December 2024 - but we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

New thread

This was my whole life, my childhood and my marriage. Now it’s part of my current relationship. Fucking had enough of them, they are everywhere I turn it feels. Sick of having people around who can’t control themselves and think about how they make others feel. I was definitely primmed for these relationships but I’ve definitely reached a point I’ve had enough. It’s so weird when you realise that you actually have some lovely little relationships in between all of this. We’ve had a few family members visit over the days and it’s effortless, we’ve sat, the kids have run riot and no one is on edge. That’s been a real eye opener. I can really feel the difference.

When my niece was born I thought my mother had changed and had become a normal person. Then when my niece was two or three and knew to say no or what she liked or didn't like the scapegoating, manipulation etc slowly started. In hindsight I think there was a process of grooming, like slowly getting her used to the behaviour. My hideous mother also had the habit of reporting back to her parents at the end of a babysitting day.

Youd think it is good practice but I'm convinced it was a way for her to get in there first and say what a wonderful grandmother she was (we did x and then I gave her y to eat etc) and also report on any apparently awful behaviour of my niece.

Her dad knows no different. He's the GC, so no more than an instrument and he doesn't even know it. He's now an enabler too. So no, they don't leave because the bullying can be subtle, it comes in intervals with some good deeds sprinkled on top to cause confusion and guilt.

So was your mum scapegoating the DIL? Did she scapegoat your niece?

@Happyfarm I think both. She gossips about her DiL behind her back and behind my brother's back. Apparently my brother deserves better, the fact that their home is cluttered is the DiL fault and she resents DiL for not doing the cooking.

No idea what she thinks her sons faults are.

My understanding is that the GC is considered not to have fault, being a clone of the narc, and is made to work extremely hard to live up to that. Faults are not an option. The GC has to live within a very rigid set off rules/acceptable behaviours

@CheekySnake yes I'm aware of that. As a result my brother has no backbone. He's diligent and a yes-man.

The only complaint I ever heard about him by my mother is that he doesn't go to annual dental check ups lol. But even that was triangulation as she pointed out how good it is I go and how annoyed she is that he doesn't. We were in our 30s when this was brought up.

With his wife he married a version of his mother but nobody can see it. Always loosing it at the child and husband, dominance by shouting and putdowns etc. The only difference is that my SiL is definitely not a narcissist.

My mother doesn't like her DiL and DiL would never go around to her MiL for a cuppa outside family occasions. Even if she collects child from babysitting she doesn't go in. My mother hates it, complains she never wants to stay etc , is trying to offer coffee, food etc to come in but she declines.

That's the thing with them. They hate people and then still complain when these people don't want to be near them.

This is exactly the msg I received the other day when I said that to MIL. She responded that she has an open door policy and all are welcome in her house. She is delusional. You can’t act like a school girl bully and then expect me to take up that offer. Yeah the door is open by but I won’t be welcome when I step through it. I’ve come to realise that they literally are delusional. The gifts and the nice comments on social media are all to save face to herself and those in her world. The gift is to prove to herself that she is the better person. She won’t speak a nice word face to face. I wonder if they are really that aware that they are weird or whether it’s just a consequence that they ruin relationships that they can’t control or that make them feel a little insecure? I suppose those relationships are of no use. I’m like your SIL, I try to avoid going in as much as possible. It’s a shame as it would be nice to have someone to pop into and have a tea and chat.

@Happyfarm that's exactly my experience. Obviously my mother isn't interested in my SiL (or anyone) as a person. She loves gossip, so my mother would just want to know what SiLs family are up to, what's new etc. Basically gathering intel. I'm sure there are other purposes my SiL would serve too, but that's the thing. Everything serves a purpose.

My parents feel superior to my SiLs parents. They have said things like my niece is so lucky to be able to spend a lot of time with them as opposed to my SiL family. To me this is bizarre. Both families have significant shortcomings and emotional abuse is rife. Everyone is completely shut off from themselves. I don't think either of them are the better option.

My mother is very competitive in that way. She wants to be the better set of grandparents.

@Twatalert Ive pretty much come to that conclusion now and beginning to drop the rope with them. They aren’t looking for relationships, well conventional ones. They want to know everything about everyone superficially. They will never have a relationship based on connection and love. They will never support my little family and want it to grow and be happy. One thing I’ve learned from this is that when my children are older and in relationships you push them away when you don’t invest in their choice of partner.

@Happyfarm yes, absolutely. There is no true connection and no depth to the relationship.

It was a devastating and yet bizzare realisation that there is no way my mother loved me. I don't love my parents either. So much went wrong from day 1 that love never evolved.

@Twatalert that is really sad and I’m sorry. I know my dad loved me. My mum I think she did but she was also very damaged and she lacked control of herself, she was and is not self aware and very paper thin deep. I learned to control myself in order to control her (or so I thought). In reality I had no control it was just damage control. It has severely damaged our connection to a point that it will never develop. I love her to a point but she is not a safe emotional person and she hardly knows the real me. Nobody does. This new family work on a dynamic I do not like. Love and entrance into the fold depends on the say of the mum and is earned. I have definitely got caught up in it all but I think the mask has slipped off entirely now. I think that they got too cocky and behaved too obvious and I don’t like it. I love from the beginning and always go into things with honesty and the best intentions until I am proved differently and this has proved it to me. I am really sad. It is my own fault for wanting something that I’ve never had and from the outside it looks so good but it’s poison inside.

All of this is so sad to read, yet makes me feel so much less alone. I’ve almost forced my to kids to have a relationship with my DH mother “ as she their DGM” . It wasn’t until they grew up and saw her ways for themselves that they said no more, and now refuse to see her, that shit really hit the fan……

Anyway Christmas Day, as predicted mil shows up only any hr and a half late! ( so better than usual!) . But the reason she’s late is that she’s apparently left all our presents on a bus!! 1. She’s never bought us presents before/ as it’s too difficult/she’s too busy/ she’s a poor pensioner etc….
2.She’s honestly never caught a bus in her life!

So as I promised myself, I portioned out her meal and left it sitting at her place.
We had all just finished pudding and were tidying up when she arrived…..
Myself and kids went to living room with drinks and chocolates and left my DH with her…… Five minutes later he came through, granny’s gone home. Taken her dinner and presents with her.

I feel absolutely awful, the rest of my family think it’s a fabulous win.

@littlemissprosseco I think the most hardest thing to accept is that they really don’t care about us. They don’t have the same feelings as we do. Mine are always late without fail. I’ve found it difficult but we really have to stop caring. They aren’t sat at home pondering over what they have done and how they have made us feel. They haven’t given any of us a second thought. It’s goes against all human instincts but I’m not too sure they have much left. Sorry it’s crap.

@Happyfarm for me love is black and white. Its either there or it isn't. For me it cant be there 'to a degree'. Not every minute of my childhood was awful, but the 'good times' were part of a cycle, as I know now, so it can't have been love. I certainly didn't feel loved. I felt many things. But not loved. I used to think it's in my power to avoid things becoming awful again and I thought it's all my fault. Obviously none of it was. In the end I was always on egg shells because I was hoping to keep the peace. How is that love.

@littlemissprosseco absolutely brilliant, well done! Hopefully in time you can feel proud of yourself. All you did was enforce a boundary. You did nothing terrible.

@littlemissprosseco can you pin down why you feel awful exactly? What is the awful? guilt/sadness/anger/disappointment/the inevitable dip as the adrenaline wears off?

The good times I’ve come to realise are just my projections onto events, it was my love and my heart and my connection. I made my marriage look real. It just sadly doesn’t work one sided and eventually you see it for what it is, abuse like you say. It’s soul destroying but in a way it gives us the power back because we are the real people with real emotions and feelings. My ex will never be real, he will always need to be seen reflected off of others. I hold that close, I’m a whole rounded person, as we all are on here.

@CheekySnake
I think it’s because I really want things to be different. I want her enjoying Christmas round the table with us, not alone…..

Shes already sent the very polite email saying the food didn’t reheat well she had to throw it away, so she went hungry, most of the presents weren’t to her liking and could she please have the receipts.
And done forget we are her lift to and from an event on New Years Eve!

I guess I just wish it was different

@littlemissprosseco it's neither your responsibility or in your power to make her enjoy Christmas. You can include her and be welcoming, as you have been, but everything else is just being a doormat.

She does seem to need this drama, which means she will continue to create it until the cows come home. Either with you or someone else. This isn't about you, but there is something she triggers (guilt?) and so both are dancing the tango. You are allowed to meet your own needs.

You probably know this, but you need to let that go. It's never going to happen.

@littlemissprosseco I read a book this week by someone called melody beattie (Ive mentioned it a couple of times) about being codependent - it's about trying to push kindness onto someone who doesn't want it and how we can try and force these people into normality and tell ourselves we're doing the right thing but we're not, for them or for ourselves. I recommend it.

Btw that's not a polite email. It's a rude email.

A polite email would have said thank you and nothing else. You didn't need to know that the meal didn't reheat or that she threw it away. What was the point of telling you that?

What was the point of telling you now that she didn't like the presents when you can't change them?

I know, I’m slowly coming to that realisation.
But I’m obviously really thick as it’s take 30 years!

That’s a shockingly rude email she sent you Prosecco, it truly is.

Your boundaries here are truly sub level when it comes to your mother in law. Why do you think this is?.

You are also part of the problem though in that you persist with this quaint and frankly naive notion that you do not want her to be alone at Christmas. She’s playing you like a fiddle.