would you consider this a manipulation?

[nuitmiel]

My dp owns a house no mortgage, I inherited a place no mortgage. We live between our homes due to work arrangements. 10 years together not married. 16 years age gap (mid 40s early 60s). He has two adult dc, I am childfree. We were both previously married. I left my ex to be with him on a promise of a child together and a family I always wanted. He was post poning for so long I missed my opportunity to be a Mum. Now my dp came up with an idea of a home abroad with a business of a B&B attached. I told him he has so much money he can buy mortgage free abroad and yes we can run it together. He wants me to invest with him but I would have to sell my place which I do not want to do. We are not married and if something happened to him I would be left in a foreign country with a b&b business and his children on the doorstep wanting to sell it. I proposed he goes ahead with the plan but he can employ me as part of the b&b business and if something happens I continue working for his dc or his dc sell the business and I will live my life elsewhere. I do not want anything from him just to protect my assets. He says no. I consulted a solicitor who said it is a manipulation to ensure I have nothing of my own and he can control me. Even with will everything can be changed with me not being aware. It is not the first time that dp is trying to insist I put all my money into something with him knowing I will not benefit. I challenged him many times on not having a child together and not being married which leaves me vunerable considering age gap and each time he tries to bully me into submission saying I am being difficult and not wanting anything together and that I am affecting this relationship. Solicitor is absolutely adamant the pressure I am under is a red flag. Interested in your views on this.

Saddened to read your story OP.

You keep saying you're stupid for having been duped by him like this for so long... reality is you sound like a decent human being and so by default you have good opinions of people and believe them when they tell you things. You don't question that they're liars and manipulators, or even perhaps vile narcissists, because you judge people by your own standards, and you set your standards high.

And you clearly are not stupid as you yourself posted on here about being manipulated, even though it was your solicitor who planted that seed of doubt there for you, you still acted upon exploring it. Your good nature allowed you to continue to want to believe that the narrative reagrding him can be interpreted differently perhaps. But once you read all the advice on here, you started adding up all the pieces and you realised that he showed his true vile colours long ago. But because you paint life in bold colours they masked his to mere subtle undertones and they were disguised quite well, though hidden in plain sight for anyone who looked close enough. It's not your fault you chose to seek good in something bad, it's his fault for being bad in the first place, and deliberately so.

Please save your energy on untangling his cobwebs that he has kept you trapped in, and use that energy on yourself to finally be free. Yes you have to deal with your mum and the house situation, but at least you won't have to deal with being taken for granted by those who have taken you and your good nature for granted.

Remember, you're not stupid for being nice, let the ones who treated you with such contempt feel stupid because they didn't see it coming that you can walk away - smiling!

I agree with the solicitor it's another manipulation, he's already manipulated you many times before.
If I was you I'd walk away, if feel this man isn't who you should spend the rest of your life with and you will meet someone nicer.
He's already been happy to leave you childless knowing you wanted one and he didn't care, he isn't marrying you knowing you'd want to be married, my guess is he'd leave you homeless too if it came to what he wanted and leave you with nothing.
Please run for the hills and don't look back.

I think that solicitor is a keeper! Please keep yourself financially safe, OP.

@landris you are spot on with the subordinate, I alway felt that and when I watched his relationship with other women in his family (mother sister cousin) which I would describe as dimissive and unloving, I'd say he treats women as someone beneath. He loves correcting me and hates when the correction is actually wrong then he has to check and feels stupid. He uses phrases 'do you even know what it means' when refering to something in a hope he can show off. He really thinks I am an idiot, probably becasue he finds me easy to manupulate. Also important bit was the story of his ex wife. Everything was her fault. He also has a big problem with my education and belittles me just so that he can make himself feel good. I find it very much as a sign of his insecurity. Yes he has broken my heart. He doesnt know and he doesnt care.

@OurChristmasMiracle he has alwasy been talking about his pension, his pension is like a throphy so for me to use his own philosophy of how important pension is and say 'my money is my penision' was a wise move. He always spoke about pension in a way as if he was saying 'look at me look what you can have'. Odd realy because if you are not a wife you wont benefit. Same was with his house - look at my house, you can be part of this. Part of what - housekeeping programme? The relationship went really sour when I said I will not buy a house with him. He was asking me what will I do with my Mum's place when she is no longer here, what plans I have - I felt sick after that and I think he was asking to get an idea what to expect. My feeling is this is now about waiting until I am completely alone and when I am in dispair, vunerable he will feel I will be easy to manpulate. Yes, the property abroad is about him putting most of the money and me only what I have (and it really is not much) it would dilute in the money he puts in and if he puts majority I will have no say. Then if I ever wanted to take my chunk out it would cost in legal fees and I would never see the money again. NO!

I must say reading to your comments, thinking about it each day and then coming here and typing starts making me angry and resentful towards the situation. The more I observe this from your point of view the more I see the machiavellianism in all this. It is sickening.

As for leaving, I can not just leave, it all has to be gradual to manage his character. He thrives on conflict so he would enjoy the drama. Almost feels as if he should feel it was his decision.

My problem now is where to start. I need to earn more money.

I'm glad you are starting to find your anger OP. You have time to work out the best way to leave. You deserve so much better than this.

Your solicitor's advice is probably based on experience so worth listening to. I don't know if your partner is deliberately manipulating or not but he certainly doesn't respect your wishes or have your future wellbeing at heart. Keeping your assets separate is just common sense; when he dies he can leave his money as he wishes and you will still have your own house. So long as you stand firm about that, you have time to decide whether you want to be with him or not.

I’m glad you are listening to all the advice given here. It sounds like he wants to isolate you by moving to a different country and he’d control your life (and passport) from there.

You mentioned cancelling meeting up with your friend because of him, why does he get to dictate how you spend your free time? Likewise why do you feel you have to make the separation gradual? He’s a tricky character and loves conflict, that’s HIS problem, not yours. YOU do what YOU want, break up via text and block him. He can then argue with himself. You sound anxious about his reaction but that’s not your worry to take on. He’s a prize prick and self serving. He has no respect for you so please don’t cower to his moods.
Once you’re free of this miser you will be able to see things clearly and build up your confidence again and get the job you really want and meet your friends and not be treading on eggshells

He has taken your chances of you having a family of your own and now he wants to take from you the only property you own. He patronises and belittles you, making you feel you feel like you are not intelligent or do not understand things. He thinks he has the right to know what you will do with your mums place, none of his f**cking business. Even though you should be the one questioning him why didn't you ever start a family and lie to about it? If you pursue this relationship any longer you will end up with nothing. You are still relatively young, with a chance to start an amazing new life without this awful manipulator hanging around your neck. Get rid asap. You have smelt the coffee, you know what your gut is telling you. You felt it when he asked about your mum and now you're feeling it by posting on here. Inside you know you are thinking 'run!' The fact that you cannot just leave him and it would have to be gradual due to his character is just the icing on this horrible burnt out cake.

If you said tomorrow that you were done and moved out, what is it that you fear would happen? I mean this very literally - what are the specific actions he might take that you’re worried about?

As for leaving, I can not just leave, it all has to be gradual to manage his character. He thrives on conflict so he would enjoy the drama. Almost feels as if he should feel it was his decision.

But why does it have to be about him? Why can’t you just tell him you want time on your own and to go no contact? If he doesn’t like it so what?

You can just leave if it’s what you want. This is about your life and even though you’re seeing the reality, you’re still all about his needs, his wants. So fucking what if he enjoys drama. There doesn’t have to be be drama. Just call away and no longer indulge his games for your own sanity. Once you’ve cut ties then you start to rebuild your life

As for leaving, I can not just leave, it all has to be gradual to manage his character. He thrives on conflict so he would enjoy the drama. Almost feels as if he should feel it was his decision.

Again you're thinking about him and how he'll react, and trying to analyse it all. This isn't helping you. How he reacts isn't your problem. You CANNOT manage his character. You should be thinking of yourself.

The single most important thing is to get yourself away from him and start to live. There doesn't need to be drama if you tell him you're ending the relationship, and if he makes some you should ignore it. Please, don't string this out - make plans and financial arrangements, and get yourself away from this.

OP
if you cant just dump him, stand up to him
TELL him you are seeing your friend and he doesnt dictate who you see
TELL him you absolutely wont be buying a place abroad
if he asks about your mothers house again TELL him its none of his business.

Once YOU start dictating the rules of engagement he will back off.

However I’d still just dump him. Give him some home truths about him and his children and be doenvwith him

He has lied and lied and lied to you for over a decade. It's all about him. He wants you to care for him in his old age and you to have no financial independence so you have to stay with him.

You have surrendered so much already. Please don't think you have to conduct a slow retreat so he doesn't 'enjoy the drama.'
You leave ASAP. Whenever you go he will curate his own narrative so trying to time well is pointless.

Your solicitor sounds brilliant

Even when a relatively good relationship ends, it is hard to stop thinking 'we' and 'I need to make things bearable for him, not just for myself'. With a kind and respectful ending this is just part of the process , but it won't work for you now, because your partner doesn't not seem to take your needs or feelings into account. He'll probably hate you leaving and kick up a fuss, but when you need to go you need to go and there's nothing to be gained by trying to make it easier for him. Good luck.

As for leaving, I can not just leave, it all has to be gradual to manage his character. He thrives on conflict so he would enjoy the drama.

Pack your stuff up thats at his, walk out, block him and block any way he can contact you. Say nothing to him.

You are making it out to be about him and his drama. If you go and say nothing and dont answer, don't return calls there will be no drama. Put your fingers in your ears and say lalalalalala... ignore him.

Contact some old friends, make plans with them, do stuff with them. Feel excited you have a new life ahead!

thought I will post here again with a recent (on repeat) story - just to ilustrate how spot on and correct you were - one of you said here that you share your opinions (and all very similar) because you got the experience from your past of dealing with this type of behaviour or know someone who did. Topic of b&b came back over the weekend so I gently suggested that it is all well and good but those concepts require hiring staff to help at it. Dp said no problem he will hire staff to which I responded - but the other day you said you would not hire me as your staff - he says 'why should I? I want to you to be part of the business' and the conversation got heated. He jumped onto me how I should be also investing my money, I was telling him I have no money as my money is in pension. He then said no it is not, you have cash and you can invest. He then continued on why should he only invest, I shoudl as well. I told him becasue it is you who wants the b&b. I mean does he not hear himself what he is saying out loud?! I then said to him I have not got a private pension like you, so I have to secure my future. He then says it is ok I have not got pension. I said 'no it isnt'. And I continue - We are not married and we have not got children so investing makes no sense. He left the room.

He will not stop. This has been going on for years. Thankfully I see the manipulation and even more so now with your comments how destitute I could potentially have ended up.

What I did pick up though and I can see it works is the 'marriage card' - the moment I say 'we are not married' the topic ends. Ultimately because he thinks why should he marry me if he already has me as a free housekeeper and nurse. More for his kids, otherwise all be divided by 3 rather than 2. This is so awful. All so deliberate, premeditated, there is no love in it, not even friendship.

What annoys me is the bully tone, the demand, you must obey. He never uses phrases like 'I have been thinking... maybe we could, what do you think... is this something you would be willing to consider...'

I am actually upset, his attitude is insulting.

I mean to say to me that I am suppose to take pension money and invest in something I do not want, is insane!!!!

You know what is the worse in this story - there is no witness during these conversations to say 'excuse me but you are wrong, this lady needs security blanket'. He told me that he spoke to his mates and they think it is not normal I do not want to buy a house with him.
Erm ok.

Well done for standing your ground!!
And seeing through his manipulations.
I hope you can summon up the strength to leave him sooner rather than later. Good luck.

I would be going and living with mum for a bit and sorting things from there. The worst he can do is turn up at your door, and then you call the police. You need to not care about his attitude, it's not your problem anymore.
Leave now, you're wasting your life with this horrible man and you've already wasted enough.

Great that you’ve started to see the light but what are you going to do about it?

Why are you still there when you know who he is?

Yes it's great that you're starting to see his manipulation more clearly, but you will never change his attitude or behaviour towards you. Are you waiting for him to suddenly see the light and admit he's in the wrong? Never going to happen.
How much more of your life are you will to waste with him?

Ditch the boyfriend.
Marry the solicitor.
I’m only half joking.

Well done! So glad you can see him for what he is. Believe me that is absolute bollocks about his mates. A total lie just to gaslight you into thinking you are the wierd one. I know you said it would be gradual to break up but please don't waste any more time on him. Start living your life.

Read again what you wrote here. You are an only child and will inherit your mother's estate.

He's not just after your money, is he? Oooohhh no....

Please, for the love of God <insert other deity as applicable> you need to break up with this awful grasping man.

As soon as you have sold your house, committed to the B &B, your ability to leave the relationship simply, would be removed and in addition you are placing your capital at risk in what is a long term investment. How would you get your investment back, if you wanted to sell up?
Do you have any idea what it is like to run a B & B? Does he? Can't you just say, that's not how I want to live my life.

JUST SAY NO.

It really is that simple.