Knowing marriage is over

[thelab]

Hello,

I’m married with 2 DC. Home in joint mortgage and I work FT. I’ve only recently changed jobs and took a bit of a pay cut; this was to study so I’ll eventually have much better earning middle of next year. I’m 31.

I’ve been feeling ‘stuck’ in marriage for a while now. DH just completely messy to the extremes and not wanting to take on the mental load of much, to keep it very brief!
We’d do nothing outside of parenting but if his friends popped up, he’d be so excited and making all the effort. If he couldn’t go, he’d mope about and speak of how he doesn’t want to let that part of his life go (socialising) and blame me for it. They can’t do anything together that doesn’t involve getting drunk.
Nights are spent with him falling asleep on the sofa snoring.

Anyway, DH got invited to a stag do which he’s currently on, he went yesterday and until Monday evening. He first told me about it in passing at a concert of my favourite band, knowing I’d be distracted, then slyly just booked himself onto it, without even a discussion about it. He then said he wasn’t going, as a previous stag do he went on, late last year, made him miss the children too much.

I repeatedly told him I wasn’t happy about the way he went about this, not ‘permission’, just the lack of courtesy to discuss it. I also told him I wasn’t happy as we haven’t even got a family holiday booked this year, yet he’s been to the stag last year, this one and is going on a weekend away for his dad’s birthday next month. He started changing from not going, to going, saying he felt emotionally manipulated by me telling him the children had been upset on the previous one. He assured me he’d make sure we had a family holiday booked before he went however.

Obviously, that didn’t happen and I have no idea how much he’s taken money wise. Before he left, he didn’t even send a message to say he was getting on the plane/that he loves us as he usually would and all I got when he arrived was literally ‘I’ve arrived’. He messaged about 11:30am their time today, again, very brief with ‘Yous alright?’ This is unlike even him.

He’s been online on WhatsApp a lot tonight yet not bothered to message. I don’t expect constant conversation flow but I think it just highlights where we are on the priorities. I’m feeling a mix of anxiety and anger and I’m just so fed up of what has become my life. This feels like the end in my head, like a tipping point almost.

Sorry, I just wanted to let it out somewhere 😞

Have a think on whether you want this important conversation over the phone or face to face - only you know what's best for you

It may be you want to tell him over the phone you want to split up, so he's got a day to get his head round it before he's back. His reaction will tell you a lot too

Or, you might want to be looking him in the eye when you speak - and telling him today that you are not ready to talk yet will make him realise how serious this is. It will also give you a chance for a quick call to a solicitor tomorrow morning

You will never feel the same about him again after what he said, and he treats you and the house like shit

Definitely keep all the work stuff from him for now. But I have a feeling that will be part of a much improved future for you

I do wonder if some of his resentment towards you is knowing you're doing well and the fear that eventually he will get sacked for his incompetence.

Agree.

Tell him you're still sorting out your thoughts and are not ready to talk; and that for such an important discussion, face to face would be best. Switch your phone off, talk when he's back.

A good man would be proud of a successful wife. I doubt he fears being sacked, he seems to me to feel nothing but entitlement to be carried by those around him.

He's clearly not a good man. He's a shitbag. How has he NOT been sacked by now?

Just wondering. Is it professional of them to keep talking about your DH and how incompetent he is to you. Please don't get me wrong he is a complete knob and needs dumping (and firing!) but just wondering really.

This is all awful, except the stuff about a) how good you obviously are at your job and b) how brilliant a mum you obviously are to your kids. Hold onto those two things because once this crisis is over, you'll be on top of the world.

This marriage is over. I would stop messaging him constantly. The fact there was a woman in his contacts who he was messing around with is just more evidence that the marriage is done. You don't need the details you don't need to hear from her.

Please seek the advice of a divorce lawyer, get your money in your separate bank account, seek any social service advice you can get.

His screaming at you that you're a "c" is abuse. It's not normal and its not acceptable.

He is an idiot and will very much regret this when you're gone.

I apologise in advance because I have not rtft, but from what i have picked up I can confidently say that you have a lot going for you. Much more than him and he knows it. You have the potential to fly high even as a single parent.

You must never forget the awful cruel things he said to you and you probably need to get out of this relationship. The things he said were dredged up from deep inside him - he is probably very jealous of you and you can't have a relationship with a man who has that deep a resentment and hatred. He says he loves you but there is no way that the things he said could be construed as love. He might have stuff going on, but he chose to take it out on you. I suggest there should be zero tolerance for that.

What I read of your posts are very upsetting. His behaviour to you was extremely cruel. You deserve much more.

You asking to talk... basically sounds like you need his permission.
You need to talk, if he doesn't immediately agree & specifically agree to sit down & speak to you once your kids are asleep/out, without insults & throwing around you are crazy, "Im in prison" rant. ( he's not, he's a grown man with children, that no-one forced him to have, & hes being a rubbish father & a failure of a partner )
Then you should tell him your marriage is over & mean it.

I haven’t read anything since my last post yet but we finally have an admittance that he took her number for himself, messaged her on the Saturday and has deleted the messages because he’s ’so ashamed’. He is adamant he hasn’t done anything physically.
I’ve asked him to find them, screenshot them and send them to me.

It ultimately does not matter. You're entrenching yourself in details of his betrayal when you should just be moving away from him and on with your own life.

Wow, after all those lies he is drip feeding you his version of the truth. After calling you all sorts of names. Your gut was so right yesterday @thelab
You must be feeling awful hearing this from him.
I would not engage further. Talk face to face as you will know if he’s lying. A call is a cowards way out from him because he won’t have to look you in the eye.

So he’s on to version number 3 of his story I think!
I suspect he’s going to make this all about him, how much pressure he feels, how it’s all so hard, how you are always negative and on his back, he never gets time for himself, he just let loose this one night, won’t happen again blah blah blah.
Even putting this nonsense to one side, love shows up in actions and how you treat one another in the day to day and in all this he is severely lacking.
You’re so young and have so much ahead of you. Better to be alone than with a partner that pulls you down. You don’t need him and will fly much higher once you’ve got rid of the dead weight.
Be ready for tears from him, pleading and maybe more name calling. Don’t be rushed into anything and as much as you are able remain calm. If you plan to leave, you might want to play your cards close to your chest.
whatever you decide to do, I wish you all the best.

@thelab - reading your thread from the first OP to the end is like watching a car crash. The kind, loved by MN a lot - with people driving by and egging you on - LTB, you deserve better, etc....

In reality - it looks like a marriage that is in trouble - where both of you seem to be behaving out of accumulated resentments and stress.
He is clearly a bit juvenile and, most likely having issues with organisation.
You, on the other hand - probably due to lots of stresses and accumulated tiredness - are expressing it all in a very dramatic way, bordering on getting into "crazy" territory.

It takes two to make or break a relationship. It really does. And in your case - it's the lack of communication, and mutual respect that is hurting your marriage.

You don't like his friends, and the way they socialize. I get it, with small kids you need more help. But, it is not impossible to figure out a way where he (and you too) can have time with friends. And - a partner suggesting that they socialise with friends by "going out for coffee in the middle of the day" - would make most people feel like their partner is being controlling. Most adults socialize in the evening, and having a drink with friends is not something strange.
As to the stag trip.... You keep saying you didn't need to give "permission" - but act as if this is exactly what you should have given. The argument about family holiday - does not hold. You are the person who plans and organises in your family - there is nothing stopping you with booking that holiday.

His issues with organisation - do sound like ADHD. Unfortunately - even if he had a diagnosis - there is very little one can do about it. He is a grown adult, and whatever strategies he has developed to navigate the world - are probably it. Resenting him for having the issues he is having is not helpful - only makes everybody more unhappy, and changes nothing.

That said - my ex-H also had an undiagnosed ADHD. It used to annoy me too, but I remember at some point realising that I couldn't change how he is, and decided to just work with him as he was. (later on, when DC was diagnosed, it became apparent to H also has it.)

As to the whole drama of that night in Benidorm. I am sorry - but both of you sound mental. You, more so. The number added to the phone directory - the staying up in the night tracking statuses on Snapchat, and geolocation... the emailing the random woman... the "i let her know both men are spoken for" - seriously....Jeremy Kyle material. Or, else - a teenage drama.
His reaction was vile, for sure. But in a way - I can see how this all snowballed out of control given the past issues, resentments on both sides, alcohol and your complete meltdown....

Where you go from here is unclear. Most MN by-standers will be having popcorn in their seats and "supporting" you with LTB, your life will be better, etc. But - I think, whatever happens - you two need some sort of counselling. Either individual, or, hopefully, as a couple. As it seems both of you can learn something about relationships - so that this, or your next relationship does not end up in the same place a few years into it...

He sounds like he us 17 an a 3rd child of hers. I'm not sure what thread you've been reading but if you think "it tajes 2 to break a relationship", after disrespectful name calling, your standards are really low!

Just one word DARVO he will turn this around to be your fault & play the victim.* *

Keep pushing. There’s always more than they’re willing to disclose initially.

As predicted, it’s because we hadn’t been having a nice time lately and it was nice to get some attention from someone in a nice way.

He kept pausing, sighing, avoiding things I’d said so I just knew. He’s the worst liar. He told me he had to leave a pub last night feeling sick with anxiety and crying over what he’s done, that was before he’d abused me half the night. I’m sorry but it is bad to get someone’s number when you’re married, but you don’t react like that for just exchanging innocent texts so there’s more to come out I’m certain.

He says he’s deleted the messages as he was so ashamed of just getting her number. I said you don’t just meet someone in passing from sitting near them in a pub who you’ll never see again, to getting their number. He can’t remember specifics as he was drunk. This was the first night they arrived.

I asked about the messages but he says he can’t see how to recover them. He was very vague about what they entailed. Apparently she messaged him first the next day asking if he was hungover and they were talking about the rugby and possibly meeting up for that but he swears he didn’t and swears blind no physical contact occurred.

He kept saying how I’m on a pedestal to him, how much he loves me. I said for a start I wouldn’t be going out tonight if that was true. His first reaction even then, was to say oh well I’ll have to go out and get some food and then I’ll have a bit ‘crack’ with them. I told him absolutely not was that happening but even then, still he thinks it’s okay to behave like that and go out again when he’s shown he can’t be trusted to do that.

I then said the last thing I’d be doing is staying there either, if I was that ashamed, I’d be on the first flight home to sort out my mess. He was adamant for a bit there was no flights, then there was one but it leaves in a few hours so he’d not be able to make that, to now suddenly he’s going to pack and leave now and come home tonight. I think that says a lot too about guilt.

I know a couple of people are saying not to get too bogged down in this, I just want a note so I can see when it changes and just for myself.

Don’t be so stupid, he’s following a script as old as time.

For many people, taking her number and messaging her, would be cheating - whether or not anything physical happened. The intent was there. But add to this his behaviour before the stag do, his distance and lack of communication when he arrived and his vile reaction to you calling him out on his lies, and it paints a picture of someone who was creating the conditions to cheat. Maybe he came to his senses, maybe he didn’t. I doubt you’ll ever find out the truth.

But respect and trust is very very hard to gain back in a relationship.

I’ll never be able to trust him again, I know that much. I just think about our children and how could he not think of them at least.
It’s also the humiliation. Even if I was to stay, not that I want to how I feel, how could I ever be around his friends again knowing they know. I know rationally I haven’t done anything wrong, but it’s that stigma of it. The wedding was supposed to be at the end of the month, glad I haven’t bought a bloody outfit yet. Sorry, just trying to find some tiny silver lining/bit of humour in all of this.

Basically he has had eyes for someone else (minimum). He has been abusive and has no respect for you.

But now he is coming home and so he cannot be arsed to deal with the fall out so he is sweetening you up for a soft landing when he gets home.

You can recover Whatsapp messages through his back up, he can uninstall the reinstal, tap restore, verify his identity if it asks (it dont always ) and all messages should come back from when the last back up was done or he can use Stellar data recovery app to scan his phone for the whatsapp data, select the catagories you want to recover and then click recover. If he deleted it totally he'd have to do it from his phone and his back up.

The most important thing now is to stay strong and not be swayed by tears and declarations of undying love.