Is my husband an Incel?

[DiannaSpanna]

Hubby and I finally got round to watching Adolescence on Netflix this week.

When we finally finished we chatted for ages about it and at one point he asked what incel meant. So I explained it was involuntary celibacy and that it was guys who couldn't find a woman to sleep with. He joked "so married men?".

This got me prickly and I responded that it's different, but he thought about it for a bit and then made the point that if a husband wants sex and his wife doesn't, he's therefore involuntary celibate. I couldn't argue, as I got what he meant and he wasn't have a dig at me or women in general, just stating what it conjured up for him. But it got my back up all the same and I've not been able to stop thinking about it.

I know why. At the beginning of our relationship and marriage we had a very healthy sex life. He's great in bed, generous and still gorgeous. But after 3 kids, my body changing and generally mellowing, I don't really feel sexual desires anymore. And I'm happy with that. It feels right for me.

So I can't even remember the last time we had sex. It's definitely been over a year.

He's clearly still keen, flirts and tries it on from time to time. But I just don't feel like it. He never guilts or pressures me and is super respectful, but I can see it hurts him to be rejected. And he definitely seems less joyous than he used to and just generally deflated.

So I'm worried that I've made my husband an incel, if not in terms of red pill forums and Andrew Tate etc (he's not an idiot), but the feelings of sadness and resentment that come from being rejected.

When it comes to sex, I have all the control. He has none and has to wait for if and when I feel like it. Which is almost never anymore. When I put myself in his shoes, and if the situation were reversed, I would be angry and feel powerless.

So I find myself in a place where I really don't know what to do. I love him to bits and adore our life together, but I've changed and now he's got to live without something as fundamental as sex - through no fault of his own.

I don't know why I'm writing this here, but would love to know if anyone else is going through the same and if you have any advice.

I really think you’ve asked the wrong question here! You should be asking him if he’s happy with no sex ( and clearly you haven’t because you know the answer) . I’m not sure how you’ve gone a whole year ignoring the elephant in the room.

There's a lot of emphasis here about wanting to have sex, but actually there are lots of different things that make us want to do something. So, you might want to have sex because you desire it, or you might want to have sex because you love making your partner happy. It's ok to be generous, and you don't have to pretend, but you might find once you get into the habit that you also get something from it. But if not, then that's still ok, you're doing a lovely thing for your husband and it sounds as though he deserves it.

Oh OP he's Not an Incel. He’s a man in a sexually unfulfilling marriage.

I just hope these silly buzz words disappear off this planet in a few years.

But if not, then that's still ok, you're doing a lovely thing for your husband and it sounds as though he deserves it.

How does this work? The OP doesn't have a libido or want sex, the idea does nothing for her.

Therefore does she lie there, stare at the ceiling and let her husband use her body? Or does she pretend she's into it and groan like a porn star?

Would a decent person want to use their loved ones body? I wouldn't want sex with someone who had no desire to do so and was doing it to please me.

I assume those telling the OP to lie back and think of England would be happy to have sex with their husband's even though they had no sexual interest in them.

i think everyone responding to your post has gotten distracted with explaining the meaning of an incel, though I do believe your DH is 100% not an incel but that it’s more likely he feels forced in to being involuntarily celibate and with your discussion on what you both just watched, he’s maybe took it as an opportunity to bring up how he truly feels.

as a mum (3 DC) myself, I empathise and understand that we tend to struggle with our bodies and libido changing, a lot of our insecurities on how we feel about our bodies after giving birth can really dent our confidence. But if your libido is non existent - even if your happy with it - you committed to your marriage and intimacy is a huge factor in keeping you & DH close, have you ever questioned why you no longer feel you want the intimacy?
Majority of the time it’s hormonal or with young DC, it’s stress/exhaustion. If your open to taking some advice maybe sit down with you DH and ask him to be open and honest, truly listen to him and then you be open and honest.
He does sound like a good man, so I don’t think your open conversation will cause any problems, it might in-fact create a safe enough space that it’s a step in the direction of being intimate again.
You can always try cuddling, talking about when you first met and what you loved most about your sex life, go back to basics and try dating like it’s your first time again, and although having DC can be demanding and take up a lot of time, try and make time for you both to focus on your relationship. If after a while it’s clear your libido isn’t returning visit your GP and investigate your hormones. You might find that you truly are not happy without the intimacy and this could change your lives for the better. But either way if you truly love your DH then make the effort to try

💯 this!!

Agree with this

And also I forgot to add that during my 20 year relationship 4 DC later, we have also been through “dry spells” our DC range from 17 years to 4 years and my body has changed so much I have cried hard a few times cause I have felt I lost myself 3 babies ago, but my DH is my world and I not only love our life together but cherish it, I had a hormone imbalance twice over the years and this impacted our sex life, also exhaustion from no sleep, being a working mum etc etc lots of different reasons. After medical intervention and lots of family babysitting this helped things!

I’ll tell ya a secret… during my “dry spells” when I didn’t have a libido…

iv always loved to read and some of these books have had smut, and a few times when reading particular steamy scenes, let’s just say they made me feel certain “ways” …… it gave me hope that I hadn’t lost myself completely, so I decided to share my book and scenes with my DH and let’s just say it helped!! There was a sense of feeling naughty and dirty and we had lots of fun (lol)

You definitely need to talk about this with him.

If he's attractive and the sex is great you need to work out why you don't want that.

Don't have sex you don't want, but definitely explore why you don't want that for you.

Are you just bone tired? Are you happy with where life is but just never get the urge? Have you considered getting a women's health test? Could some counselling work? Have you had any particularly traumatic events recently that have left you just wanting a friendship rather than an intimate relationship?

If it's something you will not ever want again, then the discussion should be around whether he is happy for the relationship to be like this and if he isn't then it's a hard pill to swallow but you should discuss separation.

However if there is a chance you will want sex, then please look into it further.

Your husband sounds lovely and not demanding at all, and that's a good foundation for working these things out.

But definitely do not have sex out of fear he will leave, or have sex you are uncomfortable with.

Honestly my libido was the same as yours 4 months ago. In my younger years I had a high sex drive, but once I started going through the menopause I had nothing, it was like someone had flipped a switch. I was like this for a few years. I was in discussion with my GP, but they wanted to find my optimum thyroid medication before putting me on hrt. I have now been on hrt for about 6 months and my sex drive has suddenly come back. My husband was joking the other night that he couldn't keep up!
Please speak to your GP, it could be your hormones if you are going through peri.

The term 'incel' was actually coined in the 90s by a woman - about herself - iirc she was in her mid-20s and had never dated or had sex, and started a forum to talk about that kind of loneliness. It got appropriated by men and curdled into misogyny over the years.

The OP's husband wasn't referring to himself as a creepy manosphere weirdo, but to the actual meaning of the words. The root is the same for the manosphere weirdos, for the woman who coined the term and for the OP's husband: a life without sexual connection can feel incredibly sad and lonely, especially when you can't envision an improvement. That's the original 'incel' feeling and it deserves to be taken seriously.

For a lot of teenage boys the problem is that feeling being funnelled into violent misogyny. That obviously hasn't happened to the OP's husband, who I think has dealt with it in a far more mature and respectful way: he made a joke that was very close to the bone as an attempt to open up the conversation with his wife. And on the evidence of this thread it did shake the OP out of her comfortable status quo, so the ball's in her court now. There are solutions and it's up to her and her husband to work through them.

(If he's really taken a year of sex being taken off the table with no discussion to make one snippy joke, he has been a huge deal more patient than I would have been in the same position.)

I have not read the whole thread but someone may have already mentioned it. The incel thing is a completely separate thing. The focus really should be why you are feeling like this. Is it a medical problem such as hormones or is it a psychological one. These are something you need to discuss with your GP I would involve your husband in these discussions at some point as it effects him too. Wishing you both the best.

Don’t you think it’s a shame your husband has to live without sex when he doesn’t want to ?

I agree with this. And I think if you really love him you will want to explore this with him & find a way that you can both be happy & fulfilled in your marriage.

You mentioned having "all the power". One person shouldn't have that, a good relationship needs to involve equality.

Your hormones are in decline. His aren’t. It’s the cruelest thing that Mother Nature did to women was to switch things off halfway through our lives when men experience nothing even remotely similar.

They breeze through 50 and 60…

We don’t.

The sum total is that sexually you’re about the equivalent of a 75 year old man (that would be your ideal sexual partner, testosterone waning), whereas he’s still in his 50s and wants sex.

Either you go on HRT with testosterone- this should bring back your sex drive or you need to talk t him about hormones and what’s going on. It’s no one’s fault. It’s just life and all the shit it throws at us at times.

He’s told you he’s unhappy.

If you never plan to have sex with him again you owe it to him to tell him that. You can’t expect him to stay in a sexless marriage forever. It’s a miserable and lonely place to be.

My STBXH is definitely not an incel. He's got a very healthy attitude towards women, which is one of the things that most attracted him to me 22 years ago.

For the first 15 years of our relationship, we had an extremely adventurous sex life, which we both enjoyed.

After the birth of our 3rd child, I just lost interest in sex.
My body had changed, I was tired, and I had 3 DCs who needed me constantly.
I just couldn't strike up any energy for sex.

It's been 7 years since we last had sex, and now we are splitting up.
I'm incredibly sad about that. He's a decent man, and we've had a good married life together (with the inevitable ups and downs).

But, ultimately, our lack of intimacy has meant that we've been living as friendly housemates for a number of years.

He's a very attractive man, and I love him.
But, the lack of sex issue in our marriage increasingly became something we didn't communicate about?

I've got some regrets. I wanted our marriage to last, but I certainly wouldn't have had sex with him when I didn't want to.

I don't really understand it, given how attracted I am to him? It was just like a light went out.

Agree. Thanks.

That's really sad.
I wish you both well and hope you have a kind, respectful co-parenting relationship with each other going forward.

Your DH doesn’t care about your body changing. It doesn’t make you any less attractive to him, not for a moment. If you have taken sex off the table without discussion then I can see why he’s upset. While nobody is ‘entitled’ to sex, intimacy is an important part of marriage. Without it is easy to become little more than housemates.

I had a sexless marriage for six years (his choice). It made me very vulnerable to male attention and although I didn’t have an affair I was on the edge of one when I had a word with myself and ended the marriage.

In your shoes I would look at options to get you back on the groove. This could be anything from reading a saucy chapter of Bridgerton to HRT/testosterone and everything in between (and don’t discount the saucy chapter in Bridgerton!). With young children and a busy life it’s easy for sex to slip to the back burner but remember you are a wife as well as a mother/employee/badminton player/chauffeur, etc.

Sometimes you want to jump on their bones as soon as they walk the door, sometimes it’s like washing the car - a bit of a chore to get started but quite fun and satisfying once you get going. It’s worth paying attention to this aspect of your relationship. It’s the glue that holds everything together - it has so many benefits too - better sleep, feeling more relaxed, more loved, better mood. A regular orgasm is a great antidepressant.

Your hurt because you know it’s true

Not entitled in any specific moment, no, as that would be rape, but when you marry, you are entitled to expect some kind of sex life overall. You absolutely cannot take someone out of the dating pool on the understanding that they are to have sex with only you, and then.....never have sex with them. But I agree that if one party doesn't want sex, divorce is the answer. That's such a drastic and heartbreaking solution though, especially for the kids. If you have a great partner whom you love and whom you fancied enough to marry, why wouldn't you want to have sex with them? (This is assuming they're a good partner. The times I haven't wanted sex is because I had a bad partner, but OP says this isn't the case here.)

OP - maybe read the book MATING IN CAPTIVITY. It talks about how the legitimacy of marriage can take all the erotic-ness out of sex and discusses how to handle it. One woman described how, once they were married, she didn't feel desire any more, because after marriage, she was officially his only option. So she didn't feel as desired, which affected her own desire.

I think the psychology of marriage affects people more than you'd think. Society needs to be more honest about this, and also be more honest about men and their strong sex drives and the reality of what you sign up for when you marry. Women take on the burden of satisfying that sex drive when they marry, and this reality is completely brushed under the carpet these days. This may not be PC, but it's biology. (Disclaimer: I know it's not always the man who's the high-desire partner, but it often is, especially when there are babies and children.)