Chances for single man in 40s wanting a family.

[Gini83]

I have a lovely (male) friend who is mid-40s, single and really wants marriage/LTR and children. What do you think the chances are for someone to find that at this stage of life?

I don’t want to put anything identifying here but he’s got lots going for him – kind, fun, sociable, good job, financially stable, own home, looks after himself etc – but it has never really happened for him. He does date and has had a couple of relationships that have got to a semi-serious stage (c2 yrs) and looked as if they might be ‘the one’ but they’ve never worked out beyond that. We’ve spoken about it so many times and he’s so desperately sad about the situation but not willing to give up on having children. He won’t date anyone unless there’d be a prospect of having a family together, but that means he’s turned down chances for relationships which might have made him happy. I am sad for him and also worried about whether I’ve given him the right advice when we had a long conversation about it recently.

What would you say to a friend in that position (who asked for your advice)?

I am 39 would love to have kids and would happily date someone mid 40s and give it a try. My worry would be with a man desperate to start a family is that he was with me solely to have kids as a last chance, and potentially that if after a year of trying it hadn’t happened he’d leave me for other pastures.

I think it is important to be upfront about what you want, but there are a few men I know that most women give the swerve to now because they are so focused on kids it is scary

Well, my range was 3-5 years less to 10 years older, approx (younger generally not ready for kids). My filter was no kids so that narrowed things down a bit.

Most preferable was a similar age like you. Not sure why this especially but I quite liked if we'd been at secondary school at the same time (didn't have to be the same school or country!).

That said, I did date men in their mid 40s and slightly older and they were fine, just not quite the ones for me.

If I went out with someone a bit older which I did a few times then I genuinely took them as I found them. Same criteria as the others (personality, good manners and kindness important too for all. To me these go without saying). I wouldn't really have dated someone so much older as to have required different protocols so to speak. They were either what I was looking for or not.

I know a lot of men (friends, colleagues, exes, previous dates) who have followed the pattern of focussing on career and studies and realising they've not put the effort in, or they've not worked on their confidence on the relationship side. Guys like this who have a good heart can absolute catches. You get some who go the other way, gain a bit of confidence through dating and live their teenage best lives but the good ones can be great. I quickly realised that when dating. Much more worthwhile than bothering with those with the surface charm and polish.

OP's friend sounds absolutely fine in terms of age. 40s would have been in range for me and plenty of my friends.

I think he would be able to manage it OP - there’s a foot for every shoe!
Would he date a woman who is divorced and has kids? Or does he want someone who hasn’t done that yet, in which case he is going to have to go quite a bit younger I guess?

Fair enough. I never went down the dating 10+ years older route as I never seemed to have enough in common with the men, and I’m sorry to say it, but men take care of themselves far less than women do such that single middle aged men look a lot older than single middle aged women. Most men 45+ just look too old to me.

I don’t think OP said there was anything wrong with her friend’s looks? We can just assume he’s not exceptionally good looking as this wasn’t mentioned. I do not think a man of 45 is a lost cause when it comes to having a family, not at all, he just needs to adjust his criteria.

Thank you - still reading all of the replies and wish I had a crystal ball for him!

To the questions above. I certainly wouldn't say he's exceptionally good looking, he's fairly average for his age. He's a little under 6 ft and in good shape, so he's certainly got things going for him physically.
Not sure whether he's screening out women who already have children. I assume most women in that position are going to be much more cautious about rushing into a serious relationship or having a child with a new man, and time isn't particularly on his side. Though if he limits himself to age to have children + wants children + doesn't have them already then he's cutting out a lot of potential relationships.

Some men in mid to late 40s if not in early 50s are hot, look at European men, for example! Mainly because they look after themselves, dress well, have a good sense of humour and good manners. All that is usual a good start. They age well and can still be attractive for someone 10 years younger. I think he should relax about his goal but date more, have fun and enjoy the dating, and the right person for a serious relationship/marriage/family will come along.

I met my second husband and had a child in my 40’s so, anything is possible. I’d think there’s probably a few women out there who can’t find a good man that age who are a similar age and want a family. He will just have to keep putting himself out there and be upfront from the get go that children are extremely important to him.

Absolutely 100% this!

I think the danger of these blanket generalisations like “walking red flag” can result in genuine, relationship worthy people being rejected. It’s horribly ableist & restrictive. People develop at different rates & dependent on their ability/circumstances. What about someone whose 30’s have been blighted by a chronic illness or disability for eg? A man in this position who wants to commit, wants a family & is ready to go could be perfect, equally somebody who’s been in a LTR and strung along by promised children but ultimately refused emerging into their 40’s keen to find the one?! There are so many different scenarios - writing someone off so quickly (maybe when you meet this guy he’s genuinely undateable but that’s clearly not the case if he has good relationships with friends, family & a career). Otherwise just feels like fuelling the manosphere incel mentality where women are seen as ruthless, heartless & money obsessed men rejecters!

I think you may have provided some justification for saying women are 'man rejectors', but zero evidence of why we may be money obsessed. A bit unfair, given that the vast majority of women in their 30s are financially self reliant.

Just sounds bitter, TBH.

Everyone is, in any case, free to reject any potential suitor out of hand for whatever reason they want, including disablism and any other ism. And should not have to give even the slightest bit of house room to the idea that doing so is fuelling the mentality of whatever group anyone cares to invoke.

If you RTFT you’ll see money being referred to as an attractive quality that may mitigate an older man’s age & lack of having children already. Not bitter just expressing an opinion. You’re the one making personal.

She said early on that he was average looking, not unusual either way plus the activity suggests he is probably quite fit.

Some men that age certainly make an effort to put women off, fish pics, scowling, shit clothes, fag on, terrible angles, and suchlike but I saw plenty of decent looking to handsome guys that age who looked nice.

I found when dating it was easy to find common ground, it was the further interest and attraction and that's as elusive at any age. I didn't focus my search of the older blokes but as I was serious about a family and a connection, I didn't rule out those a bit above my natural preference (hence 40s) if they seemed interesting.

If you want a family, you need to be stable in all areas. That isn't the same as needing to be wealthy. The man in question is ONLY looking for women ready to reproduce. How's he gonna feed his children if he's broke?

Or, perhaps in addition to a wife and mother, you want HER to be the provider too? PLENTY of that going on. Virtually every other MN thread is about useless, grifting men.

But we can't date everyone.

It's up to the individual (so, the OP's pal) to make themselves attractive and available to potential partners. More so when they're looking outside the normal age range. As discussed, I don't agree that a 40 something should give up unless he's a film star millionaire (paraphrasing). As I say, plenty of professionals only get going in their 30s and 40s in the world of dating. However, nobody owes him their interest and he needs to make the effort.

You seem a bit triggered - it’s ok for there to be a difference in opinion really!

I'm not triggered. You were aggressive in your tone. Telling someone to RTFT is swearing at them. I could respond in kind, but can't be arsed.

I don't see asking for stability as setting a high bar. It's a basic adult level of existence.

Ok you’ve taught me something new - I thought RTFT meant Read The Full Thread & had no idea it means otherwise!! Just googled it double check. Lesson learned apologies in no way did mean to swear at you.

So did I, people often say "Sorry, haven't RTFT but...". I never thought they were saying they hadn't read the effing thread!

@TheAmusedQuail same! Won’t be making that mistake again! As for the thread think we’ve both got our opinions & each are valid I guess 🤷‍♀️

this thread is an interesting read, opinions seem to go both ways

OP, what is your take from here, did you find anything useful to take to him as advice ?

Yes, it's a really interesting thread and very mixed views.

I might have already said this, but started the thread because I was worried I should have said more in a recent conversation. Essentially he'd said he'd had a great time with a woman he'd been casually dating but had ended it because she didn't want children and he would only be in a relationship with a woman who did. I'd gently raised the question of whether there was a point at which he'd look to a life without children and he was really clear that was not something he'd consider at the moment. Afterwards I was worrying that I should have said more (that might sound quite intrusive but I have quite a 'sisterly' relationship with him). I was worried that he'd essentially got to an age where this would really limit the pool of potential partners for all the reasons on here and he might need to face the fact that he's probably missed the boat. Plus his age raises fertility issues itself and even if he found someone straight away and it all worked he'd be at least in later 40s by the time a baby arrived. Then there's the whole question of being an older parent, having teens in your 60s etc. He's set up family life on such a pedestal I'm not sure he's realistic about what that might be like (I have 3 pre-mid teens and have tried to tell him!). I was regretting not saying all of this more bluntly because I'm worried that he's missing out on prospects for great relationships now, and is getting so down about the situation.

Now I'm not so sure, there are clearly quite a few women on here who would consider a man in his position, and it might not be as bleak as I had thought. Next time it comes up - which is fairly frequently! - I think I'll take the angle of thinking about therapy and working on being content in himself and addressing any relationship issues. That probably improves his chances of life working in the way he wants it to but would be beneficial anway.

Does he make the best of what he has? Keep trim, have a decent haircut, good personal grooming (eyebrows, nasal hair), dress well?

Harsh. Would you say the same of a woman in her 40s never married no children?

I am that person because a) a relationship ended when I was 32 b) I decided to leave a major city, move, save a deposit and buy a home - all took longer than expected c) focused on career and got promoted d) I had a life changing diagnosis mid 30s e) left stressful job for a more family friendly one f) just ready to date then we had a pandemic! g) had a bereavement h) job wasn't really working out so left and found another i) here I am, happy settled and about to turn 45.

Think I have a good career, 2 degrees, nice friends.

Fertility is quite a personal issue, I would be devastated if a friend told me what to do / have done. There's a tactful way but at the end of the day you risk making him feel terrible if you are right of course.

Also he had to make sure he presents as fatherhood material. If dating someone who is mid 30s they have had a lot of time living independently.