Mum is ‘so looking forward to being a granny’ - but I need to seriously manage her expectations

[howtomum123]

Hi everyone,

I’ve been having counselling about my childhood from 2014, but pretty solidly from 2018 to the present (with the same therapist since then). From this, I’ve been unpicking that my mum was/is emotionally immature, insecure, self-centred, expects us all to put her needs, wants and emotions first, even when we were tiny children.

She lives about an hour away with my dad, and I live with DH, 10 minutes from his parents.

I’m 31 now and pregnant with DC1 and due any day now. She has made awful comments to me over the years, including around a MMC I had at the end of last year (repeated incessant phone calls when I’d said I wasn’t ready to talk; wanting to know about the scans prior to surgical management and saying ‘so it had died then’).

Back when I went to uni, it was that my then-boyfriend would ‘meet someone else and forget all about me’; conversely, she’d phone me every single day at the exact same time demanding to know who I was with and what I was doing, and she wanted a copy of my timetable and to put a tracking app on my ipad

She seems to genuinely expect access to my personal/medical information, e.g. when my midwife appointments are, what jabs I’ve had, and when I don’t want to share information with her, or if she happens to find something minor out from a family member, she absolutely hits the roof. The problem is that when we were growing up and we wanted to have these conversations with her about our health and choices, she would react furiously to us talking about contraception, and just neglected to tell us anything about periods or puberty at all.

She has lied about me to family members, telling them that we hadn’t told them when our scan would be (even though DH had), and also told me that she would come and ‘hijack’ my baby from nursery, which I actually spoke to the police about, on the advice of my midwife.

My problem is managing her expectations as I get closer to having my baby. Everything in my brain and body is screaming at me that I do not want her near us. There is a note on my hospital records saying that she is not to be allowed in or given any information about us.

She seems to think she was a wonderful mum (and that I’m an abnormal daughter/our bad relationship is my fault), and my dad has said that she is ‘so looking forward to being a granny’. He constantly constantly throws us under the bus - we’re ‘too sensitive’, she ‘doesn’t do emotions’, it’s just how she is etc etc, for the last 30-ish years. Since having counselling, I’ve given up hope that he’ll ever stand up for us against her volatile and unstable behaviour.

I can’t express how much I do not want her ‘being a granny’. How dare she think that she can lash out at us with her anger and silent treatment (days of it) when we were so small, neglect us or even abuse us emotionally and psychologically, lie about me to others, behave in such an intrusive and enmeshed way, and yet still expect a lovely cuddly ‘grandma’ relationship?

She’s hugely insecure about my relationship with MIL (who’s genuinely supportive and wants to support both DH and me as well as our new baby, whereas my mum seems to see the baby as a trophy or a toy and has no genuine interest in my wellbeing). She hates that MIL is only 10 minutes away, and has spread the idea within the family that I’m under MIL’s thumb and she is controlling me - actually, I decided to move here to be with DH and to put some healthy distance between me and my own parents. She doesn’t seem able to understand that I can and do make my own decisions - I’m an adult and have been for some time.

There’s so much more I could post (and have done in the past). This is already so long, I’m really sorry.

TLDR - how do I manage my mum’s expectations of what her involvement will be with my baby when she did such a poor job of raising us as a mother?

Thank you if you’ve got this far

You just described my mum.

In my mum’s example she had us genuinely too young and just wasn’t ready to be a mum and messed us up as a result. I forgave her for that but when I became pregnant with dc I didn’t want her to be gran (I wanted mil and dh’s stepmum only). So I started to go really low contact. Do not volunteer information to her, don’t tell her when scans are, don’t tell her the baby’s sex (if she asks change the subject or say you want it to be a surprise), be cagey about due dates and make sure dh, the hospital and your mw knows in advance not to let her visit you in hospital.

After DC were born it became easier as we just didn’t answer the door if she tried to visit outside of the visits we’d agreed. We’d pretend to not be in even if our cars were outside. It took a few months but eventually she did get the message. Look up grey rock it will give you some good ideas.

I think I have the strength to tell her this (especially post-birth when those protective instincts kick in even more?), but it will be messy. My dad genuinely expects me to put up with it - ‘leave the past in the past’, ‘it’s time to build bridges’ - but it’s always me who has to do the leaving or the building - they have never ever acknowledged or apologised for any of it.

no you'll be more vulnerable after birth - sort things now and pushing towards limited contact

so id let her know you'll not be having visitors for a couple of weeks after birth - any complaints say, move with the times mum and don't be sensitive keep using that phrase. Keep letting her know you'll not be having visitors and use the phrase things change mum this is how things are done now. If dad says anything tell him - mum is being sensitive, throw back the same things he has told you.

build your walls now and let them know they'll be peering over the top a lot not using the door

Why would you want to build a bridge when yo don't; want to actual travel to that destination. If your dad asks you to build a bridge just let him know you'll have a think about it, keep letting him know you'll have a think about it if he asks.

set up your boundaries now and make them aware

She will not change no matter how much you want it, I’m so sorry to say.
You owe her nothing. Keep your child away from the mind games or she will mess with your child’s head too.
The only solution is keeping her at a distance

Just remember you don't need to be frightened. That's your mind playing tricks because of years of abuse and manipulation. Keep telling yourself you are strong and deserve to be free. You're accidentally related due to dna. You owe them nothing.

You've had some great advice on this thread. I have similar issues with my mother so can relate to how hard it is to change your own mindset and build/maintain boundaries.
On the face of it, the letter idea seems a good one, although there is that risk of her using it as a stick to beat you with to other family. The thing is, what do your other family members actually think of your parents? Do they see through her? Do you have siblings? It's very probable that they realise that your mother is stirring things and lying. They may not challenge her on it, but they will probably realise.
I think that spelling out what is going to happen going forward needs to be done so that you know you've drawn that line and said/written your wishes. After that, let contact go through your DH. Let him inform them when the baby arrives. Let him reiterate to her at that point that she won't be visiting unless expressly invited. He can remind her that if she turns up uninvited then she won't be let in. Block her from your phone etc so that she can't get to you.

You can spend the rest of your life in therapy trying to find a way to deal with your mum, or you can accept that she is the one who needs therapy, and is never going to change.

You need to prioritise yourself and your baby. Cut her out of your life.

Do you really want your child to go through what you did? It’s time to cut the cord.

@howtomum123 You have posted about her before... I'm pretty sure I recognise all the history you mentioned.

If it is you, you were told ages ago to go no contact. You need to do this now.

Now, before the birth. After birth, you will be too vulnerable with hormones flooding your body.

You are going to have to rip off the plaster and go through the storm in order for this to finally stop.

And who gives a fuck what she tells other people? If they believe her narrative, then you don't want them in your life anyway.

If you don't do it now, you will be posting about this again in a year.

Wow is right! Absolutely @Gonegirl7 says it all.
You're very fortunate to have the full support of your DH and your MIL.

You'll need it to make certain that you have no contact, or at the most, very low contact with this disruptively damaging individual that is your mother.

You do not want this person in your new life with your DH and your DC, and most certainly keep your DC away from her as much as is possible.

You, with the support of your DH must lay down very firm and clear conditions regarding any visits to your home, for how long and how many.

You must be very firm and very clear and don't divert from your conditions for any reason whatsoever.

She is not your mother, she is a toxic person who has damaged you, and who you now have a duty to keep away from your DC, and yourself in future.

All the very best to you OP, may you be very happy with your new family.

If you wait topost birth you will really struggle to establish any boundaries whatsoever. Most us are blindsided by the shock, exhaustion and hormones flooding your system. Expect her to take full advantage.

Solid boundaries or go no contact.

I've got one of those...still not NC for various reasons.

I would absolutely go NC or VLC. If you don't, you'll find that her behaviour really ramps up once the baby arrives because there will be a lot more for her to get in a strop about. My mother is incredibly irritating - constant infuriatingly stupid questions and narrating every single thing she's doing/thinking (it's tediously dull in that brain of hers). Needless to say, my eldest son in particular would become annoyed and they'd argue, and she'd expect me to discipline him. I never did and I'd explain to her why I couldn't but obviously covert narcs/ emotionally immature mothers never take in any new information. They're just robots with 'read only' memories.

I don't know how much damage she did to myself and my family because there was a lot going on. She certainly made my divorce ten times ...she walked into my house once and said "Your dad just said 'Oh those poor children'!". I wish I'd figured it out at your age op. It took a relationship with someone actually quite dangerous to before I woke up.

You can't manage the expectations of a woman like this. They are unmanageable. The only thing you can do is bluntly remove them altogether and tell her straight what things will look like. You may for example decide you will take your baby to see her once a month for an hour (or whatever) or that you don't want in person contact at all but will send pictures. Whatever you decide, then tell her and tell her why. Can you do this with your Hs support? Because honestly if you don't take full control of this situation trying to manage her will be an ongoing nightmare. Better to rip the plaster off in one go.

I would absolutely get a new therapist also as you've been doing it 10 years and still not moved beyond the dynamic.

You also have to look at the role you play in this relationship. You phoned the police because she jokingly said she was going to take the baby from nursery - yet your still spending time with her.

You both contribute to this unhealthy relationship and I bet your dh is fed up to the back teeth of it

Why did you tell her you are pregnant ?

Never ignore your mothering instincts. You’re not weird, you’re not hormonal - your mothering instinct is telling you to keep your child safe from a bad person.

Blood doesn’t mean instant access to your child. End of.

You don’t need to worry. It’s all hot air. When baby gets here, she won’t actually come and see it. I’d put money on it. She’ll tell everyone she has this beautiful amazing grandchild, but she won’t make the effort to come and see you both. Because that would mean putting someone else first.

Right, OP. I'd be asking just how effective the therapist is being, based on what you've written.

I don't think you can manage their expectations; that would involve changing their personalities.

What you can do is manage your own, and how you behave.

You're going to have to make a decision that's part of your new normal, which is that you are the adult, you are the mother. They are minor players, you, baby and DH are the stars.

Your focus is now on raising a happy, healthy, well adjusted child. You didn't get training or demonstrations on how to do that, so you'll need to rely on those who did - your DH & his family.

Agree a game plan with your husband, and don't wait - start now. Get used to it.

Think up any possible future scenarios and your SOP - standard operating procedure - if they should happen.

'When she does/says this - we'll do/say this...'

Create and practice your statements ready for them, and for any flying monkeys they may be planning to wind up and release at you.

She has zero right to info about you, or your medical info, and zero right to access your child. Just don't tell her - or anyone else who may be feeding info to her - anything about your situation.

You've had a clear unhinged warning about what she might do - well done on involving police.

Ensure you have written instructions to midwife, nursery, school that she is not to be given info or access, no matter what she says, and cite her hijacking statement of intent, etc.

Time for tiger mama and her cub.

You poor thing, what an awful situation. I would definitely consider going low contact. Do not let her know when you are going into labour (she is likely to turn up at the hospital) and warn family and friends not to put anything on social media that you share with them regarding the baby.

When you have had a dominating parent, it is so difficult not to feel guilty, pressured by their behaviour. However, your needs and those of your baby now need to come first. All the very best to you.

I need to seriously manage her expectations

You don't. And can't. Concentrate on what you do and what you want. You can't change her.

Everything in my brain and body is screaming at me that I do not want her near us.

Listen to what you are telling yourself.

And if your therapist hasn't told you these things, get a new one.

Wow your mum sounds exactly like mine was. I don’t know how I would have navigated that relationship around my children had she not passed away. I was always adamant that my children would not be affected by my parents behaviour like I was. So I probably would have had to stay no contact or maintain very low contact.

Youve received some excellent advice here - protect you and the baby and your partner at all costs. Having a baby is a big deal physically and emotionally so the things you’ve been able to put up with and navigate up until now will become harder to deal with because you won’t have the headspace or time for it. Your mum is behaving like the child in the relationship, but you’re soon going to have an actual child who you will have to prioritise.

Sending all good wishes to you x

NC. I wouldn't bother with a letter as another poster suggested, with a normal person that might work but I suspect in your DMs case she'll just see it as further evidence of the cold, unfeeling daughter that you are, and flash it about to garner support.

I went NC with my DM. She was physically and emotionally abusive (perhaps not particularly so by the standard of the time), was critical of me constantly and has given me issues around food and self-confidence more generally. By the time my DD was born I had already started to realise that she would never change: she had no self-awareness and no ability to see that she might have been wrong.

She constantly makes personal comments about other family members and I realised that whilst I couldn't make the break for myself, I could absolutely do it for my DD.

Hopefully you can frame it like that for yourself OP. You are not a bad person for not wanting bad people in your life.

I want to recommend a book to you it’s called ‘you are NOT the problem’

by Kate mc Kenna and Helen Villiers

Please please read this book. You know, that you know that you know that what she did to you was so wrong and you don’t want that for your child. your body is telling you so listen to that. It will serve you well as a mother.

Please read that book and you will see how to deal with her without any questions. She is a narcissist.

OP there can come a time, even with the best therapist, where therapy becomes navel gazing. You've spent years looking inwards - going over your childhod and young adulthood, learning that the behaviour you experienced wasn't normal but was highly damaging.

Now it's tme to start looking outwards, to concentrate on the future rather than the past. Finding ways to let go and realising that you can do so without feeling any guilt. A PP has referred to the FOG - fear, obligation, guilt. It's what stops that final letting go. Explore that with your therapist or read up on it: How Emotional Manipulators Use FOG Tactics To Control You

You don't have to have either your mum or dad in your life. Your mum gave birth to you, your dad was the sperm donor. That's the extent of their 'parenthood'. So you owe them no further loyalty or involvement. Block them, don't see them. They've done nothing to earn the title of grandparents.

Let them go.

@howtomum123

I'm so sorry, your mother is a narcissist, your father an enabler. I banned my mother from the hospital, the nurses were wonderful. They've seen it all before.

I've been NC for 17 years. My brother's twenty odd years. So set up the firewalls now, if she still doesn't behave go NC.

She won't give up easily. My mother found out our new address, our new phone numbers. She had a friend at the hospital who blabbed about all my medical details. She writes letters now which my husband reads for me and bins, saying that I really don't need to know.

My parents divorced, then dad got sick, cancer, he refused treatment, just wanted to die. We organised his funeral all his family came. My mother found out three months later and went nuclear because he hadn't left anything to her his ex wife. My brother got everything because he'd cared for dad, I'd never forgiven him for enabling her.

Honestly @howtomum123 I'd cut them out if they continue to behave like this.

I too think NC is the best way forward. If you talk to her, she will see it as an invitation to convince you (read manipulate) you to do it her way. If you clearly draw a boundary: as in I feel overwhelmed by you, I think it’s best that we stay out of each other’s lives for now. And then do not respond, she will eventually have to either find another sibling to torment or will leave you alone (but prepare for badmouthing). Don’t expect her to change. People who hurt you can’t heal you. You’re now going to be a mom yourself, protect your baby at all costs (which you unavoidably will). You won’t need your mom, she needs you. She had 30 years of you, I think you’ve done your service now.