Son is breaking my heart. AIBU to make him move out

[Sheshell]

I was married for 30 years to a man i truly loved but who became abusive 15 years in. It became so toxic that I was totally isolated, could not go anywhere without a child with me to prove I wasn't haven't sex with someone at the shops, couldn't put the washing out to prove I wasn't jumping the fence to have sex with someone. Couldn't make any effort with myself, even brush my hair or wash too often because this was all usedas evidence of affairs. Eventually I had a breakdown and lost a couple of years of memories with my babies because I functioned on automatic. Then my partner got seriously ill. I nursed him for a year whilst still being abused. Even ambulance people would pull me aside and ask if this was a DV situation and was I ok? I stayed because he was dying. Then he died and love, relief, sadness, confusion, anger, grief all mixed up. My adult son moved back during the illness. Not to help but because he had a breakup. He didn't help with care if the house hold. This was meant to be short term. 3 months max. Then he's dad died and this timetable went out the window.
Slowly I clawed my way back to an identity. Supported my kids in their grief.
3 years later, after 2 years of counselling and a life changing trip and massive support from my extended family I am loving myself, making my own decisions and finally realising I have a future.
Recently and quite by accident I met a man who I have a lot in common with. We talk for hours about history, books, architecture and we're starting to have feelings for each other. My son can't accept this. I've been totally honest with the kids as this has progressed. He says it proves I am the whore my husband thought I was. He called me a tramp when I went out for dinner. He's left dog poo on my stairs, spills coffee on the floor on purpose when I've just cleaned it, refuses to put his stuff away and it's just everywhere. This morning I found he had tried to give my dog chillies in the night after I told him they made him very ill before. I love my son but I am now getting the same anxiety and feelings that his dad gave me. I am scared to fo certain things again. I have asked several times to talk it out but everytime I'm told to go away. I can't cope. I need him to move out. Am I being unreasonable,? I know he's in pain for a father that bullied him and I don't know where he'll go because he cant afford to move out. This time I need to protect myself. Its not about the man I've met. That is cery early days. Am I right choosing not to die inside again. Am I right choosing me?

OP alongside the apology, did you tell him the length and extent of the abuse?

It may be that it is easier for him to pretend to believe that you are as his father said, rather than to believe that his Dad was a monster. Children whose parents beat them abusively often prefer to believe that they are bad and deserve it because it is too frightening to believe that the people they depend on are bad / evil. In grieving for his Dad and also a version of a Dad he never had he maybe cannot admit that he was an abusive man so take refuge on telling himself you deserved it. .

None of this is an excuse or a reason for you (or the dog) to endure any more abusive behaviour form him.

You say he came back after a break up - do you know why his relationship broke down? If it was a woman, was he abusive?

Yeah his childhood would have an affect so why reinact that pain he saw what you went through dont allow him to think this is ok, get him removed with a restraining order, if you dont another woman will experience the same pain and trauma let him know your worth more than this. Pack his stuff (maybe add a little dog shit) and kick him out!! Today

OP,
Have you had any therapy for yourself?

I am ordinarily an advocate of, you don't turn your back on your child.

This one? In a heartbeat. You have suffered enough. You are not being unreasonable, and you are absolutely right to choose you.

Take care, my love.

You have to get him out, he is being abusive, but be very careful how you do it and get support, from the police if necessary.

One of the shocking things I realised when I started following Karen Ingala Smith’s work Counting Dead Women was how many women were killed by sons or grandsons.

OP I commented upthread earlier today and have been thinking about you all day. I am so worried for you; you must override your motherly instincts to keep yourself safe. Think of all you've gone through; don't let the nightmare repeat itself. 💐

My ExP was really determined to believe that his dad hadn't been the bad guy. ExP's mother still sees him as a poor little boy who had a difficult childhood, not an adult man who repeatedly scared the fucking shit out of me. She's messaging me, convinced that her son and I might get back together. Please see your son's behaviour for what it is: abuse by an adult man.

Erm…this ‘disrespectful little shit’ is a disrespectful shit because he was imprisoned in a house with a man who abused him, his mother, and siblings for his whole life. His entire role modelling of how to be as a man comes from a sexist psychopathic bully.

and the op isn’t to blame - the disgusting man who did that is where the blame lies - but from her son’s position, she kept him in this house and allowed and enabled this horrible man rather than protected her kids. She is his mother and didn’t protect him from this - again, not her fault as abuse essentially disables you. But put these two things together why would you expect him to be a functioning person?

where do you think he would’ve learned respect from? For himself, for others, for women? Because she modelled no respect for herself (again, not blaming her it’s just a result of abuse), his dad modelled no respect for women nor op. So genuinely, what does anyone expect?

she has to live with the results of her husband’s abuse and unfortunately that gives her a choice - put herself first, or her son first.

She needs to call the police though to stop this behaviour - he’ll never forgive her as she didn’t do it to the dad. She nursed him til his dying day - a son will never forgive being abused because his mum didn’t leave the dad but then she has the balls to stand up to him.

no win situation.

Sending strength to you OP.
Ring womens aid today, they don't just deal with partners, they include other family members too.
Otherwise your local Police domestic violence unit.
You have done more than anyone I know in supporting your abuser through his illness. You absolutely deserve a better life now.

No one is saying it's not to be expected. But it's still irrelevant. Totally irrelevant. He's a 24 year old man. Maybe his father was also from an abusive home. At what point does it stop being a reason for sympathy. 34? 64?

Many abusers came from backgrounds of abuse. But unless you are their paid therapist you do not owe them compassion.

Also, some personality traits are nature, not nurture. Chances are he was always going to be a shit to some degree. His upbringing just showed him the extent he could get away with it.

Op owes him nothing. Not a bean. Does that mean she had no part in who he has become? No. But her guilt won't fix the monster.

Get him OUT. As far away as possible. Hes the same as his father. Unless you want another 30 years of being used and abused get him out of your house NOW.

I’d get him out now. He could have made your dog very unwell. Who even does that? Give your son notice and go and get some well deserved happiness in your life. If one of my adult DC acted like that, they’d be out.

You can call on the police to help. They will take him from the house and will arrest him if he doesn’t go quietly.

You made a terrible decision staying with his father and what he saw then has probably gone a fair way to shaping who he is now. What he saw and heard will have taught him things no child should think. And yes, there’s an element of free choice, but different children take different things from their home environment. He either wasn’t old enough to understand or he didn’t learn that abuse was wrong. But as you don’t have a Time Machine, there’s nothing you can do about that. The best possible thing you can do for him now is to show him that there are consequences to his abuse, you’re not going to tolerate it and there’s a good chance that any future partner of his won’t tolerate it either.

In your shoes, I would wait until he goes out, then change the locks, front and back. Bundle up his emergency stuff (ID, any work stuff, phone chargers, medication, laptop etc, along with a couple of changes of clothes in a bag and leave it in a safe place for him to collect, either in an unlocked garage or shed, or in the recycling bin. Somewhere that means he doesn’t need to come in the house. Tell him to let you know when he’s coming for the rest of his stuff (which will be in bin bags on the door step, at least 3 hours before he’s due to arrive).
Tell him from behind the locked door that you love him, but you spent half your life with an abuser and you’re not going to accept it from him. Tell him that good men don’t frighten women or harm animals and that he needs help. If he asks you where he’s supposed to go, then tell him to present himself at the local council offices and they’ll either provide him with emergency accommodation or give him details of organisations that help the homeless. If he kicks off, then call 999 straight away. If he threatens to break your windows, call 999 before he does it. His only chance is if he learns that there are consequences to his behaviour. You won’t be helping him by not calling the police if he starts kicking off.

Stop justifying yourself to people. You are focussing on the wrong ones, people that haven’t been in that situation don’t always understand, and while that is great for them that they don’t have the personal experience, the not understanding isn’t great for you.

You don’t deserve this, your son is at an age where he can stand on his own two feet and how he lives his life going forward is his decision, if he flourishes, good for him, if he fails it is unfortunate but not on you. Let go of the guilt. There are plenty of hmos he could move into quickly.

Could this be the cause of his relationship ending? Would counselling help him?

Erm... really, was he "imprisoned for his whole life"? He never went to school, never had friends, never moved out and lived with a partner or maintained a job? Oh wait.

He's not a foundling who was raised in the bloody ape enclosure. He's a grown man who is abusing his mother.

You may have missed the part where I said I had an abusive childhood, and witnessed abuse towards others. I have never behaved the way OP's son has behaved. Many on this thread have said similar.

Op the only conversation to have with him, is ' leave my home now, am not going to tolerate your nasty abuse so I need you to leave and pay up what you already owe,

Op this is now your life, please stop this abuse op, no more apologies it was you that got abused by h you carry the scares op not him,

Please take care op

He sounds evil, get him out.

OP - I do hope you can reach out to Women’s Aid because I am afraid for your safety when you tell him (as you absolutely must) that he has to go. He is not only choosing to be abusive, his behaviour is far beyond what most abusers would even do. Please get advice because he sounds very dangerous.

Please don't be distracted by PPs urging you to prove your love for your son, get him into therapy, etc. Your top priority must be your own safety, OP, not to mention that you deserve a happy and peaceful life after all you have endured over the years. 💐

I know how hard it can be, after a lifetime of abusive relationships, to actually believe that you have the right to stick up for yourself. Not only that, but a duty to do so. It is your primary task now.

Please find some kind of support to help you throw him out and change the locks. You have done everything and more for him, and he will just continue to bite the hand that feeds. You must prioritise self-protection. Agree with PPs that he sounds potentially dangerous.

He's 24! Old enough to sort himself out now. That's no longer your job.

Good luck OP, you deserve a happy life and this is your first brave step towards it. 💗

Is that because you're selfish?

3 years later & he's got a problem with you having a life? He needs to go. For your own wellbeing you must make him leave. Purposely trying to make your dog ill is twisted. You can't live the rest of your life like this. Please kick him out ASAP

Get him out for something and change locks

I know, ridiculous isn't it? " He's abusing you, trashing your home and torturing the dog because he cares". I've honestly heard it all now.

It’s so creepy to be that invested in someone else’s love life @Uhghg- it’s genuinely disturbing.

And actually, even is he does need help it's up to him to ask for help and recognise his behavior. OP cannot force him into counselling or treat him like he is 10yrs old, this is a fully grown man of 24yrs old, he stopped being a child years ago. The damage may of been done in his earlier lifetime, I'm sure OP did everything she could to protect and nurture him even if it wasn't enough. I really not sure what people think the OP should do as she can't go back in time and she has to keep herself safe. If she hadn't of met a new man then there would of been another trigger down the road for her son.

And to add I have a very abusive ex which thankfully I got rid of within 4yrs. Did his Dad bully his Mum and was he beaten up by his Dad. Yep 100%. Did that ever warrant threatening myself and my two small children? No it bloody didn't and I literally couldn't careless if he dropped down dead tomorrow other than my son would miss him.