I am about to go crazy with my husbands family, and being gaslit by them all. Please tell me I am not crazy!

[meliisawalker29]

OK Situation 1

Me and fiancé (soon to be husband) planned weekend away wine tasting for our wedding. Was planned for 4 months and the only weekend the wedding venue could do. We get a text from brother saying that we shouldn't be going as its dads 50th birthday. We already had a plan to take dad out for dinner, and he was happy with that. at this point no plans or parties for dads bday. I reply and say well this is the weekend we needed to go, and that there aren't any plans for birthday. proceeds to tell me now that my fiance shouldn't be going, and there aren't any plans yet because he has been busy. 4 days later, he texts my fiancé with a miraculous plan for the dad, over the weekend we are going to the wedding venue. Fiance replies we cannot go, and why did you make the plan knowing we are not going to be here. whilst we are on our trip, brother delivers some bad news to my fiance whilst we are at dinner, and ruins our evening.

Situation 2
Last year family member died over my birthday. He was a doctor. Sad situation. I done everything I could to support, attended funeral, paid for therapy for my fiance, held his hand and supported him during the entire process. for the past year, there have been 'events', 'fund raisers', 'community events', 'sports games' honouring the family member. Really special and fiance and me where possible have attended every one. We lost money as we had a holiday booked over my birthday, but not important, and i have not once mentioned anything to do with that, and showed up for my partner. My parent was also in the hospital, very stressful time.
this year, we have planned a weekend away for my birthday. MIL contacts fiance months ago, saying its doctors week in XYZ city, and that all the family are going. Fiance says we cannot go as its birthday weekend, already have plans, and last birthday was very sad we don't want this one to be similar. MIL does not really accept no for answer, asks him to reconsider. Was consistently asking him everytime she saw him. Few days later, texts again asking, he sticks by his guns says no. We go over for dinner, asks me this time, i say probably not and she says its a week long celebration, can we go before my bday, i say ill take a look. Next morning, after not even 24 hours so we haven't dicussed it yet, asks my fiance on the phone. He tells me. This time i text her saying probably not going sorry, feel free to send details but not going to make it. She says no problem whatever is best for me and my fiance? Then 10 minutes later i get a text from the brother, saying "question" i say "yes..." he says are we definitely out of going XYZ, its a once in a lifetime oppourtunity and thinks we should go, i reply and say on this occasion no after last year, thank you for the invite but not going to make it. He then proceeds to change the subject and say my fiance will be angry if he knows he text me.

My fiance at this point is overwhelmed, stressed, and clearly feeling pressure from his family. We end up arguing. He calls older brother who lives in different country for advice, who says we should go for the days we can and then proceed to go onto my birthday weekend after. Fiance then texts me saying "we are going and this is not up for discussion" after that, WW3 breaks out and have a huge argument, as quite obviously i am feeling ambushed and misunderstood/disrespected by this entire family, now including my fiance.

I am at a cross roads, my fiance is now kind of blaming me, saying yes his mum shouldn't of been going on, but saying i have a problem with the brother and mum? (of course i do after their treatment of me) and he wants to get us all in a room together (no). I do not feel ready to see them or want too they cause me nothing but arguments in my relationship, and i think are so used to my fiancé doing and being at every event, they do not like that he is not there. bare in mind, these women are nice to the uncles wife, but are horrible about her behind her back and are very false, so i have witnessed first hand two faced behaviour. My fiance has previously called his mum out for bad behaviour, and she cried for weeks, trying to make him feel guilty (he agrees on this) and trying to make him feel bad for going against her when she was being mean to another lady infront of us.

What do I do? My fiance can't cope with being in the middle and wants us to resolve it, and the more i keep going on for him to see my feelings, he gets annoyed and i look like the one with the problem. he is saying i am now being stubborn and spiteful (??!!) that i wont go to XYZ and go to my bday weekend after, maybe i am being difficult, maybe i should go, but i cant forgive the issues they cause in my engagement so far.

Gosh I felt anxiety just reading that.

Think very carefully about marrying into such a manipulative, over invested family and to a man who has to ask his older brother for advice on what to do - and then tries to bully you into doing what said brother has advised. It seems the apple hasn’t fallen far from the tree(s)

I cannot imagine any situation in my family where I’d be bullied and harassed into attending a non-event for a distant family members death anniversary.

I once had to miss an uncles funeral whom I was very fond of as we had a non regunyholiday booked. My aunt’s response? “Don’t you dare cancel - uncle wouldn’t have wanted that”

That is a sane person’s response.

*non-refundable

@ruethewhirl of course a 21st is more important - it's a key milestone birthday that happens once in your life. An anniversary (of dating?) is no way a bigger thing.

I couldn’t agree with you more. We are expected to be sacrificial. Absolutely not!

Different people have different priorities. These things are not universal truths.

He expects you to appease his family and go for three days to the Doctors week even though you had both agreed this year you didn’t want your birthday overshadowed. He was manipulated by his family guilt tripping him and now he has been forced to go he is trying to force you to accompany him or speak to his family to explain yourself.
That is the rules of your H2b and his family you are marrying into, you’re already putting his family before your own but to really fit in you have to give up any thoughts or feelings of your own and obediently go along with their wishes. If you don’t they will cause so much trouble it will force a wedge between the pair of you and will split you up. You can’t change your H2b nor his family but you can see the dynamics in place before you get married. My advice to you is to refuse to go, say to him you go and I will meet you for my birthday weekend, don’t make a fuss and watch him squirm whilst he tries to coerce you into going (exactly like his family did to him) stand your ground and see how moody he is towards you (this will be how he is after your married when his family can’t get their own way) meet him for your birthday as planned and if he is an arse then you know what married life will be like with him when the matriarch hasn’t been obeyed. You can then decide if that’s what you want for your future, a moody stressed H when you don’t step in line to keep his family happy.

Put yourself in your H2b’s shoes, he has learnt to pick his battles, it’s easier for his MH to go with the flow with his families coercion. He views this as normal family life, he expects you to follow their rules because if you don’t it causes so much trouble for him, he will be a piggy in the middle of you all, always hurting one side. They will never accept any boundaries you both put in place and if he insists they do he will lose them eventually. They will never change and nor will he but you are trying to get him to see how his actions are impacting you in vain. He won’t ever acknowledge it fully (he may see it at times but will dismiss it) as it goes against everything he learnt growing up. You will keep trying to reason with him, cry at the injustice and eventually get angry and that’s how your marriage will be in a nutshell, you can’t teach an orange to be an apple.

I think id be so fucked off with it all, that it would ruin my birthday celebrations anyway at this point.
Whoever said about constant testing for loyalties , i think was spot on.
I think it sounds exhausting.
Id take this as a massive parade of red flags. I wouldn't marry into this family for all the tea in china.

I would actually tell him to stay with his family for the full week and you'll find someone else to go with you for your birthday celebration week.

Depending on his response to this, I'd do one of the following.

1. If he decides to blow off his family and say that he'll go with you for the full week (thereby showing you rather than it being just words) you may, just may have a chance or
2. If he decides to say Ok, find someone else to to with you - then you know he will never put you before his family and you need to end it. I'd even be of the position that I think he may want you to end it as at least then he only has to deal with one woman pulling on his time - his mother!

This. No one is actually doing anything wrong. They are communicating with their son/ brother. You are making him in the middle with your inflexibility.
Way too much drama. Just let your fiance deal with them

@meliisawalker29 he's still going on your birthday weekend, so I can't see the problem? He's not prioritising them.
The problem is his family want their way every time.
I think you're making a mistake marrying into this family.

@SpryCat @LookItsMeAgain i did refuse to go and said that as long as he is back for the day before my bday at a reasonable time, he can go and do whatever he wants. He felt pressure to go to the event which was the night before my birthday, and was suggesting if he went to that event (the night before my bday) he wanted to drive home at midnight after the event (6 hour drive) and then pick me up and go straight to the location for my bday weekend (another 10 hours of driving?). we spoke and i asked if he will even feel like celebrating after a remembrance event (kind of different moods?) he has said he isnt going to go anymore and to leave it at that..

Does he really need to drive 4hours back to pick you up? Can't you get a train or bus to somewhere closer and then you take it from there?

All this tying in knots analysing behaviour and the logistics:

The simple fact is that “No” is a complete sentence. If your dh told his family that it doesn’t suit as you have plans for your birthday it should be left at that. It’s unbelievably rude and overbearing of them to manipulate the situation and guilt trip until they get the response they want. They continue to nag and cajole and ask about it as they are used to having your dh cave and do what they want.

Thats his problem and his decision to put boundaries in place. The fact that he tries to put the blame on you and tell you what he says is law is a massive red flag that you’d do well to heed before you marry.

If he tries this shit again you need to be very firm in your stance that it’s up to him to deal with his family and that you won’t fall in line to ridiculous demands from him or his family.

Its really abnormal behaviour and the whole thing is utterly ridiculous- they sound like the types who love to wallow and virtue signal at every available opportunity and expect others to behave according to their rules or you’ll be cast out. Toxic.

I am still urging you to rethink this marriage @meliisawalker29

i whole heartedly agree with you, but what do i say to him when he responds "they just wanted us to go, they just wanted the family to be together" he definitely sees both sides, and they most definitely are the family you describe. as someone else mentioned, my sane family would have said something along the lines of "no you have had enough sadness in your life, go and celebrate your wife to bes birthday after the horrendous year last year" or something similar. its about showing face, its about photos, its about image to them, not the fact my h2b is ready to get married and finally have some happiness (independent of them) in his life. He still wants me to talk to his family about it, as he says i am the one with the issue with their behaviour, he says they can try to change his mind or this and that, but he said no one will ever change his mind or get to him. hmmm @GeorgeMichaelsCat @Michellesbackbrace @TheBroonOneAndTheWhiteOne @AcrossthePond55

You tell him they have to accept your no and you wont be summoned in front of his mum like she is your headmaster. You have to draw a line in the sand and tell him they are the ones who has the issue accepting your answer.

He still wants me to talk to his family about it, as he says i am the one with the issue with their behaviour

This is the problem though - he’s talking out of both sides of his face.

Hes too chicken or enmeshed or whatever to tell them to back off and that their behaviour is out of order and is putting the onus on you to speak up. He’s using you as a human shield.

Either he thinks they’re out of order for pushing the issue and should tell them so or he doesn’t think their behaviour is out of order and is perfectly happy for it to continue in which case you have a massive problem that is going to continue throughout your marriage.

As pp’s have pointed out - can you imagine what it’s going to be like if you have dc’s?

@meliisawalker29

"but what do i say to him when he responds "they just wanted us to go, they just wanted the family to be together" he definitely sees both sides, and they most definitely are the family you describe"

Well, he may be 'seeing both sides', but he's not understanding that you, his wife, take precedence over his family unless it is a dire emergency or crisis. Is there a cultural influence here? In both the Christian and Jewish faith one's wife takes precedence, both in the Bible and in the Torah, but it appears that in Islam, a man's mother comes first (except in matters of spending).

So are you fighting a cultural battle, or just a 'family influences' one? That is a key factor in how and whether or not this is a battle you can win. But IMHO, either way, it's not.

And there is no reason for you to talk to his family and he's wrong to ask that. He either wants you to fight his battles for him or he wants them to 'beat you into submission' (not literally of course). I'd say more likely the latter. He knows they won't change so he's hoping you'll shut up and 'go with the program'.

Again I'll ask you. Is this really the way you want to live the next 20/30/40 years of your life, every step a battle with his family? Is this what you want your children to learn and believe is normal, that women should shut up and do what they're told by their iLs? You aren't married to him yet. I think you need to think this whole thing over very carefully.

I love how as your the one with the issue you have to go before his mum and explain yourself, that’s just fucking ridiculous, you’re not a little girl and you have the right to say NO. He’s now saying he won’t go so his family will be more upset and be gunning for you, that’s not supporting you, he’s put you in the cross fire, holding his hands up so he doesn’t get the blame! When all he had to do was say No means No! Not sulkily say he won’t go now as you won’t go, who in their right mind would coerce someone to stay on the night before a celebration so they had a 16 hour travel afterwards for a birthday celebration? Someone who wants him too tired for your birthday that’s who!

How do you think being married to him
is going to pan out given how he is already with his dysfunctional family ?. Marriage is not going to change him for the better here.

You will be foolish indeed to marry into his family because your fiancée is and will remain.a wet lettuce when it comes to them. They will always come first, he is mired in fear obligation and guilt.

He has been led to believe by his family, and by his mother in particular, into believing Bad Things will happen if he upsets his mother or them in any way. He seeks their approval even now, approval they will never give him.
His inertia when it comes to them hurts him as much as you. This man needs therapy.

It sounds like he is firmly on your side when you have firm plans (like the wine tasting weekend and your birthday trip) but when they offer an alternative solution like coming on the trip for the part week before your birthday for example, he feels powerless to say no, as in his mind there is obviously no logistical reason why he can't do that, except you obviously don't want to and he can't come up with a good enough excuse to get out of it on those grounds alone, he wants to go, so he feels like you are backing him in to a awkward corner by refusing for you both, he can't say no to them without telling them the real reason you don't want to go (because you don't like them), so he has no choice but to go alone and try to keep everyone happy.

Basically what I am trying to say is, it is okay to not want to spend time with them, but you are using your pre-existing plans as a convenient excuse, which is always great to solve one problem, but when they then offer an alternative solution which doesn't interfere with your plans.. you are still saying absolutely not you don't want to.. which is putting your fiance in a very awkward position.

I think refusing to spend time with your OH family without a good excuse is always going to cause issues, and it won't go away when you are married, he obviously has a massive sense of familial obligation, which will always cause problems between you as a couple unless you are prepared to suck it up for his sake.

@sandyhappypeople i get you, but the thing is, all our plans are made first. Then they come up with these plans eg planning a party and the doctors week once we have already established a plan. Whilst writing this, I have kinda realised what you said, that is no logical reason not to go, just to cause trouble so maybe that’s why they do it. Put it this way c if you said no, how would you feel if someone then text your husband expecting him to say a different answer?

@AcrossthePond55 hes catholic and has told me he agrees wives should come before family.. In regards to speaking to the family, he sees it as he’s caught in the middle so he wants me to tell them how I feel? Kinda? I dunno. I don’t have any plans to see them any time soon. I know he has asked them not to text me certain stuff too and they clearly do not listen.

He's put himself in the middle

If he was prioritising your relationship like he should then there is no debate

"Sorry mum, meliisa cancelled her birthday last year to support me and the family, so this year we are going away"

They nag and cajole and bully because it works. His family are abusive and controlling. I wouldn't want to join a family like that I'll be honest.