Is he with me for the wrong reasons?

[ComingFromTheSamePlace]

I've been with my partner for around 3 years.

He's told me I'm 'everything' he's ever wanted. We're both older (50 and 61).

Except that isn't true because I don't possess any of the actual qualities/features of women he's told me finds attractive or sexually appealing.

In fact, the only thing I'm confident he likes about me is that I've challenged some of his thinking and he now sees the world differently in some respects.

Like a university lecturer might challenge or change the way a student thinks.

But that doesn't really inspire physical attraction. I feel he is with me because his life is intellectually richer with me in it but that's about all.

Does it matter?

I'm not saying he's necessarily a bad person I just don't think he is the right fit for you. He doesn't give you what you need. You do need to build up your own confidence in yourself I'm just not convinced you'll be able to do that while in this relationship

He's saying he's attracted to you. That's not just about looks. It's about the whole package. Intelligence, emotional intellect, confidence, openness, loyalty, honesty, individuality.

Surely you have to trust that he likes you for you. If you've got low self esteem it can be easy to project negative things on others, and assume they see you in the way you see yourself.

I hope you can maybe try counselling to help your self esteem. X

OK.

I have a friend who does the same hobby as me. She is quite 'rock n roll' about it. Dresses in quite skimpy/revealing clothes when she does it, which is part of the 'stereotype'. The general view amongst men is that it's such a 'sexy' thing for women to do that they look amazing wearing even just skinny jeans and a t shirt.

Both my partner and my ex told me that she is 'very sexy'. And, I'm not blind, I can see it.

I didn't. I dressed in a way that flattered me and suited my shape but neither mini skirts and fishnets nor skinny jeans and a t shirt would do me any favours so I was/am more 'conservative' than 'rock n roll' I suppose and I was quite happy with that. Especially as I'm now 50 and my days of dressing like that are long behind me. But she is tall and slim and can still carry it off despite being a similar age to me.

We were watching something on YouTube and he made a comment about what a woman was wearing doing the same thing - mini skirt, fishnet stockings, bra and sheer mesh top being sexy/looking good and said that's the sort of thing I should be wearing to do it. Despite the fact the video was 30 years old and the woman was half my age.

My previous ex was the one who made comments about me "not being very sexy for a ..." and also criticised what I wore and told me what I should wear instead - which was along the same lines.

So, yep, I got the message loud and clear.

Do you not inspire it? Or do you just not see that you inspire it because you're in the middle of having a conversation with him when it happens rather than watching him interact with someone else.

The more you post the more I believe that your past has done an absolute number on you and there's not a man on the planet who could make you believe that he actually loves you, because you don't really love yourself.

Look, I'll give you that maybe you're not his usual type physically, but as I said in a previous comment, neither is my DP. But that doesn't mean I find her less beautiful, or sexy than any other woman.

And you've identified some aspects of yourself that he definately loves, your intellect, your personality, but you act like they're worthless.

You said about your intellect -

"It's no more a reflection on me as a person that my height - which I also had no control over it's just a thing"

That's absolute bollocks. You've got far more control over that than you have over your looks. The fact that your knowledgeable, capable of holding an interesting debate on lots of interesting topics, they're all aspects of yourself that you've actively cultivated throughout your life. And they're surely the important bit.

Yeah, looks, or an Welsh accent are an attention grabber, but noone ever stayed with someone for their looks. (At least noone happy ever did). You stay with someone because they're someone you can see yourself spend the rest of my life with. Someone who interests you, someone who engages with you, someone who challenges you. Someone you're not going to get bored with. And it seems life he sees all of those things in you.

There's no such thing as a perfect match. Soulmates don't exist. You're never going to tick every single box for someone, and no-one is ever going to tick every single box for you.

There are probably any number of things I'd change about DP. I'd love her to be able to leave the house on time, to be a bit more interested in politics, to care less about her smile, or the size of her belly. But if that aspect of her changed, then what would I lose. What's the tradeoff? Because I've loved women who I could have a good debate about politics with, but we couldn't find a TV show we both liked, or didn't make me laugh, or I didn't make them laugh, or more importantly, we just couldn't live together.

I'm not saying you and your partner are right together. None of us can know whether thats true or not. I just don't think that you're looking at him with clear eyes right now, because you're attributing your own beliefs about yourself to him.

Because that's the reality.

I posted about him but this is probably part of a much bigger picture

It was my ex who said that.

But he's made a similar observation/similar suggestions just without the 'negging' element.

You have a meeting- of -the- minds kind of relationship; the best type IMO. Attraction always fades. Grasp this with both hands.

Unless he's a sexagenerian of the Pitt/Clooney calibre, I think he secretly knows he's punching and keeping you on your toes OP.
Looks like he's succeeding.

I'm mid 50's and never meet anyone older than me that interests me aesthetically, physically or intellectually.

Am not looking though, so maybe that's it. 😁

A couple of the things you've said make me really think he's the one at fault. He jokes about other women being sexy and attractive and then not only passes them off as jokes, he "didn't know" it might affect you? Oh, please. He knows. I felt a lot like this with my ex. Like it was in my head, imagining things, over-thinking it. But if someone really finds you attractive and wants to be with you - you don't feel like this. You deserve a better man. One who doesn't drop negative seeds everywhere so you feel like crap about yourself. You deserve better.

No, I definitely don't. He's learnt a lot and sees some things differently and enjoys the 'exploring ideas' now too. But those are things that I'm passionate about. Not him. It's me who becomes animated and 'sparkles'. The only time I've seen him animated, captivated and 'sparkle' is when he's been talking to my friend. Or maybe when he discusses music with his friends. We like the same bands but I'm not interested in discussing them any more than I'm interested in discussing actors.

there's not a man on the planet who could make you believe that he actually loves you

That's probably true tbh.

Yeah, looks, or an Welsh accent are an attention grabber, but noone ever stayed with someone for their looks.

I don't know how to not be forgotten about though when his attention is grabbed by those women.

How is what I am enough when his attention is taken away from me by those things? I don't want to be with someone whose attention is taken by someone I could never compete with because they offer something I don't.

I don't want to be responsible for that 'back in the room' or 'meanwhile, back in the real world' moment when I speak and distract him and he remembers that it's only me he's with. So I just walk away.

I don't know why he thought I needed to know what those 'attention grabbers' are for him other than to let me know where I don't quite match up.

Oh OP. You are being ground down by your own negative self image. I can't tell if your partner fancies you or not but until you stop doing this to yourself it almost doesn't matter either way because you probably wouldn't believe it if he did.

you have said several times you are not worth anything. You really need to take a step back and do some impartial analysis of what that means. What makes someone be 'worth something'? Whether other people like them? Their contribution to society? Whether they have a partner who finds them sexy?

you need to answer this question to your own intellectual satisfaction, separate from your negative thoughts about yourself. What would lead you to feel another person was worthless or worthwhile? Are you applying a double standard? (hint: yes).

I can see why you would want to be desired and why it would be upsetting to feel nobody ever finds you attractive but honestly, it's not a good thing to invest your self worth in. If it turns out there is nobody out there who fancies you then well there is more to life, you need to find fulfillment in something else and stop hankering after the thing that isn't happening for you. I am never going to be CFO of a major company, I made my peace with it.

but often these things happen when you least expect it. The most attractive person is someone who loves themselves and is happy in themselves.

I can see why you would want to be desired and why it would be upsetting to feel nobody ever finds you attractive but honestly, it's not a good thing to invest your self worth in.

I know you're right.

But it feels like such a fundamental thing. Like the foundation to any romantic relationship.

I know it's not all about looks and the things he's commented on are by no means all about looks. It's all sorts of things he finds attractive about different women. But none of those things are me. Not one of them. So it's not a case of me just not being his physical type but possessing other qualities he finds attractive. It's not that I don't tick every box more that I don't seem to tick any.

I've said this to him but when I asked him what he finds attractive about me, all he really had was an unquantifiable 'everything' and that he sees the world in a different way now because of me. Because I'm none of the things he actually wants. A woman's intelligence has never been important to him.

I'm not fishing for compliments. I'd never dream of asking him how I look or if he likes something I'm wearing or my hair. I'm just trying to understand.

And, like I say, I don't really expect anyone else to have the answer it just helps to get my thoughts down.

OP, have you posted about this before? It all sounds incredibly familiar. If you’re who I think you are, I’m not sure anything said here is going to cut through.

You seem to be interpreting everything people say or do through a filter of negativity. You say you’re logical and rational, but when it comes to this situation, that seems to go out the window.

Now you’re saying no one sees your worth, even though your posts are full of examples, including your partner, of people who clearly do.

It reads like you’re stuck in a spiral of low self-worth, doubt, and obsessive overthinking about things that don’t quite line up with reality.

that he sees the world in a different way because of me

you say that like it's a small thing. It's massive. It's one of the things I find attractive about my DH.

I don't think it does though.

There was thread yesterday with plenty of people posting to say that they andntheir partners still fancied each other after decades together.

Attraction doesn't always fade and I'm not sure it's supposed to so quickly because your partner isn't really what you wanted in the first place. That just means you're with the wrong person or you were attracted to something but that alone wasn't enough to sustain a relationship.

One of the. Not the.

I just don't know what to do for the best.

I don't know if I am overthinking. Or placing too much importance on little things that have been said.

But I have some work to do that isn't going to do itself so I'm going to look at that for a bit. Thank you.

Ultimately you need to stop focusing on what he thinks, and think about you. Are you still enjoying the relationship or is his behavior (real or imagined) ruining it for you?

if on balance it's worth it, you probably need to accept him for what he is. (Because when you asked him to change his behavior and speech and he did what you asked, you are still worrying about what he's thinking). He clearly finds joy in a non sexual way in many people and things. Some people might like that quality in a person, others might feel threatened by it.

if it's not making you happy, time to move on.

He clearly finds joy in a non sexual way in many people and things. Some people might like that quality in a person, others might feel threatened by it.

I'm not threatened by it per se and its one of the things I do (did?) like about him but I'm just very aware that I'm not one of those people or things. I'm not someone he finds sexual joy in either.

The only thing I did have that he could have been attracted to, that he did express an attraction to, that probably was one of his boxes, was the hobby I had. But I still wasn't doing it right and I still had to be 'uplevelled'. And now I don't even have that going for me.

@ComingFromTheSamePlace out of interest- how would you describe your appearance? Given that this seems to be the thing you are caught up on.

In what sense? What do I look like or how do I feel about it?

Physical attraction always fades. Being attracted to how someone carries themselves and the opinions they espouse is an entirely different matter. I still feel very attracted to my husband because of these things. Perhaps that's how he sees you? The real question is whether he wants to be getting you into bed at the end of an evening. That will fade too but should last for the first few years otherwise it might just be a platonic relationship.

Just how you would describe yourself physically. Attractive, ugly, tall, short, fat, thin, big nose, small nose etc etc. What do you see when you look in the mirror.

But all that is completely normal in a relationship.

There's a woman I work with who I can have nice long conversations about French Literature* with. I could never do that with DP, because she's just not interested in it. On the flip side, some times DP will forget I exist in the pub because she's been arguing with her friend about Formula 1 for the last 20 minutes.

*Alright, I admit it, it's Star Trek.

That doesn't mean that I'm not enough for DP, just because I don't have a clue who Lewis Hamilton is driving for this year, and DP is still enough for me despite the fact that she'd rather tear her own eyes out than follow the exploits of Captain Picard.

You can't be absolutely everything for your partner, noone can. There are always going to be shiny things that other people have that grab their attention for a while, whether that's a love of F1, a knowledge of the Welsh language, or even, to be blunt, a nice arse.

You'll never have all of the things that someone wants, noone can. What matters is that you're the one he wants to spend his life with.

DPs F1 friend is a good 10 years younger than us, he's also very very handsome. And yes, I've sat and watched them talk and wondered if I should be a bit jealous. But I'm not, because DP wants to come home with me at the end of the evening. If they went out, they'd very quickly find they have absolutely nothing in common aside from watching cars go round a track very fast, whereas we have about a million different things that make us fit together.

There are always going to be shiny things that other people have that grab their attention for a while

Of course, but you'd expect there to be something they like in their partner beyond - you know some pretty niche stuff and can talk about it for hours.

And that's also why the 'everything I've ever wanted' is such a cop out because nobody can be everything but it saves you from actually having to come up with 'something' when there isn't really anything.

He has a female friend he discusses books with. I have no interest in the books he reads and he has no interest in mine. I have absolutely no idea how often they chat. On the rare occasions we've been out with them, it doesn't take them long to get onto the subject and I know they message frequently because her name is almost always on his WhatsApp screen. But I have no idea what they say or whether they talk about anything else. And I'm not bothered in the slightest because they get excited by books and talking about books. He's not excited by listening to her talk about books or captivated by her voice when she reads to him.

When he's out with my friend and me, I must be such a disappointment. Small, inoffensive, quiet, uninspiring and failing ignite any passion at all. Sometimes, she leaves and it feels like all the energy has left the room with her. That's not because she brings the energy but because it exists between them when they talk.

My friend is a bit of a red herring. It's not that I think he is interested in her but more that she represents something he loves and ignites a passion in him that I very clearly don't. And he likes it.

OK then, so what are you going to do about it?

I really hate it when I see people post "What are you trying to get out of this thread?", but I really am struggling in this case to see what you're after.

I figured initially that you were looking to try and change your thinking on this, but you're pretty clearly convinced you're not good enough for this man, or possibly any man, and noone on here is going to be able to change your mind, no matter what we say.

So what do you want? Permission to dump him, permission to stay single? Because you don't need anyone's permission for that.