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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Please help me resolve a family dinner dilemma

136 replies

Dinnerdilemma · 02/11/2024 12:13

For a long time, DP and I have hosted my parents once a week for dinner. Over time, we’ve acquired a few extra regulars - elderly relatives and friends who are on their own (divorced or widowed). It’s usually a lovely get-together and something we all look forward to and enjoy.

We recently invited another (recently widowed) elderly man - not someone we know very well, but my mum was close to his wife, and one of our other regular guests is friends with him. He lives in our village. He’s always seemed quiet and unassuming, so we thought it would be nice to invite him where he’s now on his own.

Well, it turns out he has lots of strong opinions, many of which we just can’t get on board with. For example, sexist ideas about men’s and women’s roles, anti feminism, anti women progressing professionally. He has views on relationships that sound sympathetic to incel subculture.

When we tried to politely challenge some of his ideas - for example by telling him about a young, highly educated woman we know who competed with thousands of other applicants to secure a highly sought-after job - he dismissed our argument, saying well that’s all well and good, but it will come down to outcomes (as though to suggest she won’t deliver). DP works in a male-dominated industry and said to him some of the most competent, impressive people he’s worked with have been women. This man wasn’t having it.

And all this is being said in front of our young daughter, which I’m deeply uncomfortable with.

He tells us his views as though they’re fact and that we need to get on YouTube and watch this or that, as though to prove it. He’s said other things that have had us raising our eyebrows and which have left us, and others, feeling uncomfortable at our usually chilled-out and lovely meal. And he stays until really late afterwards, dominating the conversation!

Free speech = fine of course, but there are some (sexist/misogynistic/conspiracy theorist) views I don’t want aired in our home, around our family dinner table, in front of our daughter.

The problem now is that he knows it’s a regular weekly meal. He’s friends with one of our (lovely and much less opinionated) regulars (he and her husband were close) and last week he asked her if the meal was going ahead and she said yes, so he came again. He’s also recently widowed and lonely, so to tell him we don’t want him to come anymore would seem brutal.

Do we be direct and tell him it’s not going to work anymore (and say why)? Do we make some excuse up (e.g., more family are coming so there’s not enough room - which will actually be true come Christmas when our eldest and his girlfriend will be back from uni - and I know DS will not be able to shrug off his sexism/misogyny!)? DD has some activities ramping up this half-term so we could say we’re going to be too busy and pare back the dinners - but still quietly invite the original crowd. Or do we just put up with it out of kindness?

I’ve stopped looking forward to these once-lovely get-togethers. ☹️ Grateful for any help with navigating this.

OP posts:
mumsm · 03/11/2024 22:47

'I'm really sorry Earnest, but we think differently to you and our views about the world are completely different. Little Jane is getting confused about things as everything she is taught in school and by us is the opposite of your views so moving forward we don't feel getting together is beneficial for any of us. We get on well and wouldn't want our different opinions changing this'.

Own it. You are not in the wrong.
Having to have a 'break' from your usual meals is not dealing with the issue head on and he will expect to be back.

Your home your rules. You also need to tell your usual visitors he isn't to be invited - him asking a usual guest 'is the meal on' sounds like you're hosting a drop in.

Remember you are not saying you don't like him, you are saying you don't agree with his views in 2024.

Thelnebriati · 03/11/2024 23:06

You don't have to explain yourself. Just say 'dinners are invite only, not open house. We can't always accommodate everyone who wants to come'.
And tell the same to everyone you invite, so they don't start bringing more random people.

Thefsm · 04/11/2024 01:37

I wouldn’t stop inviting a lonely 😔 ld lan even if he was a total asshole like this. I’d have my husband take him aside and explain he doesn’t DBT welcome unless he keeps those views out of the conversation as you don’t want your daughter exposed to that kind of talk. That you agree to disagree but don’t want arguing at the family gatherings. Then if he tries you can shoot it down immediately “we agreed we wouldn’t discuss that” and if that doesn’t work then just say sorry but we asked you to stop and you didn’t so we won’t be able to have you back.

SashaPicklepops · 04/11/2024 04:30

Hmmm I'd find this difficult too, I think I would stop dinners for a few weeks for everyone, (got to go out, family illness, any excuse) and then when you start again just invite your select few, no hard feelings then. Good luck op.

Trainingfairy · 04/11/2024 12:11

Just be really clear with him; why should you stop your dinners for a few weeks because of this obnoxious dinosaur? The misogynist in him won't expect a confident and clear reason why he is being dis-invited. Be clear that although you were happy to welcome him to your home and your table, his sexist values and opinions are clearly unacceptable and, bearing in mind he was a guest, showed a lack of manners to you as a female who was happy to welcome him into your home. Your home, your rules.
You never know, he may be horrified, repentant and apologetic - but don't catch your breath. But he can consider himself persona non grata and no need for any awkwardness on your part.

fluffiphlox · 04/11/2024 12:15

Pause the dinners until the New Year, then do low-key invitations. If he asks where his invitation is, tell him (or get your Mum to tell him as she’s the one that got him invited in the first place) that his opinions are not conducive to a friendly evening.

Ivegotaboneinmyleg · 04/11/2024 13:32

Well, he is coming to your home and he is making people feel uncomfortable. I would be inclined to tell the group that, as the members are growing, it would maybe be a good idea to make a group "Essential Agreement". This would include things such as refraining from political talk and such collectively. He doesn't need to feel "picked on" - but, you know, the numbers are growing and you all need to "suddenly" convey agreeable things to create an agreement - rather than having this chap coming and causing upset all the while? It would be my action in your shoes. Good luck,! 🌸

gannett · 04/11/2024 13:50

Thefsm · 04/11/2024 01:37

I wouldn’t stop inviting a lonely 😔 ld lan even if he was a total asshole like this. I’d have my husband take him aside and explain he doesn’t DBT welcome unless he keeps those views out of the conversation as you don’t want your daughter exposed to that kind of talk. That you agree to disagree but don’t want arguing at the family gatherings. Then if he tries you can shoot it down immediately “we agreed we wouldn’t discuss that” and if that doesn’t work then just say sorry but we asked you to stop and you didn’t so we won’t be able to have you back.

Sorry why would you need to get your husband to do this?

I'd do it myself and I wouldn't be "politely challenging" or "taking him aside". I'm perfectly comfortable taking idiotic, regressive views apart myself. I'd tell him he was wrong, I'd tell him why he was wrong, I'd be up for the argument and I would win it. End result is that he either takes offence and doesn't come back (win!) or pipes down and holds his tongue (acceptable).

If that kind of confrontation doesn't hold any appeal you should at least have the backbone to be firm about the kind of views you will not have spoken in your house, and to tell him that directly. Again, he either flounces or pipes down.

category12 · 04/11/2024 16:08

gannett · 04/11/2024 13:50

Sorry why would you need to get your husband to do this?

I'd do it myself and I wouldn't be "politely challenging" or "taking him aside". I'm perfectly comfortable taking idiotic, regressive views apart myself. I'd tell him he was wrong, I'd tell him why he was wrong, I'd be up for the argument and I would win it. End result is that he either takes offence and doesn't come back (win!) or pipes down and holds his tongue (acceptable).

If that kind of confrontation doesn't hold any appeal you should at least have the backbone to be firm about the kind of views you will not have spoken in your house, and to tell him that directly. Again, he either flounces or pipes down.

She'd get her dh to do it because the guy wouldn't listen to a woman. 😂

I can't see the point of trying to change his behaviour. It's OP's house, she doesn't have to accommodate or rehabilitate obnoxious near-strangers.

pookie999 · 10/11/2024 08:26

Just tell him, your views are disgusting and I don't want you in my home or near my family. Don't worry about his feelings. He's made it clear he doesn't care about yours. There's being polite and there's being a limp lettuce

SerafinasGoose · 10/11/2024 15:51

pookie999 · 10/11/2024 08:26

Just tell him, your views are disgusting and I don't want you in my home or near my family. Don't worry about his feelings. He's made it clear he doesn't care about yours. There's being polite and there's being a limp lettuce

Even failing being quite so brutally honest as that - and part of me can't see why the hell OP shouldn't - it's entirely justifiable to point out that one invitation does not mean an invitation in perpetuity. I can't quite get my head around how it can be interpreted as such.

However, there are a great many rude CFs about.

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