What do you think about Other Women

[Keptawake]

Just wondering what your thoughts are about the type of people that get involved with married/taken people with families?

I’m asking because DP left me 2 months ago for another woman. They’d been seeing each other for about 3 months before he left (an emotional affair which turned into secret dates although he was “respectful” enough to not get physical until the day he walked out). We have 2 kids. She knew he had a family.

It goes without saying that I hate him for this but I’ve also spent the last couple of months raging at the type of woman who could knowingly get involved with and break up a family.

Am I justified in thinking good people don’t do things like this? This might seem like an obvious answer but I’m just feeling a bit low.

If it works out I know at some point I may have to be civil with her as a potential stepmum to my kids but I can’t help thinking that there is no way I want someone like that as a role model in my kids life.

I mainly think women like this are very foolish. Building a relationship with a man who cheated on his wife is not secure. If he's cheated on his wife for them, he'll cheat on them too. I wouldn't want that insecurity.

And even if she is desperate to start a family, it isn't a nice, neat, nuclear family. It involves regular contact and conflict with an ex wife. Needing to factor in step-children. There will inevitably be hostility because the ex wife will be angry and defensive because her ex and the other woman screwed her over. The step-children will be hurt and defensive towards the other woman, because she helped their dad wreck their lives. Not a nice, shiny new positive beginning to a relationship and their own family.

You’ve asked so here’s what I think:

I think it’s despicable to get involved with a married man.

I’m sure @JudgeBread‘s four phenotypes post nails it.

I know someone - never married, no kids, big career - who has had a series of affairs with married men who she’s met through work. She convinces herself of the ‘My marriage is over in all but name’ bullshit and is surprised when it all comes to naught and she’s left with yet another broken heart. She appears to feel nothing for the wife. I find it outrageous, exasperating and - worst of all - totally unsisterly.

I am so sorry for what you are going through, OP. Wish nothing but good things ahead for you and your kids.

As much as it may kill you, I would try to walk tall and be gracious. It’s disappointing that your husband turned out not to be as committed to his wife and marriage as he’d promised to be. But you will survive - with the love and support of your family and girlfriends. Pull them close.

What about the daughters of men who had affair after affair throughout their childhood, but their mothers either turned a blind eye or had drama then took him back?

How do they know what a healthy relationship looks like or have any self worth?

(Asking for a friend...!)

But you have to remember that the vast majority of men will LIE to the OW in the same way they are lying to their wife saying they’re popping to their friends - when they are going to see OW in fact.

If a woman got involved with a married man when he told her from the offset (before she had feelings) he was happily married but just wants a bit of extra attention, then yes I would judge that behaviour from a woman.

The more likely scenario is that the man is saying their marriage is over and spinning the OW a load of lies so she assumes they’re going to split up anyway whether she’s involved or not. She then has feeling ls and it becomes more difficult to walk away

@CrazyGoatLady has posted with some great insight.

She has done you a favour. He was going to do this either way, if it wasn’t her it would have been someone else. It’s him you are married to so him that has betrayed you. He will do the same to her. But that won’t be your problem. You will look back and be glad you didn’t waste anymore of your time and life with that loser.

I’m not sure the other woman has to be a bad person, maybe just unhappy in their relationship, not all affairs are between a married person and someone single, they can both be in relationships that just aren’t going well

Agree.

Difficult to think of a more obvious red flag than ‘has wife and children’.

If he's married, you stay away til he's not, regardless of the lies.

If you're unaware he's married, different kettle of fish.

But if someone is married, they ARE NOT AVAILABLE. Wait til they are. If they don't become available, they were clearly lying to you and you've dodged a bullet.

I think they are absolute scum the same as the men who cheat with them.

I think it’s human nature to direct fury at the OW. But I also think it doesn’t help you process what happened in order to heal.

You don’t know what he told her about you or your relationship, for one.

A good friend of mine went through this. Her husband left her after she discovered his affair. Her hatred of the other woman sent her quite mad. She became quite obsessed with her; it was awful to see. This was 25 years ago. She’s moved on and is with someone else, but she’s never been the same person since. Fwiw, her ex married the other woman and is very happy.

I think it can make it easier to loathe the other woman - she must be a dreadful person, right? But, let’s face it, chances are she’s not - she’s just someone who fell in love with someone who told her his marriage is over/was never happy/he’s only there for the kids…

And if she does become stepmum one day, you don’t have to ‘be civil’. My friend I mentioned was left with an 18 month old baby, and her ex and his new wife shared custody. She now has a good relationship with the ex for the sake of their daughter. But to this day, she’s not set eyes on the wife. She’s simply refused and been respected in her decision.

If he's cheated on his wife for them, he'll cheat on them too.

I think this is what well-meaning friends will tell you, along with ‘it’ll never last’, but it’s just not always true.

Yes and this is why all OW aren’t bad people, as no one knows what circumstances they got together under.

Not realising he’s married then getting feeling and falling in love is completely different to entering it knowing full well he’s otherwise happily married

It’s not always true, but cheating is a pattern of behaviour, and behaviour that is rewarded is repeated.

The whole time I've been saying, if you know someone's married, it's shit to choose to be involved and you've been telling me it's not. Now you agree?

If he’s ugly he won’t get the chance 😂 if he’s good looking more opportunities will arise

It’s not always a pattern of behaviour though, sometimes it only happens once.

I understand it’s easier to process it that he’s ‘a cheater’ and just wants his end away as much as possible, rather than he found someone else he likes more, and will spend the rest of his life happy with them, but I’ve also watched a DFriend basically suspend her life waiting for ‘karma’ to get her ex and his new wife, who basically don’t know she exists and are happy off in the sunset.

If he was a useless twat, let him go.

I think they lack basic human decency and are selfish in the extreme. And also, a bit dim. It’s just something I would never do myself and as for all this “oh but he would have lied and lied” well yes, obviously but do people always believe what others tell them? No married man who fancies a bit on the side is going to say “actually, I love my wife, I’ve no intention of leaving her, I just want to get my leg over” now is he?

I remember being about 19 and some married asshole giving me the “my wife doesn’t understand me” crap. I laughed at him and asked if that ever worked….he said it did, the sad bastard.
Any man who would cheat on his wife, is, by definition, a liar. Honesty and loyalty are non negotiable for me so I’d just never find someone like that attractive.
I know women who deliberately “target” married men, because it makes them feel “special”. It’s sad and desperate and hasn’t made them happy in the long run.
I also don’t think the marriage has to be unhappy for some people to be unfaithful. Some people are just selfish and want more and extra, because they think they are “special” or are emotionally very immature. They need to deal with their issues because behaving like an absolute twat doesn’t make them happy in the long run, they just keep repeating the same patterns.

My view is that most OW don’t get involved with men who say are happily married
and they know they’re happily married.

I believe the majority of men will lie and make out they’re living separately etc (and not everyone is married of course) and make the OW believe his relationship is well and truly over. It’s difficult moving out due to finances etc so him and his ‘ex-partner’ are still sharing a house etc… so the OW has no idea what she’s getting in to. By the time she realises it’s too late and she’s fallen for him so can’t walk away even if she does find out he’s properly married and they aren’t separated

Would you expect her to walk away when she finds out?

My theory about low rate of success for 2nd marriages is that people just don't waste years on fretting "should I go or should I stay" but they know divorce is sth they can go through and come out on the other side and they don't want to delay the process. If they're u happy they just end the relationship. I'm divorced and that's what I will do if the current relationship turns sour.

I'd expect her to not get involved until she knows they're not together.

Especially these days when we all know that "it's over, we just live together because we can't afford separate houses" or "we haven't slept together for years, our relationship is dead in the water, I stay for the kids" are complete BS made up to get their legs over.

I expect people, but especially women, to have more self respect and respect for other people. I very much expect people to behave as they'd want others to if they were on the other side of it.

I wouldn't want some other woman thinking my husband was fair game just because he said he was. And I absolutely wouldn't think a married man was fair game just cos he told me his wife didn't understand him.

Divorce papers filed, fine, although still messy. Still together or living together, run for the hills.

I was astounded recently to find a friend (not close friend, someone I know via a hobby group) is having an affair (of sorts) with someone who got married just 2 months ago. When he persued her, she wasn’t aware he was attached, but she did know that when she first had sex with him. I was astounded as she is not the kind of person i’d say would have an affair with a married man. She hasn’t had a lot of relationships, and she is enjoying having some male attention. She certainly isn’t a horrible person, in fact she’s a really lovely person.

Sexual attraction can cause people to do things that they might never do normally. Plus lets face it, men lie, he probably told her the marriage was all but over etc.

Nope affairs and the ending of a relationship are a completely different type of break up.

Because for an affair to happen there are a a million other steps that happen prior.

Betrayal trauma and the physical and physiological impact this can have makes the whole thing completely and utterly incomparable.

She knew before she slept with him, so she's chosen to get involved knowing that their joint actions could harm someone else.

She may be a "lovely person" but she's made a shit choice there and is continuing to do so, for a bit of male attention. Poor judgement, poor morals.

I think this is completely true - call it a lack of empathy, or lack of life experience. They haven’t lived your life, they haven’t understood what it is to bring kids into the world and create a family with someone. They haven’t understood the vulnerability that creates. They perhaps don’t spend much time considering what it means for that to be destroyed. They don’t understand what he signed up for when he got married and brought those children in to the world and therefore what that says about him that he would walk away from it. They see only the man with some distant appendages that he wants to get away from. When they have kids of their own that insecurity is crushing. A dish served cold.

How would anyone know? Perhaps he just has more practice now.

I agree that your friend should stop waiting for ‘karma’ and needs to live her own life.