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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Please help me resolve a family dinner dilemma

136 replies

Dinnerdilemma · 02/11/2024 12:13

For a long time, DP and I have hosted my parents once a week for dinner. Over time, we’ve acquired a few extra regulars - elderly relatives and friends who are on their own (divorced or widowed). It’s usually a lovely get-together and something we all look forward to and enjoy.

We recently invited another (recently widowed) elderly man - not someone we know very well, but my mum was close to his wife, and one of our other regular guests is friends with him. He lives in our village. He’s always seemed quiet and unassuming, so we thought it would be nice to invite him where he’s now on his own.

Well, it turns out he has lots of strong opinions, many of which we just can’t get on board with. For example, sexist ideas about men’s and women’s roles, anti feminism, anti women progressing professionally. He has views on relationships that sound sympathetic to incel subculture.

When we tried to politely challenge some of his ideas - for example by telling him about a young, highly educated woman we know who competed with thousands of other applicants to secure a highly sought-after job - he dismissed our argument, saying well that’s all well and good, but it will come down to outcomes (as though to suggest she won’t deliver). DP works in a male-dominated industry and said to him some of the most competent, impressive people he’s worked with have been women. This man wasn’t having it.

And all this is being said in front of our young daughter, which I’m deeply uncomfortable with.

He tells us his views as though they’re fact and that we need to get on YouTube and watch this or that, as though to prove it. He’s said other things that have had us raising our eyebrows and which have left us, and others, feeling uncomfortable at our usually chilled-out and lovely meal. And he stays until really late afterwards, dominating the conversation!

Free speech = fine of course, but there are some (sexist/misogynistic/conspiracy theorist) views I don’t want aired in our home, around our family dinner table, in front of our daughter.

The problem now is that he knows it’s a regular weekly meal. He’s friends with one of our (lovely and much less opinionated) regulars (he and her husband were close) and last week he asked her if the meal was going ahead and she said yes, so he came again. He’s also recently widowed and lonely, so to tell him we don’t want him to come anymore would seem brutal.

Do we be direct and tell him it’s not going to work anymore (and say why)? Do we make some excuse up (e.g., more family are coming so there’s not enough room - which will actually be true come Christmas when our eldest and his girlfriend will be back from uni - and I know DS will not be able to shrug off his sexism/misogyny!)? DD has some activities ramping up this half-term so we could say we’re going to be too busy and pare back the dinners - but still quietly invite the original crowd. Or do we just put up with it out of kindness?

I’ve stopped looking forward to these once-lovely get-togethers. ☹️ Grateful for any help with navigating this.

OP posts:
Farfarout · 02/11/2024 15:17

Sorry didn't read TFT

GivingitToGod · 02/11/2024 15:20

Hayley1256 · 02/11/2024 12:26

I would tell him if he wants to continue been invited then he needs to keep some of his opinions to himself. I wouldn't put up with this in my own home.

This. It cannot be that your previously enjoyable meals are something to dread.
He must be told

Tiedyesquad · 02/11/2024 15:22

Greyrocked · 02/11/2024 13:41

I would be brutally honest “I’m sorry we didn’t feel the views you expressed were ones we want our daughter exposed to. We wish you all the best”

That sort of person would hear that and go off into a rant about snowflakes.

Menatwork · 02/11/2024 15:24

"I’m hoping him coming will then peter out."

No, just no. You and your family sound absolutely lovely but please grow a backbone. He"s a misogynistic prick who clearly can't read the room. You really don't want your daughter to think this is okay.

Don't just hope he doesn't come, tell him he's not welcome because you won't have those unacceptable views expressed in your home.

Otherwise he's going to be too thick-skinned to get the hint.

Cantalever · 02/11/2024 15:33

I would be completely upfront with him and say, "Look, you have strong views that we do not agree with, and don't want expressed in front of our other guests or our DD, as it causes tension. So we want to continue as we were, with a friendly dinner occasion, and have decided its it best if you don't come to them". Then shut down further conversation - don't engage further. Tell the mutual friend that he is not coming any more.

SoNiceToComeHomeTo · 02/11/2024 15:34

He 'asked if the meal was going ahead' AARGHHHHH. You're not a restaurant.
I'd explain to the woman who is friends with him that his style of conversation is not suited to this gathering and that he's not invited in future; this should mean that he can't use her as a way in. Then just don't invite him. If he tries to invite himself you could say sorry we haven't got space for any more regular guests, though it was nice to have you there as a one - off - or two off, as it turned out.

Naddd · 02/11/2024 15:41

Why did he ask one of your regulars if the meal was going ahead and not you?
And why would your regular and him assume he was invited too?

goawaynottoday · 02/11/2024 15:42

Just tell him straight you don't like that kind of talk and won't accept it in your house. Either he will start behaving himself or stop turning up.

LBFseBrom · 02/11/2024 15:43

You have to be straightforward about boundaries (thank goodness he wasn't expressing racist opinions, that is not uncommon at the table with people you don't know that well). Tell him it's not appropriate to talk like that in front of children and also he must take on board the opinions of others and at least consider them, not just dismiss them.

My late husband had a racist uncle, you could not meet the man without his opinions coming out at every opportunity. He never came to us but we met him at family gatherings, He was a bigot - in other ways too. For example, his wife, who seemed lovely, had learned to drive and passed her test but he wouldn't let her drive, neither did she work. He had two sons, one of whom emigrated (don't blame him though he did visit and they visited him), the other lived miles away but they saw regularly. I will say he was lovely with his four grandchildren, not only being loving and playing with them when they were young but paid for everything for them so they had no student debt or the like. However I dread to think what conversations they witnessed in his company. Probably laughed at him, "Here he goes again", and such like.

We referred to him as an up-market Alf Garnett. He really was quite ignorant.

Don't include everyone in your regular meals, it shouldn't be expected. Speak to your parents about it but, if you can, have a word with the man, gently. He is far too fond of his own voice.

Cantalever · 02/11/2024 15:45

Farfarout · 02/11/2024 15:15

Just say it's all got a bit much to organise and that you'll be having a get together next year but will be seeing your family only for now. Then persuade one of the people who introduced him to hold it or meet in a pub so you can leave.

Why in the world should OP do that? He has pushed himself into their lovely friendly dinner occasions and spoiled them. Just tell him not to come back and why. No need to stop doing what you like in your own home to pussyfoot round this unpleasant chancer. I can't bellieve posts like this one.

OhDearMuriel · 02/11/2024 15:50

Why peter-out?

He's offensive and damaging to your DD.

What are you afraid of?

LocalHobo · 02/11/2024 15:53

I actually think it is unkind to not tell him why you no longer wish to host him. Posters saying his views are unpleasant? No, his views are wrong. If nobody challenges his misogyny then he will continue to be lonely, he needs to understand this.

SerafinasGoose · 02/11/2024 15:54

Nothing like inviting yourself!

rubyrubyrubyrubymurray · 02/11/2024 15:54

Personally I would wait until your DS is home and let him go to town on him. Short term pain for long term gain.

Gardenia777 · 02/11/2024 15:55

He’s being blunt and thick-skinned with you so I’d not worry about calling him out before he arrives, again, at your house uninvited.

Serriadh · 02/11/2024 15:56

Tiedyesquad · 02/11/2024 15:22

That sort of person would hear that and go off into a rant about snowflakes.

I’m sure he would! Just say “yes, it’s my personal “snowflake” opinion, but it’s also my personal house I invited you to and my personal money I pay for the food with and it’s my personal choice who I share those with.”

He sounds like the sort of person who’s more likely to pay attention to your husband, even if it has to be in a way “I don’t allow people who disrespect my wife and daughter in my house” sort of a way!

Floralnomad · 02/11/2024 15:56

Hayley1256 · 02/11/2024 12:26

I would tell him if he wants to continue been invited then he needs to keep some of his opinions to himself. I wouldn't put up with this in my own home.

This . It’s your home and your rules so he either comes along eats dinner and stops spouting rubbish or stays away . The fact that he’s newly widowed is not your problem and you are being way too kind .

Planesmistakenforstars · 02/11/2024 15:57

I realise you want to keep the peace, but this is a man who thinks you and the other women there are less than he is and don't deserve respect. He thinks your daughter is not worth as much as a boy/man. Tell him he is not welcome and tell him why. You don't owe your politeness and hospitality to someone who is happy to take advantage of those things, while spouting hateful views about you, your family members and other guests. Give your respect to the other women there, and to your daughter, by not entertaining views like this or someone who holds them.

mondaytosunday · 02/11/2024 15:58

I wouldn't stop your dinners. But tell his mutual friend that he is no longer welcome due to his views and it upsets the dynamic in case he asks her again.
While it shouldn't be a default assumption that he is to be included from now on, it seems you may have to tell him directly.

Rosscameasdoody · 02/11/2024 16:00

titchy · 02/11/2024 13:05

She didn't invite him second time though - he asked someone else if it was happening then rocked up! You definitely need to tell people that they are not to extend any invites to him - and that going forward it will be family and one or two people who are directly invited by you. It's not an open house.

Yep, this is the difficulty isn’t it ? I think there needs to be a pause in the get togethers for a couple of weeks and then a reset of who is invited, with the strict instructions that individual invitations are not to be extended to him.

diddl · 02/11/2024 16:05

SerafinasGoose · 02/11/2024 15:54

Nothing like inviting yourself!

Did he though?

He was invited the first time & it seems that invitations are ongoing once invited?

(Unless I have misunderstood?)

eqpi4t2hbsnktd · 02/11/2024 16:05

I would say this

"Free speech = fine of course, but there are some (sexist/misogynistic/conspiracy theorist) views I don’t want aired in our home, around our family dinner table, in front of our daughter."

So he either abides or knobs off.

PadstowGirl · 02/11/2024 16:10

We had similar with a widow in our street who we invited to Xmas dinner. Turned out she has horrendous racist and homophobic opinions and she shared them.
DH said "I didn't realise you are a homophobic racist".
She hasn't been invited back.

DogInATent · 02/11/2024 16:16

Do you like tomatoes? and have you see The Last Supper (1995)?

5128gap · 02/11/2024 16:31

The first one. I'd say "Bill, I'm sorry but I don't think it worked well when you came for dinner because you've obviously got some strong opinions and so have we, and it ended up being a bit awkward. The dinners are just meant to be light hearted and fun for everyone and all that talk about women from you changed the dynamic. We were a bit uncomfortable and offended' See how he responds and take it from there. If he apologises and says he'll keep off the topic you could give him a chance if you felt like it. (I wouldn't. But you're kinder than me!)

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