Husband is unrecognisable

[phlebasconsidered]

My DH and I have always been different politically. We've managed it- it's fine to have different views. I'm left, he's Tory.

Or, he was. We have two nearly grown kids, 17 and 18. He's recently been spending more time in the back room watching stuff that i've pointed out is insane. You tube, Brit news or whatever that bilge is, I don't know where it came from. He's justifying his views by citing sexual assaults on white girls. He's basically transmogrified into a fucking idiot and I can't believe it.

We used to differ on economics, sure, but now suddenly he's a 53 year old fascist? I can't talk to him. His arguments turn me around. He's been radicalised- I recognise it from experiences in my profession. He says he's going to the march on Saturday. I've told him i'll go on the opposing one.

There's no way forward as far as I can see. As far as I knew he was still a loving family man but now I just see a big arsehole. He just circles around the phrases when I tried to talk to him.

I would just stand my ground and argue back- he's been a good husband and father till now, hitting mid 50s. But i'm in a job where if he goes and protests on Saturday and gets arrested, I will be compromised, asI work with children.

I need to distance myself. I'd really like to know i'm not alone I was hoping it was a bit of a mid life crisis, but I think he's just become a toral cock.

Wtaf am I meant to do. I'd rather he ran off with a younger woman tbh. I feel ashamed of him!

Jeez another thread full of people calling those with opposing views stupid.

I'm trying to recall when the left first moved towards supporters feeling so self righteous.

Left of the past was the party of unions and working class often manual workers where as now supporters feel justified to refer to others as stupid and uneducated and calling others to divorce anyone who has a view differing to theirs. It's truly fascinating and saddening on equal measures.

@XDownwiththissortofthingX
"brand new homes with underfloor heating
Would it be more acceptable if the LA was, for some reason, building new housing with open fires, chimneys, and coal cellars?"

And people wonder why the left gets criticized for accusing the right of non-critical thinking. It's a lot like "pot meet kettle" with posts like this.

There IS a middle of the road solution. Underfloor heating is a luxury, not a right. Nothing wrong with putting up homes with the basics and standard items and not luxury items.

And those of you on the left, who do not think you are being handed a pack of lies by many of the boat migrants? Just as in the USA, there are books telling non-permitted migrants exactly what to say and when to say it, to get a favorable outcome. If you think there isn't, you are horribly naive. Maybe that comes from having a life of not having to think of anything but "critical" things, through rose-colored glasses, where builders, plumbers, electricians and shopkeepers see how the world really is and what people will do to get what they want.

Asylum seeking is up for many reasons, but the UK "warmongering" is FAR down the list. I would love to see the stats of asylum seekers divided by sex and age. Is any group a much larger percentage? Why is that? How can it be made more fair, if that is the case?

Are these women correct in that assertion? Do they have any qualifications or experience that gives them an insight into links between sexual violence and immigration?
Nigel Farage recently made an assertion that Afghan males are 22 times more likely to commit crimes of sexual violence than “British males”. There were a couple of attempts to debunk this but the best they could come up with was essentially “ if you interpret the statistics differently they’re only 6 or 7 times more likely to commit these types of crimes”.
The worst thing the left ever did and I consider myself to be left, was to convince themselves that human values are universal when they are very clearly culturally defined. People who are socialised into believing women are second class citizens will bring that mindset with them.
I don’t understand why accepting that fact makes you right wing?

Many people wouldn’t want to be married to a racist going on racist marches, as in OPs situation.

That’s very different from actual politics which might lean left centre or right.

What do you call it when people who aren’t racist don’t seem to understand the rhetoric or that they are promoting racist propaganda?

It is the economically disadvantaged and disaffected who’ve been historically preyed upon by fascists, in a COL crisis the rise is unsurprising.

Some of the issues have been exacerbated by Brexit due to a shift in where workers (such as fruit pickers) can be recruited from.

The people I saw on the march appeared of the same ilk as the racist marches in the past, with a few people that may not have been in the pre internet era.

The radicalising rabbit holes, as the teacher upthread mentioned, are now the main concern of Prevent.

Lack of critical thinking has led to the following beliefs:
Believing that Reform cares about people on low incomes and the working class.
Believing that Farage in anyway represents us, and has policies that will improve our lives. Not seeing that he hates us and is using us.
Believing that Brexit would improve the economy and the NHS.
Not realising that the people that will gain most from Reform are the rich and countries we should be very wary of such as Russia.

And people wonder why the left gets criticized for accusing the right of non-critical thinking. It's a lot like "pot meet kettle" with posts like this

What on earth are you gibbering about?

The whole purpose of the glib, sarcastic tone of that point was to highlight, that yet again, it's being made by someone who simply hasn't given it any thought before they opened their ill-informed mouth and let their belly rumble.

The LA does not, contrary to what that poster appears to believe, build new housing stock and pack it with "luxuries" for no other reason than they want to hand it over to migrants in order to antagonise the locals. For a start, underfloor heating is in no way a "luxury". Just because it's still relatively uncommon compared to other forms of central heating, the mere fact a home has a means of heating itself does not make it a "luxury" home. You have no idea how the LA costed these builds, whether it was perhaps more cost-effective to have a particular form of heating installed over another, and also, whether there is a requirement for some stipulation to be met that means a different form of heating is not appropriate.

Interesting though, that you chose to pick up on this particular part of that post, and made no comment at all about the main body of it, which counters yet more ill-informed assertions about migrants living in "4 star" accommodation, the implication being that they are enjoying a champagne and caviar lifestyle. If the poster had bothered to actually do the minimum of research about how these "migrant hotels" actually function, and what life is like for the residents, then they'd know that the picture they are painting is in no way representative of reality.

Then comes the part about "illegal migrants" somehow making it impossible to walk down the street, presumably because these people are illegal migranting too hard or something. The poster has absolutely no idea of the status of these people, but is evidently incapable of grasping that if they are indeed, "illegals", then they are not going to be hanging around on a street in a group or residing in a government appointed accommodation.

So no, calling people out for posting ill-informed, ignorant guff is not "pot calling the kettle black", it's highlighting the fact that if they are even capable of critical thinking, they demonstrably haven't practiced it.

Hey OP - I just wanted to say that I’m in a similar although slightly less extreme position.

I’ve always been centre-left and DP centre, maybe slightly centre right despite being a Labour or Lib Dem voter.

He doesn’t yet support Farage but he’s swallowed the claptrap about immigrants, and he’s hook, line, and sinker behind the campaign to “reclaim our flag”.

When I question him about his views or press for facts upon which he based his opinion, there are none. He “just knows”.

Despite being very much on the side of GC women, he’s also started spouting some really misogynistic ideas. He’s quick to think the worst of women and seems to believe men get a raw deal.

I think my DP has been influenced by an increasingly right-wing echo chamber he’s found himself in. Also he’s listening to men who are banging on about the fact that “no one likes straight white men” - and I think what they say resonates with him, and so further to the right he moves.

He’s mid-40s and what I think hasn’t helped is the fact that he’s suddenly become disabled. He had a high-flying job but collapsed and now can’t work in any capacity. Never will again. It’s meant he isn’t exposed to other views at work and doesn’t have to dilute his views. Although it’s liberating for him, I think it’s allowed him to become more entrenched and less open to alternate opinions.

So you have my sympathies OP. I’ve talked to DP about the fact he seems to be lacking in empathy and compassion. Not because we disagree necessarily but because he seems unable to recognise the value of human lives and experience if they’re different to him.

As a british born child of immigrants remind the plonker that less than 5% of the UK belongs to an ethnic minority group. I imagine living rurally there is an even lower percentage in your area. There is no stampede of asylum seekers.

Ehh the one who is lacking critical thinking on this subject is undoubtedly you, OP, and a lot of the commentators on here. It's like the majority of women on mumsnet have contracted the disease of self-destruction.

In my immediate local area there has been a significant increase in successful, rapes and kidnaps on women by foreign men - the police are overburdened and cannot deal with it. This is not right wing propaganda, it is fact. I'm afraid to go into my once peaceful town and shop without having to look over my shoulder now. If I had a teenage daughter I wouldn't be able to allow her to walk in what were safe streets of my town up until asylum seekers were shipped in.

Why the heck are so many of you on for this? Where is your discernment?

It's very reductive to view anti migrant hotel matches as racist, do you also believe pro Palestine matches are antisemitic?

No idea what you mean by 'actual politics', immigration policies are very much a part of every political party, across the world!

Same thing happened to me it sucks so much. If you leave he may have to pull his head out of his butt in order to find you. You may never want to be with him again but it may save his head from his butt.

Thank you for your reply, now I understand better. I hope you slept well. Unlike your husband, I’ve moved more to the left as I age, (although that may not actually be so, as I believe the centre has moved further right than it was when I first got the vote in the Seventies) and I’m afraid if my husband were to behave like yours seems to be, I’d be out of there. Easy to write, I know, when I’m not in your shoes. I hope you can work it out.

I don't understand why your husband's political choices would compromise you at work. You're two separate people. What do his beliefs have to do with how you perform your job?

I'm not sure how sympathetic anyone's children would be if one of their parents decided to break up the family over politics.

If you live rurally then your town can’t have been affected by the steep increase in men applying for asylum. Bigger towns have cities have seen a strain on resources and the government covered up the sexual assaults including Rochdale where Middle East Asian men abused white teen girls.

My family are immigrants so I’m obviously not against immigration. What exactly is your husband saying because it doesn’t sound like he’s a fascist from what you’ve said.

Don't imagine younger people are any more immune to the power of the algorithm.

Why is it either/or?

Maybe I’m biased but I feel like people who grew up with the internet are more aware of misinformation and not trusting everything you read online. They’re less likely to fall for scams etc

Maybe report him to prevent. There are lots of radicalism going on right now. It's dangerous and he's a danger to your children because of this exposure. prevent can be very helpful to families.
I think I would have to leave him. I really couldn't bear that around my children

Critical thinking 🤮

From an outsider perspective I could see this as perhaps you feel more articulate and even maybe superior with your education and gift of critical thinking which you indicate your partner doesn't have...I am wondering how you come across to your partner?

Some people think someone has thought things through properly only when they reach the same conclusion as they have.

I am wondering if he feels browbeaten rather than listened to, so is withdrawing from you in frustration?
Not saying this is right or that I agree with him btw.

Oh, give over. Just because one doesn’t blame everything on immigration doesn’t mean one doesn’t agree that border control is required. There’s a middle ground between paranoia and being a doormat.

And what’s this drivel about daughters? Then let’s lock up all men, because I don’t trust any of them with my DD.

Where did I mention anti migrant hotel marches i didn’t and it wasn’t - I described what I saw and no I don’t necessarily it depends and many do.

The most laughable idea that has come up on this thread is that students who go to university learn critical thinking skills. They don’t. Even doctoral students struggle with critical thinking - undergraduates just learn topics and often ideology along with it if they are doing some of the softer subjects. They then mistake that ideology for critical thinking. The level of arrogance on this thread and the separating of people out into superior and inferior is frankly nauseating and frightening. The last time a group of people were considered inferior to others it didn’t end well.

I’m wondering too how he feels about a partner who thinks he lacks critical thinking and superiority re the level of education. It sounds like the split was always there just ok as he didn’t diverge.