he's acknowledged where he went wrong and is sorry for how he treated my brother and I. He is very helpful and loving now, and I never receive any kind of criticism from him. My mother is another story, something I'll probably never really understand. Thanks again for your advice, it does help me a lot.

Rhubarb, that's exactly what I've done - not expecting anything and I don't have a bubble but a wall around me now.

I don't ask her out with us/shopping as I know she doesn't want to come. I used to feel so let down with her constant no's so now I don't bother asking.

She spends most of her week rambling, including all day Sat and Sun so we only usually see her for a couple of hours once a week anyway.

I have been dieting for 6 weeks now, I'm working hard on it and amazingly enough she knocked on my door (she never knocks) with a packet of doughnuts after she found out. She scoffed in my face when my Dad suggested I only needed to lose a stone. Another story. R

Some mothers cannot stand to see their children live a life without them. Once they are no longer needed they do not know what to do, so they try to find a way to make their children need them once more. Crushing their self-esteem, making them feel low and worthless is one way mothers stay close to their children. They know then that their children will never have the confidence to fully fly the nest, then mother can come in, tutting and criticising and wondering how their children would ever cope without them.

Pity them as they obviously do not have a life of their own. Encourage them to get out more, lock your doors so they have to knock, then be busy yourselves so they have to look elsewhere for their entertainment. Get them used to the idea that you no longer depend on them and they may start to drift away of their own accord. My relationship with my mother has improved as I don't live within travelling distance for her and I am busy with my own life, so her criticisms no longer matter to me. It is hard to see her indifference to my daughter, and for my daughter to treat her as a stranger because she never sees her, but it is a small price to pay for relative happiness without her.

I have a dilemma. My mother is due to come on Thursday with my stepfather, the reason she is coming is because when dd was about 9 months old, my mum bought her a bed from a sale (she thinks presents can make up for emotional neglect). I hate her buying me furniture, she does not share my taste and she knows that in our little 2 up 2 down we have no-where to store a bed. So for ages she has been telling me that my dd is ready for a bed, basically from the age of one, so that I would take this bed off her hands. I have always come up with an excuse as to why we cannot take this bed. Now dd is 2, my mother never saw her on her birthday, she thought a phone call would suffice. My sister made the effort to catch the train with 4 children in tow to come and see me, my mother sits at home, car in the driveway, and doesn't bother.

So now she expects me to give up my Thursday - normally I take dd to a coffee group which she has just started to enjoy and it gives me a break - so that she can deliver this bloody bed, stay for 5 minutes and go, oh and my stepfather will no doubt make the usual sarcastic comment somewhere along the way. I really don't want her to come but don't know how to put her off much longer. I have started to resent her as she shows little interest in me or dd, just moans about her various illnesses (this week it is mainly IBS). I dread her coming, I don't want the bed, she isn't ready for one, we've nowhere to put it and I'm pretty sure I'll hate it, but I cannot tell her so as I still don't want to hurt her. She reminds me of a life I would much rather forget and just recently I have been feeling a horrible tightness whenever I speak to her, like I am holding too much in.

What do I do?

Oh Rhubarb, have I been there!

You need either to find some way of telling her you don't want the bed (if you really can't bear to could DH? could you write?) or accept it, having already made arrangements to sell it/dump it/give it away.

You don't need to be scared of her anymore - you're an adult with your own life and family and she can only still have control and power over you if you let her.

Why not try just giving her a ring, saying something like, 'About this bed, mum, dh & I feel that dd is definitely not ready for it yet. I do appreciate you getting it for her, and I do realise it must be a pain having it hanging round your house, but we simply don't have the space to keep it until we need it. I think we need to decide whether you're ok having it at your house for a while longer, or if it's a real nuisance for you shall we think about selling it?'

I suspect that this is causing you such an intense emotional reaction because of deep seated pain, hurt and anger about your upbringing and the quality of your relationship as adults. I found the book 'Toxic Parents' by Dr Susan Forward an absolute eye-opener and phenomenally helpful.

Forgive me if I've overlooked previous postings from you about issues with your mother, but did you have a particularly unhappy upbringing? Happy to listen if you'd like. best wishes Mopsy xx

Thanks Mopsy! Both dh and I have been telling her that dd is not ready for a bed yet, but we've been telling her that for a year and my mum has decided that at 2, she is ready for a bed. If I do accept it and sell it, what do I do if she finds out? I have been hurt by her in the past but don't particularly want to be responsible for hurting her. It's not just the bed, it's the fact that she is coming, I can't face seeing her or my stepdad right now. I am fed up of listening to her problems when I have a ton load of my own to deal with. I did have a crap upbringing, like a lot of people, but only recently has my mother shown all of us (6 kids) how uncaring she is, not helping my sisters when they were in dire need of help. She gives no emotional support whatsoever.

Recently we were at my nephew's christening and my aunt and uncle were there from Canada, my mum put us down at every given occassion, she called me "strange", told my aunt that my eldest sister was "not 100%" and joked about the eating habits of my middle sister. At the time I let it go over my head. She made no effort with dd, other than try to get her to eat cake which I had asked her not to do. And my stepdad is just as bad, I wrote about him on another thread "Should I see my dad?" I am just so fed up with them and want to make a break, I don't want to be involved in their lives anymore. My sisters phone me with news of further atrocities commited by my mother, but I don't want to know anymore, it winds me up too much.

She will come on Thursday, he will dump the bed in her bedroom after much face-pulling and mutterings. Make a few sarcastic comments either about me or our house, she will tell me what an awful week she has had and how she can't stay long, but what a nice bed she has brought us (as if that makes everything ok), then before she has even taken her coat off she will leave. Aaaarrrggh! I guess what I should be asking is how do I cope with them both, how do I keep my temper? And then she will refer to 'him' as granddad which will make my blood boil - there is no way my dd is ever going to call that man granddad!

So there you go, deep-seated pain revealed in all its glory! Perhaps I had better buy a book on forgiveness! See what a horrible Christian I am! I blaspheme, I judge and I cannot forgive - boy I'm damned!

Rhubarb I'd really recommend you read that book!

I can't describe how much of a revelation it was for me; to be honest it changed my life.

Thinking of you xx

Do you think that you could tell your mother assertively, "Sorry, but dd is not ready for a bed yet, so please do not bring it over". Then, if she insists on doing so, don't feel guilty about arranging to sell it/get rid of it. If she asks later about it, you can tell her honestly, "I asked you not to bring it over as she wasn't ready for it and we didn't have room to store it until she was - it was purely practical".

If she gets upset at that, it's no real loss to you, as you don't "get" anything that matters (like emotional support) from her anyway.

This is pretty much along the lines of what Mopsy has suggested: but you have also mentally prepared for getting rid of it - and NOT to have any guilt about it!

Thank you for your suggestions! JanZ I have tried the confrontational approach with my mum before. Unfortunately if I upset her, then her version of the story gets round to all my family and I find I have to defend myself. Last time I stood up for my sister and myself and told mum how I felt about how she was treating us and about my stepdad, my brother gave me a right ear-bashing saying I should keep my opinions to myself and not rock the boat.

I could chicken out and make something up I guess, but I've been doing that for a year now and feel that this visit is inevitable. It's just a shame that she only visits when she is dropping something off or picking something up, never just to see me and dd socially. I have lost count of the number of times I have been on the train with dd to see her and the rest of my family, but there is only my middle sister who returns the effort. I have a brother who I only ever see about once a year, for major family events, he neither calls me nor visits, which hurts too.

I will read that book Mopsy, thanks. I have kidded myself that I don't need my mother and I am no longer affected by anything that she does, but the truth is I've just been pushing it all to one side, and now this trivial event is setting it all off again. She thinks she can buy love with expensive gifts and money. She practically kitted out the nursery for us! But I wanted to do that, all I wanted from her was support, which I never got. There are certain things I feel I cannot forgive her for, but at the end of the day she is still my mum and I don't want any bad feeling to be there between us. It wouldn't be so bad if she wasn't coming with 'him'. I just know that I am going to be all tense and edgy until it's done and gone now. I suppose I could sell the bed, it's not as if she will find out, she hardly ever comes and I think she's only seen the nursery once! The bloody thing doesn't even have side bars apparently, and it has drawers underneath so no doubt it will be high off the ground - totally unsuitable for a 2 year old! And it's in all different colours - yippee, a multicoloured bed, just my taste NOT! But thanks for listening and your advice, it's good to moan. Mumsnet please do not put this in any book, not that it's relevant to a parenting book anyway.

Does anyone want to buy a bed then?

i sat here looking at the screen wondering what to say. i cant say anything really. as u know my mums strange, i always go to visit her, she never rings..... and as hurtfull as it is she is my mum so i make the effort , but it does get physically and emotionally weary.

am thinking of you!
xxxxx

Rhubarb, sorry no real advicce but I liked your comment in the last post about needing support and not material things from her. Do you think you could ever say something along those lines to her in a 'nice' way, or try and broach the subject in a more subtle way like 'Mum thanks for the lovely (!) bed, could me and dd take you out for lunch one afternoon to thank you properly for it?' i realise this would have to be said through gritted teeth but perhaps if you begin to build a bridge she'll join in?? Just a thought and I know its not that easy, good luck for tomorrow X

Well, good and bad news! She is not coming with the bed, she phoned last night to say that my brother would not look after her foster child as he is going food shopping (bit complicated this) and he couldn't go any other day as then he would have his wife with him and he would spend more. Foster child could not come as the back seats of the car have to be down to fit the bed in. So instead of asking anyone else to look after foster child, she tells me she will send my stepdad down on his own to deliver the bed. I said 'noooooo way!', we would just have to pick it up ourselves in a couple of weeks. So it's good that she's not delivering the stupid bed, but also bad that she won't make a bit of effort to see me and dd anyway. As usual now me and dh will have to travel down there to see her.

I have taken her out once before Lizzer and I thought we had a nice time, but she went home and told everyone that she had a migraine and felt sick all the time but didn't tell me to spare my feelings! Knowing full well that what she said would get back to me! And to be honest, she can never spare any time for me or dd.

Thanks for your support, I guess I'm fine now until the next time......!

Rhubarb - couldn't she just have come and brought stepfather and foster child and left BED!!! It sounds like the bed is the most important party here.

there was a time when my mother in law was saying some horrid things and my sister in law would come round saying " oooh you just wont believe what she has said now" ... after her visits i felt so angry i could cry. after a couple more visits i said to her " please dont tell me anymore, it makes me upset i would rather not know than be this angry and feel this much hate towards one person dont tell me anymore" she blushed, was taken aback of course and didnt visit me anymore, although i made the effort to see her. but the gossip stopped as far as i knew and life could go on as merrily as it could for me which is all i damn well care about really!

Maybe your SIL just liked embellishing the truth to make herself feel important? She probably loved winding you up and may have been doing the same to your MIL.

I spoke to my eldest sister last night who told me that my mum had phoned her and told her that I had asked for the bed! I had apparently said that dd is now ready for a bed and can she bring it down! But as this is second hand information and my sister has a habit of unintentionally twisting people's words, I will have to brush it out of my mind and try not to get any madder. Sometimes I really wish I could do a family-swap, you know like a house-swap? Any offers?

Coming in very late here but did anyone see Oprah (on C5) Tuesday afternoon (I think it must have been Mon/Tue this week). The mum who had one daughter sending her cheques and the other daughter who didn't and felt guilty even though she didn't as she couldn't afford to with her own small family etc etc it made my blood boil as the mother couldn't see what she was doing wrong by expecting the chequeless daughter to send her money etc. Anyway, my sister doesn't bother to phone me always "I was just going to.." or I've been so busy.." so I decided if she was a friend I'd have dumped her ages ago so I don't bother now see how long it lasts!

Rhubarb can't see the sense in swapping with you as when I do speak to my sister it's too similar! Sometimes I feel like ...wait for it the argument bit is coming!

My SIL is a self centred woman who considers the way I bring my kids up is wrong and always takes the opportunity to say so. She doesn't believe in routine and lets her kids run around 'til midnight.

My MIL is a hypocrite who agrees with me when I'm at her house and then slags me off when I'm not there. I do wish she'd do it to my face. We've never got on in 15 yrs and it won't get better now.

My sister - well there just ain't enough room on the page to go there ............

I feel really sad that so many of you don't get on with your family. I've got no immediate female family just wish my mother could have seen her grandchild. I've no aunts or sisters etc...but I suppose even if I did there's a chance we may or may not get on. As for my in-laws that's another thread!