resentment over ultimatum

[whiningshinji]

Many years ago my wife gave me an ultimatum around having a third child. I adamantly didn't want a third, but to spare my other two children a broken home I acquiesced.

All the things I knew would happen happened. I got locked into a high pressure,high paying job I hated to cover heightened costs, free time totally evaporated and the friends I did have soon drifted due to me going from work to home and back again and never seeing anyone! My hobbies, modest though they were all withered due to lack of time/funds. My wife maintained some of her social contact and hobbies once all children were into school(less full on job with better annual leave - mine unsurprisingly was stingy and was absorbed by school holiday coverage)

The resentment I felt towards my wife over this never went away. Our third child is now approaching adulthood and all I can think about is leaving.

I got dragged to yet another (tiresome) couples thing by my wife. I normally don't drink, but I had a couple this time. We were talking to some people who were talking about how hard the baby and toddler years were and how they stopped at one, saying to us and another couple how did we manage three. I said it was a very hard slog - my wife chipped in by saying that we wouldn't change a thing.

Apparently at this point I scowled and muttered that I would. I wasn't even aware of doing this! Either way my wife is now getting an inkling that my mindset hasn't been changed by the years. He attitude has wrongly always been she was right and that I fell into line in the end and was content.

Now suddenly she is encouraging me to meet up with friends (who I haven't spoken to in 15 years) and mentioning finding a club for one of my old hobbies.
Bit late!

I am 80% sure I will leave, but this has thrown things because I was hoping to quietly arrange things and then cut the cord. I certainly wouldn't fight on the house or forking over half savings, the house is paid off and she can have it! Well worth it to break free of her.

I don't know what to do, I just feel the resentment has totally eaten away any affection I had over the years.

I also think OP shouldn't have accepted the need for new cars, holidays, actvities, if he felt they couldn't afford them without pushing himself to work so hard (though many people work hard anyway, and manage to be parents and have some social life and hobbies).

I know a family who had 4 kids and the mother was always a SAHM. Fair enough, their choice. But their kids didn't have the experiences and life style our two had, down to fewer ice creams out because the cost was too high.

Was there really no choice but to have the life you did OP?

You sound absolutely consumed by this and if I were you, I would have therapy before making any decisions.

I'm not buying the posts claiming that the urge to have a child overrides everything else. I can't have children. It's shit but you know what, people have to accept they can't always have what they want in life and find ways of dealing with it. That applies to both you and your wife.

I don't think your wife was right but I think you have dealt with I'm the most unhealthy way for both you, her and your children. There's no way that amount of simmering resentment hasn't had an impact on family life.

Three children are much more than two!

Bigger car, possibly bigger house, more money, more time, less rest, less time to yourself

Of course you love them once they're there. But sometimes it's like dropping a bomb on a reasonably smooth life

I think you would do very well to take ownership and accountability of your own decisions and actions. No one forced you to have a third child, no one forced you to work 12 hour days, no one forced you to give up your friends or hobbies.

Those were all decisions you made freely. You may now regret some of those decisions and if you had your time again, make different ones. But own your mistakes instead of blaming your soon to be ex wife. Bitterness and resentment will eat you away.

I also can’t get my head around regretting a child. I’m afraid I can’t empathise at all. Don’t you look at your child as a soon to be adult and think god it was tough and a lot of sacrifices were made but my love for you being in this world was worth it??

You sound like you are afraid of her... having to 'police' even your own words when with other people, afraid of her reaction to the truth about the reality of things. But some people here are saying correctly, that you really didn't have to work so hard to earn more money. You should have made clear to her from the start that your standard of life as a family would deteriorate with 3 children, and that both of you would have to make some compromises like e.g. move to a cheaper area, etc. There was really no need for you alone to sacrifice so much - she should have picked up the financial side of things as well, as it was her decision. I'm sorry that things turned out that way.

If you want a divorce then get a divorce, however don’t make it all about the fact that you were “forced” into having a child you didn’t want.

I think this is really key. Leave if you think that doing so will give you to chance to build a life that you want and that it would be a positive step. But the way you've expressed it makes it sound anything but- "I certainly wouldn't fight on the house or forking over half savings, the house is paid off and she can have it! Well worth it to break free of her."- I'm now picturing you impoverished in a bedsit, even more miserable but thinking it's all worth it because at least now everyone can see how ill-treated you have been. That would not in any way be positive or healthy, turning yourself into an albatross around your wife's neck.

Some therapy would be a good start, to help you break out of your negative spiral and make these big decisions in a positive way.

I've known parents of both sexes that have had totally unplanned children and dealt with it far better.

You made an active choice to have a 3rd child @whiningshinji you've raised that child and still holding on to that resentment. I think you are totally unreasonable to be holding this against your wife, it was done and dusted a long time ago and have been an active participant.

Take some responsibility for your choices. I have very little sympathy for this hand wringing.

I get the feeling, but of course I could be wrong, that the OP is expressing the fact that he feels that his wife has been selfish during the marriage, expecting her wishes to override his (the ultimatum), expecting a certain financial quality of life, being resentful if he wanted to go out on a weekend night with his own friends, etc…it does sounds like she wanted things her own way and might not have been too interested in considering his happiness (if it conflicted with what she wanted). How do you fix it if one person in the relationship is more self-centered? This is just from what OP has said, of course we don’t have the full story. Could be worth couples therapy just to reach some understanding. Financial settlement though should be fair for both parties, don’t give up more than what you are entitled to.

There are lots of big decisions where a compromise is impossible. Either one person concedes or the couple split. Moving abroad, having a child, getting sterilised etc etc.

I wonder if the OP would have been completely happy if his wife had gone along with his desire for 2 children? Or would he also expect her to be a martyr now steaming with resentment and planning on leaving.

there were only 3 options. Her way his way or split. It seems he would only have been happy with his way…

Not sure which of my posts you’re referring to but no, I’m his wife as much as you’re Cillian Murphy’s wife 🤣

Op have you read any of the Gottman books on relationships?
They are worth reading. The Gottmans were also interviewed by Steven Bartlett on Diary of a CEO. It’s a podcast if you are not familiar, you can listen to it for free. It’s a long interview but is a good intro to their work.

I do think Loving someone is a choice. Gottman counsellors are good but expensive - cheaper than divorce so may be worth trying! I’m a better partner for reading Gottman books.

Your marriage has been infiltrated by the 4 horsemen. They are clip clopping about your marriage.

Get some counselling for yourself.
It sounds like your marriage is long dead.
Time to look at an amicable split.

To be fair, it’s also unfair to issue your husband/ wife with an ultimatum.

Agree that people have to voice their needs, but I also think that a loving partner would notice if the person they loved stopped doing stuff they love and stopped seeing their friends.

I agree with this. Obviously none of us on here know your wife's view but it does seem like you were the one who made a lot of sacrifices to support the family - unlike a lot of fathers we hear about on here! As in all relationships both sides need to be treated fairly and equally.
Do you think you'll change your view on this and accept what is done is done? Can you envisage a happy future with your wife with no resentment?
Btw nothing you have said leads me to believe you don't love your 3rd child.

Plenty of parents don’t want to be apart from their children for 50% of the time. If the marriage isn’t abusive, staying for the children is a valid choice. One a lot of women make (and I suspect a lot more men than we realise too).

And choosing to bring a third, completely unwanted child into the situation that he absolutely resents and wishes (now, still, when the child is an adult) he never had.. is that a valid choice?

Agree with this.

I can’t work out the dynamics of your relationship but I don’t understand why you had to work more - to your detriment - to maintain a specific standard of living, rather than telling her that the condition of having a third was that your lifestyle would have to change. Is she controlling? Or are you the type of partner who says yes to everything to avoid confrontation whilst simmering inside - and then eventually imploding?

I understand the resentment of being given an ultimatum, and I agree your choice wasn’t really a choice your wife was a dick for threatening to break up the family. However, it is also true that the love and joy that a child brings is an antidote to all of that - if you allow it to be. I don’t think you don’t love your child, I think you stepped up for the family which is admirable.

But the bit you really have to take responsibility for is that you never really allowed yourself to accept the new status quo, you held on to the anger/resentment and didn’t move forward. You could have allowed yourself to enjoy your family more, made some effort to reinstate your social life etc, but none of this happened because you were too consumed by this ultimatum and couldn’t see how to make things better for yourself.

Pp have suggested therapy - I think this would be extremely beneficial before you go through with divorce. Sometimes you can be so caught in a past trauma you can’t see how much you can actually love your current life. Even if it still ends up in divorce you will be able to have a better relationship with your children and not come off as the bad guy (which you likely will btw seeing as you can’t say you didn’t want the third child). And by the way, I don’t think you will suddenly be happier if you just leave - it still doesn’t deal with your trauma, so please do try therapy first.

Yes. Because in reality it wasn’t a free choice. It’s not fair to judge him on that really. It’s admirable he did what he needed to in order to protect his young children from a divorce.

He's not said anywhere that he resents his child. The only thing he's talked about are the ultimatum and the practical ramifications of raising a larger family.

It very much was a free choice. He could have said “No, I do not want a third and I will very much resent being forced to have a child I do not want. If you wish to leave because for me our two children are enough, and for you it is not and you would rather break our family apart, that is your decision and your decision alone.”

She likely wouldn’t even have left. OP saying it’s an ultimatum is very dramatic when it doesn’t seem like he put up any fight at all. Also, people have partners leave them every day and the children are raised with separated parents or by single parents. It’s not something they need to be protected from. A toxic and bitter household with “together” parents is far worse than a happy, separated coparenting relationship with two fulfilled and satisfied parents.

As pp says, he hasn’t said he resents his 3rd child, he resents his wife and the position she put him in. Many parents love, sacrifice and care for children they did not chose to have. It’s such a common scenario it’s almost banal. So yes, his choice to stay for his children, including the 3rd child which that necessitated, until they are adults is valid.

Stop minimising. He obviously felt it was a serious enough threat or why do it. The thing about people is, they make these choices in good conscience, it seems the right thing to do at the time. There's no crystal ball to tell you that in 18 years you'll be corroded by resentment and the marriage will be over anyway.

Well this is simply not true.

Perhaps you have different values. I agree a household with bitterness is not good for children. But breaking apart a family in the absence of abuse? Yes, absolutely children do need to be protected from that. It’s ridiculous that you can minimise the impact of divorce so much.

100% this

Have you and your wife ever had any couples counselling?
Even if you split I think this would be helpful and cathartic. You could both express your views on the ultimatum, your marriage etc freely and in a safe space. You need to work through your resentment.

I would also ask - if you hadn't had the third child how different would your life truly have been? Would you have had a different job or would you have still been striving for what sounds like the typical middle class life of expensive holidays, nice house, tutors etc etc.

As others have said, in reality, I don't think having the third child would have made as much difference as you think. I suspect you would have been on exactly the same treadmill with two.

Do you think you might have hit that time in mid-life with adult children about to flee the nest that lots of people get to? You are looking around & thinking is this it? Why did I make these choices etc? But in your case you feel you have a reason and a person (your wife) to blame?

Finally, please don't underestimate how upsetting it will be for your adult children if you do decide to divorce. I am not saying you have to stay in an unhappy marriage but think carefully and be certain before you make any big decisions.
And get advice/read relevant books on how to handle this before you proceed.