Should my wife support me on this?

[OzzyGrandad]

My wife & I attended a Christmas dinner at our daughters in laws. The dinner was on the table but there were still a few items to be placed & finalized. I asked my daughters mother in law if it was ok to start, she said yes. The rest of the party sat down & I had already begun eating. (I admit was not a good move). I believe the son of the mother in law wanted to say grace before dinner & was angry that I had started. He launched into a tirade of abuse, aggressively belittling me about my bad manners. I tried to explain that his mother had said it was ok to start, but this was ignored. I remained calm for the rest of the evening & then we went home. The next day I texted the son, explained my position & informed him that I would not tolerate such verbal abuse again, hoping he would regret being so abusive & apologize. He texted back, F off D Head.
We drop our grandson at his house every weekend & he returns him on Sunday. I asked my wife, when he drops his son off, to be courteous, but to not show any of the usual friendliness, just pick him up & say goodbye until he apologizes to me for his behavior. My wife refused, saying it was between me & him. She behaved as if nothing had happened & was friendly.
My question to the readers of this story is, should my wife have agreed to just be courteous & not friendly, or was she right to ignore my feelings on the matter.

And yet your anger stems from how he treated YOU, not how he treated your daughter and your grandson.

Both you and the man who was verbally abusive are horrible people. No your wife shouldn't "support" you. You were horribly bad mannered and the other person was horribly bad mannered too. I hope neither of you get invited to a family meal again.

Regardless of whether it was bad manners (I think given you asked if you could start eating and was told yes, then it’s debatable), it’s not okay to verbally abuse a guest because they started eating before everyone else. If you did anything wrong it was very minor and did not warrant the response you got.

Bad manners all around here. You should not have started eating before everyone else (much less asked to do so, like a toddler who can’t wait - it’s different when the host gives the nod to do so off their own back), nor should the son have berated you, a guest, in front of everyone in that way. But you’re an adult - this has nothing to do with your wife. YABU, grow up. I’m a little lost about who everyone is in this tale, but instead of lashing out to the son over text, perhaps send an apology - not for them, or even for you or your wife, but for the benefit of whichever family member you were there supporting and were supposed to be on best behaviour for.

I will go against the grain here. You were a bit impolite asking to eat dinner before it was ready. But that's no excuse for his behaviour. He was exceptionally rude. However no I don't think you can expect your wife to give cold shoulder to in laws

relying to HopingForTheBest25 It is not mandated by the court for him to have access. My wife & I want our grandson's father in his life. We want to have a good relationship, but, unfortunately I can't get over the torrent of aggressive abuse I received that day. I have remained courteous but not friendly & have asked my wife to do the same, to make him aware of how humiliated I feel, but she does not understand my feelings on this & is still supporting him. In other words "Abuse my husband all you want, anytime, we can still be friends". No need to apologize.

My issue is with how the son treated me that day, extremely disrespectfully.

Sure, but get over it. Stringing it out this long and trying to drag your wife into it on this moral high ground that he should 'simply apologise' is just making you look ridiculous. As is banging on about the verbal abuse. It was one instance of misunderstanding at a pressured moment (Xmas dinner often is with families), you behaved in a way many wouldn't have (yes yes we know what the MIL said) and he overreacted. Then you brought it up again - partly to explain but also to justify and admonish, and surprise surprise he overreacted again. What you hope to gain from going on about this and upping the ante by getting your wife to be off with him five months later is beyond me, because if you haven't twigged that he's not going to simply apologise now, you'll never get it. This is how so much conflict in the world occurs and escalates because of male pride and butt hurt so-called principles. Be the bigger person now, get over it and get on with it. And don't ever start eating before everyone's sat down and is ready to start.

Because she's putting the grandchild first and trying to facilitate as good a relationship as possible for him.

She's putting her grandchild before everything. Good for her. You don't get to control your wife.

I have been the SIL in this situation.

What I have found is that people
often claim something is aggressive verbal abuse when they are simply asked not to do something, or called out for doing something unacceptable.

You should have apologised on the spot.

It’s May. Get over it.

You and your wife have enough on your plate looking after a small child and navigating a difficult relationship with your sons father.
For your own peace of mind and certainly your wife’s, who hasn’t caused any of the situations you mention, it’s probably better just to let this one go.
Your wife is just trying to keep the peace and clearly has your grandchild’s best interest at heart.
I wouldn’t have been thrilled to have found a grown adult tucking into food before everybody else had even sat down. I have been in that situation but didn’t kick off at the person who was doing it and he was incredibly rude but if you hadn’t then sent him a text message he wouldn’t have had anything else to react to.
Yes, he’s clearly not a very nice person, yes you made an error of judgement but honestly, let it go.
Be civil to the dickhead father, be a loving grandparent and give your wife the peace of mind that she is no longer being stuck in the middle.
Have a nice weekend.

So let me get this straight. This man had sex with someone who, from what you suggest, has an intellectual disability which means she couldn’t consent, and impregnated her, doesn’t pay child support, and only sees his son at weekends, and you’re angry because he was rude to you over your table manners?

What I have found is that people often claim something is aggressive verbal abuse when they are simply asked not to do something, or called out for doing something unacceptable. You should have apologised on the spot.It’s May. Get over it.

This. Stop acting like a petulant child and move on with your life. At least one adult in your grandson's household is able to behave like an adult (ie your wife).

I don’t think you were bad mannered to ask if you could start. You asked the host and she said yes. It’s just a family meal not a formal banquet. I’d have been shocked at the SIL being so vile. Did everyone ignore what happened at the time?
I can see why your wife wants to remain ‘friendly’ with him. It might feel like it gives her more control

Look - it seems you have to accept this man for what he is.
He is not going to apologise to you.
Some people NEVER apologise - they are not capable of apologising - he is one of them.
You need to be the bigger person (including observing correct protocol for Xmas dinner in the future).

You're very much the central character for you, but your wife is hardly being friends with him by being polite when dropping off your grandson! She's hardly going on nights out and parties with him!

He knows what you think - you told him. It's between you and him. There's nothing to be gained from your wife piling in except making the situation you are all in more difficult.

Honestly, I think you are mad to be letting him anywhere near your grandson. Based on your updates around the family situation, I don't see this 'father' as being of any benefit to your grandchild's life.
If you are saying that your dd didn't have capacity to consent, that's rape. I think you all have bigger problems than what happened at Christmas.

His father was abusive to the childs primary carer in front of him. I'd be concerned about the father ability to parent in these circumstances.

You were very rude. Typical rude old man. Just wait for everyone to be seated.
You should apologise. You should also not make your wife’s mind up for her.

The father of your Grandson was extremely rude and that was inexcusable. When it comes to starting a meal before everyone is seated, you should have waited for the offer to start before everyone else but asking is poor form. I personally would not have stayed after the outburst but the demanding of an apology and asking your wife to fall in line after the fact, isn’t great either.

It sounds like there’s a complicated backstory to the dynamics of your set up and I suspect that the room that that elephant is in, isn’t as spacious as you think.

You already said that not all of the food was on the table when you made your "mistake" and started troughing...

There are some very strange people on mumsnet if they think you are the problem! I can understand your wife wanting to keep the peace though.

He sounds like an abusive man. I also would be wary of having him in my child’s/ grandchild’s life. I think that is the issue. It’s not about you, or your wife, really. You’re focusing on the wrong thing.

You’re making all this about you, and your wife is making it about your grandchild. The situation is complex and fraught enough , without adding to it. She’s not “taking” your side because there’s a small child in a pretty crappy situation that needs at least one person in their life to be an adult and smooth things over.

You can let go, you just choose not to. Maybe this incident was really that bad, or maybe you’re projecting all the anger at the situation (getting your disabled daughter pregnant when she can’t care for a child, having to raise a baby , him being useless and not paying his share etc.). The straw that broke the camel’s back if you will. Except, for the sake of your grandson it can’t stay broken. So get some therapy, talk things out, find out other outlets and support and learn to let go of the anger and hurt.

Christmas was a long time ago… but personally if guy berated my man for something that sounds very innocent and harmless i would absolutely back him up and probably would have told him to chill. Yes, what you did is technically a breach of etiquette but it’s Christmas and tacky for him to say anything to you( very UN CHRIST like actually and shocking to do this in the same breath as a prayer)

He reacted like that because he wanted to say Grace? He doesn’t sound very Jesus to me.

@OzzyGrandad if you posted this as a woman the response would have been totally different.