AIBU to think that most relationships will end with an OVERLAP with a new relationship.

[morningpaper]

I don't get this thing on MN whereby married people are expected to end marriages before embarking on other relationships.

This idea of people (except you always mean 'woman' ) being "slappers" if they enter relationships with married people makes me think lots of you have very little understanding of how relationships work.

• To be blunt, I would be FAR more upset if DH left me for a lonely life as a single person in a bedsit than for a new relationship. I think the former is FAR more insulting. I have a close friend whose husband did this and it was MORTIFYING every time people said "Oh darlng, was there someone else?" and she had to say "No" (unspoken message: 'I am just too horrific to live with').

• People need support when they end relationships - and that support often comes from a new relationship.

• If people ended every marriage at the first sniff of new romance, or at the first feelings of dissatisfaction, then none of our relationships would last more than a year or two! It is often a new relationship that gives people the impetus to re-evaluate their lives.

• Most relationships become very "stale" after a certain amount of time - society tells us we must WORK at our relationships after the desire has gone, but WHY? Why not just accept that our partners or ourselves might be MORE happy in a new relationships - we have changed and grown, after all.

I have several friends in relationships with married people - and I expect a lot of you do, too, but they probably don't tell you because you are so HORRIFIED at the idea. Such relationships generally end in a lot of DESPAIR but they are part of life.

When you talk about "ending relationships before starting new ones" it sounds to me just like people who talk about not having sex before marriage - a great ideal (perhaps), but not realistic for 99% of people.

BTW, at the 'just say no campaign'. Can imagine all the ladies of MN swaying about in unison on top of the pops next week.

My new word for an affair is officially an 'overlap'. Well coined, Oif,oif.

God I am agreeing a bit with everyone I think - which is an absoloute first.

If DH or I are unfaithful it is the fault of our choices - not the responsibility of a 'slapper' of either sex. We choose to be faithful and no amount of encouragement has ever persuaded me to forget my marriage. Neither have the young girls at Dhs work - many of whom would see him as excellent partner material ( I know as a couple told me before they realised I was his wife . That was a fun conversation

I actually believe that DH and I are meant to be together. Always have done - it was a weird instant thing and we have been together more than 20 years so ...so far I seem to be right. Dh felt the same - again almost instantly. And we have stayed committed through all the difficulities that most marraiges experience. we are probably as happy,( if not happier) now as we have ever been.
But I think people think about wedding when they talk about marraige. The whole happy ever after thing negates the reality of how committed you have to be the make a marriage something fabulous for both of you ( and the children).
I guess I do get a bit tired of the presentation of a long term marriage /partnership as something old and comfortable when it can remain wonderful and romantic and sexy. But i also get tired of the notion that changing partners is just one of those things and no ones 'fault'. You choose to be in a relationship and once you make that choice you should committ to it or leave. And the 'affair just happened' thing is bollox of course . You always choose to have sex with other people - unless possibly you trip and land awkwardly.

Blast from the past - I love Cynthia Heimel
Also agree with OrmIrian, you have to be a realist about the nature of long-term relationships, and both be inclined to take the long view

littlelapin. I wonder if they do that in a poster? lol.

Idefixx: Well, no I won't. Because I don't engage in couple relationships at all and have no intention of ever doing so. I have plenty of friends I like and see fairly regularly (and some of whom I might have sex with sometimes) but the idea of having a regular partner does not appeal to me in the least: I like my own company and couldn't bear the hassle of having to feed some bloke's ego and pay him attention when I just wanted to read or sleep or MN.

Have namechanged.

Three years ago I had what I guess would be described as an emotional affair with someone I met over the internet. I didn?t go looking for it, I never planned for it to happen, in fact I have always thought people who have affairs to be weak, gutless individuals who have no morals. But of course I was not like that, it could never happen to me. Except it did.

I was a sahm with a 2 year old. It was quite a lonely existence as my dh works long hours. I have never been any good at making friends and didn?t really have any friends in rl. (I?m not using that as a reason to excuse what I did, just trying to give a bit of background).

So I started chatting online, on a community type site. And before I realized it I had made lots of friends. Obviously not friends in the rl sense of the word as this was online but suddenly I was being recognized, people talked to me, included me in conversations and valued my opinions and that had never happened to me before. So I started going on there more and more.

Then I started talking to a guy who I had encountered on their discussion forum. It was just platonic chat really, he didn?t even live in the same country. We chatted about everything really. He told me about his ex, and the things they had been through etc, we talked about general things, he seemed a lot more intelligent than some of the people on the same site which was why I chatted to him. It was harmless chat, I wasn?t interested in him as I was married to dh and I certainly didn?t imagine he was interested in me as he had just come out of a long-term relationship (or so he said).

But as time went on we started chatting more and more. If I logged on he would make a point of talking to me if he was around, we started exchanging emails and eventually telephone numbers, although we only actually spoke in person once. And before too long the chat became a lot less platonic and became more emotional, with him telling me what a nice person he thought I was, how much he valued my friendship and liked talking to me etc. I started to look forward to chatting to him. I was flattered by the attention he gave me, and as we were countries apart I knew it was never going to be anything more.

But as time went on I began to realize that what I had become involved in was something more than just an online friendship, and that I had actually become more emotionally involved with this guy than was appropriate. So I planned to end it all and walk away. But every time I spoke to him he would tell me how much he?d missed talking to me, how much he wanted to talk to me and I just kept getting drawn back in.

Anyway things came to a head and I called it quits and told him it was over. But in order to do that I had to walk away from the whole site, and that meant walking away from all the other friends I had made. I was back to being friendless again. No-one cared about my opinions any more, I was back to just being a sahm with a two year old and nothing more.

I know it wasn?t an affair in the general sense of the word, but what I did was still wrong, and it didn?t hurt my dh any less when he found out (and he did find out). If this had been rl I?m not sure whether I would have allowed myself to have got pulled in so easily, but it being the internet I do think that it?s a lot easier to fall for the words, because in reality they are only words, and to then get drawn in on a deeper level before you actually realize what?s going on. Words are very powerful.

Just to add, I married for life. I hated myself for what I did, I still hate myself for what I did, and for the hurt I caused my dh.

I know that I am probably going to be shot down now. I make no excuses for what I did. I know it was wrong and if I could have turned back the clock I would. I have pretty much no friends again because of what I did. I daren?t talk to anyone male again for fear that my dh will think I am going to do the same again, even though I never intend to go there ever again. And I know I deserve all I get and probably more.

But sometimes these things do happen, and sometimes although walking away should be the right thing to do, sometimes we lose sight of the right thing.

Yes a husband is in the wrong if he cheats on his wife but you cannot put all of the blame on to him once you know he has a wife. I have been given the "I have an open marrriage" "my wife doesnt understand me" line a dozen times when I was younger. If I was in a real man drought I may have thought twice about it but I always came to the conclusion that If a man could behave like that he wasnt the man for me and quite frankly I was too good for him.

Even if I didnt know his wife I would never knowingly hurt (or be party to hurting) someone else. Maybe I missed a "great shag" maybe a relationship would have turned into the love of my life but you know I feel good for having taken the higher ground and waiting for someone single.

I think given the right set of circumstances anyone could cheat, most of us want to at some time but some of us stand back and look at the bigger picture and think "hell its not worth it, im not going there" and some just behave like dogs on heat and go for it (with as much thought)

I really cant understand people who have to go from one relationship straight into another, if you know you are unhappy fgs just end it, or are you that insecure you have to have an admirer to constantly massage your self esteem. Why commit at all just have some nice friends with benefits?

As fuzzywuzzy said her husbands infidelity has led to her having to have tests for STIs in many cases wives and children lose their homes that they have spent years building up. But if you are not sensitive enough to care that in doing so you will hurt his wife then why are you so sensitive that being called a slapper bothers you?

at 'trip and land awkwardly'. Made I laugh!

littlewoman - when I say piss off, it is meant in a nice way , I am not being mean

my children play at geting married, they put outfits on and line their dolls up as the guests, what would you lot do, would you get them playing mistress and He Will Do For This Month?

I am a romantic and do think my marriage will last [tempts fate]

you lot have dragged me from my intray, if I get the sack, I will blame you all

Itcouldhappen, brave statement. I think you were very strong. No need to run away.

"I sometimes feel weird on MN because I really do expect my marriage to last "until death us do part"."

So do I rabbit, thats why I'm not married - haven't met anyone I could imagine being with for the rest of my life.

My parents divorced - it was painful and involved a lot of people and 10 years on still affects the family. Of course it happens but I wouldn't want it for myself or my DS. I think it would be better for DS to have a live-in caring father than just me but equally I think it's better for him to have just me than me and the screwed pile of emotional baggage kind of relationship I have with my father as a result of his behaviour around the divorce.

On reflection I'm not sure any of that is relevant...

ICHTA: How very sad. How very sad that despite never having met the other person let alone snogged him or had sex with him, you were compelled to cut off all your other friendships. It's stories like that that always make me exasperated with this idea that monogamy is somehow better than other ways of living: if a way of life has to be so brutally enforced and so hysterically protected ('You can't speak to anyone else!' You can't leave the house in case you THINKABOUTHAVINGSEXWITHSOMEONE! ALl your commmunications are going to be monitored and discussed and analyzed time and time again) then it's not worth having in the first place.

Yes, sure, plenty of people do find monogamous relationships suit them. It's more to do with luck than anything else: you find a person with a similar level of monogamousness to yourself who is also appealing to you in other ways, at a time in your life when you are inclined towards domesticity and probably parenthood, and good luck to you. But if it doesn;t particularly appeal to you, don't waste your time (or anyone else's for that matter) pursuing it.

But you see Madamz you have made the "right" decision, I just dont understand this whole I have to jump from one relationship to another mentality fgs be on your own, trust me if you want a shag you can always find one

Itcould - the point is everyone makes mistakes, you have admitted yours and regret the hurt you caused I just cant understand this total disregard for the feelings of people you at one time cared about. Even if I decided tomorrow that DH was not for me....I would never in a million years want to cause him unnecessary hurt.

If he moved out into a bedsit because I didnt make him happy, why would that be a worse reflection on me than leaving for someone else. If he was unhappy and he left I would respect him for jumping into the dark without a safty net far more than for making sure he had the nearest available mattress/slapper handy to cushion the fall

I agree. But have to say of course madamez not all monogamous relationships are 'enforced' or prohibitive. I trust Dh so he can go where he likes and do as he likes. I trust HIM not his enviroment. And he can trust me.
Hence his 40th bithday in Vegas with six friends . If you can trust a bloke in Las Vegas....

No, Oliveoil, my children have mostly been brought up already rightly or wrongly (probably wrongly!) I don't have much left to do as my youngest is 9.

I was just thinking about it out loud, purely in theory, about what we might have to start doing instead. It seems like a pretty horrible alternative, but that's because I was brought up to believe in love and marriage.

If you happen to believe in families staying together, and I do, I think OrmIrian has told it fairly much like it is.
The 'naturally occuring, everlasting love' myth needs to be replaced by the 'hard work, but keep at it' myth.

I went throguh a phase in my late 20's of only ever being propositioned by married men. Was paranoid I might have a sticker on my back declaring I was "up for it"

oh I agree it can be hard work at times, absolutely, I could strangle him sometimes

but mainly it is great

If someone who propositions you tells you that they have an open relationship, you do have to contend with the possiblity that they are telling the truth, you know. Open relationships exist.
Having said that, if you don't want to sleep with someone, their relationship status is none of your concern, is it?

I think open relationships are icky

and imo, one person is more up for it than the other

I did choose to stay in an involvement for 10 years where he told me at the start he didnt like committment. I knew not to get emotionally involved and and I admired him massively for his honesty. Had he been someone who felt the need to cheat behind my back he wouldnt have lasted a month. I guess its just about self respect - how you feel you should be treated and how you feel comfortable with treating other people.

I imagine open relationships are less common than people claiming they are in them in order to get a shag.

(I don't have any hard statistical evidence to back this up. But that never usually stops anyone on here, so I reckoned I'd get away with it. )

Oliveoil, you are of course entitled to your opinion. But other people are equally entitled not to give a toss about it.

no need to be so rude