Is my husband an Incel?

[DiannaSpanna]

Hubby and I finally got round to watching Adolescence on Netflix this week.

When we finally finished we chatted for ages about it and at one point he asked what incel meant. So I explained it was involuntary celibacy and that it was guys who couldn't find a woman to sleep with. He joked "so married men?".

This got me prickly and I responded that it's different, but he thought about it for a bit and then made the point that if a husband wants sex and his wife doesn't, he's therefore involuntary celibate. I couldn't argue, as I got what he meant and he wasn't have a dig at me or women in general, just stating what it conjured up for him. But it got my back up all the same and I've not been able to stop thinking about it.

I know why. At the beginning of our relationship and marriage we had a very healthy sex life. He's great in bed, generous and still gorgeous. But after 3 kids, my body changing and generally mellowing, I don't really feel sexual desires anymore. And I'm happy with that. It feels right for me.

So I can't even remember the last time we had sex. It's definitely been over a year.

He's clearly still keen, flirts and tries it on from time to time. But I just don't feel like it. He never guilts or pressures me and is super respectful, but I can see it hurts him to be rejected. And he definitely seems less joyous than he used to and just generally deflated.

So I'm worried that I've made my husband an incel, if not in terms of red pill forums and Andrew Tate etc (he's not an idiot), but the feelings of sadness and resentment that come from being rejected.

When it comes to sex, I have all the control. He has none and has to wait for if and when I feel like it. Which is almost never anymore. When I put myself in his shoes, and if the situation were reversed, I would be angry and feel powerless.

So I find myself in a place where I really don't know what to do. I love him to bits and adore our life together, but I've changed and now he's got to live without something as fundamental as sex - through no fault of his own.

I don't know why I'm writing this here, but would love to know if anyone else is going through the same and if you have any advice.

I do think that marriage doesn't fit well into the modern world these days for so many reasons - yet it's still often the only sensible option for women wanting children because of the financial protection it can offer.

That's marriage. When you marry, you promise to have sex with them because they can't have sex with anyone but you. That is the reality of marriage, and this seems to have got lost these days.

OP @DiannaSpanna and all the posters saying that it's perfectly fine for a married person to choose not to have sex should check out the first 1.5 minutes of this video by the divorce lawyer James Sexton. It's a reality check.

Plus, he then goes on to talk about handling mob divorces, which is pretty funny.

I hate James Sexton. He’s incredibly transactional, rightly or wrongly, and the more I watch him the more I find he continually puts the male cause higher than the female and is pretty disparaging about quite a lot of women. Over and over again. Don’t be brow-beaten by him.

I wasn't aware of that. So when you marry you give up the right to consensual sex...

No, of course not & you know that's not the point being made here at all.

No one is saying anyone in a marriage should be forced to have sex but obviously it will cause problems if one partner decides they don't want it at all or ever again & the other one does - because marriages assume monogamy.
It's a hard topic to discuss without it sounding like coercion but it does seem unrealistic for one person to just stop having sex but expect their partner to accept that indefinitely and still remain faithful to them.

He’s not an incel.
I think you or both of you should get counselling. It’s ok if you’re both on the same page about your sex life, but if you aren’t on the same page in the long run it will cause problems.

You said:

promise to have sex with them because they can't have sex with anyone but you. That is the reality of marriage

Doesn't sound like consent to me. Everyone has a choice. You or your partner have a right not to have sex. The person who does want sex can accept celibacy or leave.

I reproduced 2 decades ago and have several children. I still have a huge sex drive so I don't understand how that leads to nature telling you you've done your bit? Being postmenopausal is surely natures way of telling you that you soon you will be unable to reproduce, so it makes sense with those hormone changes affect sex drive. I genuinely don't understand what's 'crap'?

Its quite simple: he should not force you to have sex. But you, also, should not force him to be celibate. You either work on the solution, or split up.

@ballettap - my sex drive has increased post-menopause. I don’t take HRT so that’s not why. I think freedom from the risk of pregnancy is what has driven it. Whatever the reason, I’m not complaining!

Everyone is different. Just because sex isn't important to someone doesn't mean that they should try and project their own feelings onto others to try to create a narrative that people should just accept a sexless relationship. Sex is very important to some and not so much to others but it's not unreasonable for one partner to be upset about a sexless relationship, despite what some people seem to feel. It's also not unreasonable for someone to see it as a red line and question the long term survivability of a relationship in these circumstances. On the other hand, if both people in the relationship are ok with it then that's fine too.

He’s not an incel as they are unable to attract women and feel a massive hatred to women for it.

That said, he is celibate involuntarily. You both need to consider this carefully as it isn’t what both parties want. You have what you want, as the default is not to have sex unless both parties are willing. But his confidence, happiness and outlook could be very severely impacted by this situation. It’s difficult as there’s no easy solution. But ignoring the issue isn’t a good option.

I was going to add something similar - basically, there can come a point of no return, when the relationship cannot recover from so much rejection.

OP, your house is on fire already. You may not be able to see the flames yet, but you can smell the smoke. I would have sex with him tonight as a priority, if I were you.

You describe him as good-looking, generous in bed, and never pressures you for sex. I had a horrible husband. It's so unfair how some people get one of the good ones and then don't even appreciate them.

Thank you. That's a lovely post.

Once a month also sounds awful. Talk about pity sex! Many experts define a sexless marriage as 12 times a year or less, so once a month is still seriously awful territory for a partner who isn't ready to give up on sex.

Um, I didn't say that, another poster did

Yes, when people get married, they can just rape each other all the time. 🙄

Massive eyeroll.

Sex is an expected part of marriage. If you can't accept that reality, please don't get married.

No, a married person does not have the right to refuse sex longterm. A sexless marriage is one of the official grounds for divorce.

People should either shit or get off the pot. If they don't want sex, fine. Get divorced.

I have seen nothing of that kind from him at all.

🙄Were you attracted to the thread due to it having incel in the title?

People are so horrified by the idea of marriage coming with an expectation of a regular sex life, but I'm confused. If one's partner is good-looking, respectful, doesn't pressure you, and you fancied him enough to marry him, and he hasn't turned into the kind of utter arsehole that my husband did after marriage, why wouldn't you want to sleep with him?

Obviously.

🙄

🙄Makes sense, they don't believe in consent either.

You're not married, are you? I can tell.

And no, of course I don't believe in consent. I go round raping all the men I can. 🙄