Is this financial abuse?

[wellwellwell39]

Looking for some perspective and hoping to show this to my fiance.

He earns over 80k working full time and long hours, he works away mon-friday, back home every weekend. Take home pay is around 3,100 or thereabouts. He works incredibly hard for this.

I work 3 days a week in a decent job but it's not well paid, take home pay is about 1200 every month.
I get child maintenance from exp, was 300 a month but now it's going to be slashed to about 150.
Child benefit comes to me every week on top of that.

When we met, we were both 31 and both had one child each. We got engaged a year after meeting and made the choice to have a 3rd child between us before getting married. We had hoped to be married a while ago but life with 3 kids has gotten in the way and has gone to the bottom of the priority list sadly.

When we met, I rented, OH owned his home. I had no debt, OH had a huge amount (mostly due to his divorce and ongoing court proceedings as his exp was trying to stop contact with his DC 🙄) but he has no debt now.

9 years later, blended family is for the most part pretty good. All 3 kids adore each other and get on very well and love being together.

His exp is no longer an issue but my exp is always causing issues with child maintenance amongst other things so that does being a decent amount of stress into the relationship, but so does finances.

I will be the first to admit that due to not having any financial awareness when growing up, not having any adults to talk to about finances and discuss these type of issues as a young person leaving home, and not having any decent role models full stop, I am not particularly money savvy. In the past I have also been a very impulsive shopper and if I felt I needed it, I would buy, then would worry about it later. Now at almost 40 I of course regret that as I have zero savings and about 10k of credit card debt, I'm completely ashamed actually and beat myself up a lot about this, however a lot of this was accrued from needing to put diesel in car, buy birthday or Xmas gifts for the kids or buy food as money was so short on more than a few occasions.

OH puts in 1300 to the joint account. I put in around 800. With my bills including phone, debt repayments, DC's clubs (I pay some and OH pays some) then I'm usually left with around £100 -150 disposable income.

Over the years I've felt very frustrated about this set up. I believe it makes much more sense to pool all income, pay off bills and with whatever is left that covers kids clubs, savings then we both decide how much disposable income we want to take from what's left over. OH has always been dead set against this.

We're lucky to have a lovely 4bed detached (which I of course couldn't afford on my wage alone) but as OH's career has taken off especially in the last 5 years, I'm becoming pretty resentful as I can't work full time. There is no after school care provision in my area thanks to covid and grandparents can't help much.

OH is very careful with his money and always has been, something I admire and wish I had been able to be over the years . He sees me getting into debt as my own fault and not his issue. He often says, it's not my fault you chose this career, I shouldn't have to suffer because of your choices. I can see why he wants to ring fence his money, his eldest DC will need support with buying a home probably in around 10-15 years time or so, this is very important to him and I appreciate that. But he now says I need to put more in to the pot, I've explained I can't, he replies work full time then, which is easier said than done.

His outgoings are no where near as significant as mine, although he pays about 200 in CM and pays for his own food when away mon-fri and had his own bills too, and to be fair he does all the DIY I the house and pays for all of this. Eg. Any issues with the car he pays for it, re-tiled the bathroom and put a new shower in, he paid for it. Lots of things like this which I would struggle to contribute to, but he does say to me ' look at everything I do for this family, I pay for x,y,z'

So again I'm made to feel bad because I cant/don't contribute to these things.

The latest is he's saying the amount I contribute doesn't even cover myself, let alone my DC and I need to put in more because he's paying 'twice'. He believes he pays for his child when at her mum's, as well as my child, also believes he pays 'twice' for food as the money he puts into the joint account goes towards food then he pays for his own midweek.

What's got to me is that he's announced we now need to put diesel in the car from our own disposable income. We've always paid for that through the joint account but as my job now involves me driving when at work (and I claim mileage which is minimal and this is paid to me) he announced he will not be paying for 'my employers name' too! And he's fed up paying for EVERYTHING

I get where he is coming from so I'm happy to put the difference into the joint account going forward but this leaves me with even less disposable income.

I very much live pay check to pay check, I have a lot of nieces and nephews who have birthdays etc through the year and although it's a modest amount of spend, things like this plus kids friends parties etc all add up and often I'm in my overdraft.

It all feels very much like we're flatmates at times, and a bit like him vs me instead of a solid family unit doing life and hard things together.

I think he resents me as he sees me being at home 2x days a week but it's hard work keeping a family of 5 going all the time and my days off are absolutely not days off. Thanks for getting this far, please let me know your thoughts 🙏

I am flabbergasted that you’ve had kids with someone unmarried (which makes you more financially vulnerable) and you have no real knowledge of the finances of the household.
is he really even working away?

Your reading and comprehension skills need a brush-up.

He's not even there Mon-Fri, he works away, so 100% of the childcare and household tasks are down to the OP. Hence it being difficult for the OP to find a full-time job and juggle the dc. In any case, whatever extra she could earn by working full time would be swallowed up by childcare costs (which no doubt her DP would expect her to pay in full), so she'd be no better off anyway.

But apparently when she was with him for several years, with just her own child, she could work full time.

Suddenly, now she's had a child with him, she can't.

She's been gifted ownership/part of a house by nothing more than a boyfriend and living a lifestyle she would never be able to provide herself. Still in £10k of debt. He pays lots. He just doesn't pay it into the joint account where the self confessed spendaholic can't get her hands on it, he pays it direct from his account.

No wonder he won't marry her. She's no victim here.

I'd be saying to him that you've been thinking what he said about you working full time and he's right! So he needs to change jobs now so that he's around all week. You will do school drop offs every day and he can do pick ups at 3pm and then get the kids' dinner on and supervise homework and getting ready for bed.

As you'll be starting work late to facilitate the morning school run, you won't be home until 7pm each night.

Or, alternatively, if he doesn't want to do that, leave him to find childcare for his older child and your joint child. He needs to pay for this. After you've got your older child a place with the childminder. Plus, if he's away all week and you're at work full-time, the cleaner and laundry service will need to come out of the joint account.

Tott up what all of that childcare and cleaning would cost him. Show him the reality of what he's expecting.

Yes, it IS financial abuse!

Did you not have any conversations before you had shared child about what the plan was regarding childcare, you working part-time or full-time, him continuing to work away, etc? If you didn’t have a shared child, then in my opinion he’d have a point about you not working full-time. But because you do have the shared child, it’s really not as simple as just saying “you should work more” without him thinking about how he is going to facilitate that. You haven’t said how old your own child is, but obviously older so perhaps childcare is not an issue, or not for much longer anyway, and it’s the shared child that is the one mostly in need of after-school care.

Not to mention that as others have said, his take-home pay doesn’t sound right on that wage, and also it sounds like he is paying too little CM for his elder child.

Or, if you're caring for his biological child when he's away, I'd work out how much that would cost on Nanny wages, given you're likely to be doing overnights too. If that comes to £20k a year, invoice him!

You’re a very cheap nanny & housekeeper. Do you care for his eldest whilst he’s away or just his youngest?

That was my first thought. Should be almost 5k no? My maths isn't great

Whilst I understand that every situation is different, I completely agree with a PP: there should be no “your money” and “his money” it should just be joint money. You’re a family and you should pool your money, pay for everything that needs paying and then split what is left EQUALLY to have as expendable income each. IRS outrageous that he has so much more free cash than you. Also agree with others that on a salary of £80k his take home salary should be a lot higher than £3100, I wonder if you’re not being given the full picture OP.

Sorry OP but that is wrong. They did not reverse it and I’m pretty sure at £80k income you have to repay all the child benefit
www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/benefits/benefits-if-you-have-children/changes-to-child-benefit-from-2013#:~:text=as%20Income%20Tax.-,How%20does%20it%20work,the%20form%20of%20Income%20Tax.

I didn’t realise you could just tell your employer what hours you were going to work and they’d do it! Good to know as round my way there aren’t any school hours jobs. Didn’t even think of just walking into somewhere and telling them what hours I would work.

Does the same principle work with salary? I’d quite like to do 20 hours per week for around £50k if that’s ok?

I was able to work full time as pre covid there was an after school club in a nearby school which my DC could go to, and my mum was alive at the time who helped out whejni had to work late. As already mentioned, after covid most of the local childminders moved on to other jobs, and the two after school clubs which did run then ceased to exist and have never started back up again, things were very different a few years ago, and as it currently stands, there is only 1 childminder who can collect from DC's particular school, who is full and unable to take on any more children. It's a very small town, I can't just magic up childcare

As for living a lifestyle I could never usually afford......having around £100 of disposable income every month doesn't go very far. I'm not having champagne lunches, I go without so that the kids get what they need. We don't go abroad or holiday very often and we never eat out, ever, if my eldest child needs new shoes/jacket etc, I usually have to save up for that. Is this really a life of luxury? Because I can assure you it doesn't feel like it, but plenty of people are struggling financially with the cost of living crisis and the ever increasing cost of everything, that's life, I get it.

What I'm not OK with is feeling very trapped due to this lack of childcare situation and being made to feel like it's my problem and my fault, and that im not quite good enougn. I can't leave the house midweek past 7pm once DC is asleep either, I work, do foodshops, prep meals, tidy up from meals, clean the house, do all the washings, do all the ironing, life admin, school and club dropping of/collecting, the emotional labour, doscipline, homework and reading/writing practice, and them I'm made to feel I must do more, which I would be happy to do if there was wrap around care that would enable this!

Simple solution OP, you tell him you are going back to work full time and all child care is his responsibility. All of it.

I did ask if this was a new way of him acting towards you or has he always been like this. Something fishy is going on if I were you I’d start looking into things. Especially if this is a new act on his part.

Yes it's abuse leave him least then you'd get child maintance

It sounds like he’s letting you know he’s moving on

I’ve never really understood getting married if you don’t share finances, I’m sure there are reasons I’ve not thought of, but marriage to me is the whole legal, pragmatic, financial binding bit, though I guess I’m not much of a romantic!

I agree with your approach that you pool finances, deduct all bills/savings, and split the rest for the same disposable income - for me that’s sort of the point of being a family! That’s how we do it in our thirty odd year relationship and we don’t even have kids!!

Perhaps exceptions for pre-relationship
debt/assets, especially if a second marriage or other children, but generally, adults in a solid marriage should be equal and living at the same standard.

I can guarantee that if the roles were reversed, there’d be very different responses.

Bloke who’s a single dad hooks up with a single mum who’s a pretty high earner and works incredibly hard for it. He rents; she’s a home owner and he moves into hers. Several years down the line, kids in school and he’s only working 3 days a week, school hours only. She pays for all the house improvements, though his name is on the deeds too. She’s very careful with money; he’s had a habit of impulsive buying and has racked up debts on credit cards. He insists he can’t possibly work any more, or look for another job with more hours or better pay….

I think we know exactly how the thread would go…

What childcare or school pickups does he do?

He needs to be reminded that you help him earn that 80 K because you are looking after the children as it sounds like he is free to work as he wishes.

my situation is not dissimilar, but my DP does not make me feel bad that I work part time to support the family.

I think a pp was correct he hasn't been truthful about his income. We are in Scotland and DH is on 85k, after pension gets 4600 take home- pp was on £70k and got 4200.

So he has 'only' 1600/1700 to himself a month during the week, but is getting around 1500 more than you think.

I hate to say this, but could he be seeing someone else while working away? It would explain why he's both lying about his income and pressurising you for more money, the OW thinks he only pays maintenance for 2 kids and is single, so she would expect him to have more disposable income.

Either way, I think it is intolerable he gives you so little to run a house (has this increased along with inflation?) is absent for 5 out of 7 days, makes you do unpaid childcare for both his kids, one of whom isn't yours. All disaster management and wife work is yours, for him to appear at the weekend, fix an appliance, and roundly criticise how you cope on your own.

I would contact Womens Aid and Citizens Advice for info on financial abuse, you may be able to get help to leave. You will be poor and desperate with this man because he owns every second of your free time and is keeping you in a situation where you cannot earn and must be dependent on him, so he can abuse that.

What does he say about childcare if you work full time?

Is he open to sitting down together and you laying out your side as you have here, and see if the two of you can come up with a compromise/solution? If not, I’d say there is your answer- if this is your problem to solve he doesn’t see you as a team and is angling to leave.

@gattocattivo did the OP say she was on the house deeds?
I read it that she wasn't, isn't married, so has no right to the house but pays bills?

In that case I'd jump at it if the roles were reversed, a housekeeper and nanny who lets you work away 5 days and does everything but DIY, while paying you 800 for the privilege.

I have some sympathy on both sides. He is working away which means 100% of the childcare during the week falls on you. But on the other hand you do sound like a spendthrift, and in particular your debt repayments should be counted as part of your discretionary spending, it is money you have already spent in advance. So it’s not fair to say you only have £100 disposable income.

I think you need to sit down with him and discuss how you can practically increase your hours to full time. Have you put your child on the waiting list for the childminder? Will he look after the children at weekends so you can work?

@Coffeeandallthebooksthe OP confirmed he put her on the house deeds

If this has just started I would be concerned there is someone in the background