Who pays on dates?

[50andhopeless]

I am not from the UK. I am dating again at 50. If someone from OLD asks you out, who is expected to pay on the first date? On the following dates?

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/tiktok-first-dates-should-be-paid-5050_uk_61f7b6c6e4b094ce54acfacc

I'd always offer to split the bill. If they insist on paying then fine, however I'd rather split the first one and then maybe take it in turns.
I really dislike the dynamic of the man always paying, simply because he's the man. It makes me very uncomfortable and like the expectation is that I give something in return.

The point is that even though men out-earn women across society, that's not especially relevant when it comes to two individuals on a date. It's absolutely not guaranteed that any given man will be the higher earner or have more wealth than any given woman. It's a bit silly for a woman who earns double what the man sitting opposite her does to say he should pay for the date because other women earn less than other men.

There is little or no gender pay gap for full-time employees under 40. The pay gap is very small or even negative for full-time and part-time employees in their 20s or 30s. Among full-time employees aged 40 and over, the gap widens considerably since women are more likely than men to work part-time across all age groups and since part-time jobs tend to pay less per hour than full-time jobs.

One reason for the age differences in the gender pay gap is that factors affecting women’s employment and earnings opportunities become more evident when women are in their 30s and 40s. For example, time spent out of the labour market to care for children or elderly relatives could affect future earnings when a person returns to work. Direct
discrimination plays a part in women’s lower wages, particularly for older
women who entered the labour market on less equal terms to men and
who may face dual discrimination on the grounds of age and gender.
However, structural factors are the key cause of the gender pay gap.
These include occupational segregation; the part-time pay penalty;
women’s disproportionate responsibility for unpaid caring; and women’s
concentration in low-paid, highly feminised sector.

Source: Office for National Statistics, Annual Survey of Hours and Earnings – Gender pay gap data.

The idea of OLD is you date in volume ... many dates with many people.

Split your bills. Pay your way.

I would never expect a man I haven't met before and hardly know to buy me dinner. If I have agreed to the date, then I've agreed to split the bill.

Same! I'm very happily married but I had 2 years of lots of dates from OLD prior.
For me, he who asks pays.
The guys always did initiated contact and the asking so I let them pay.
If I didn't like them at all I insisted on paying; this happened on very few occasions. In fact one who's ego was bruised as a result kept trying to get another date even though he knew I wan't interested.

If I wasn't keen I'll offer but let them pay if they insisted.

My DH paid for all our dates. We're both old fashioned when it comes to dating etiquette and some other aspects too. We're very well suited to each other and enjoying a blissful marriage.

If I went on a date, I would expect the woman to pay half. If she didn't want to pay to half, that would say to me that she didn't really enjoy the date so I would be considerate and not bother her after that.

Except that many are saying they would insist on paying their way, especially if they didn't enjoy the date, so they wouldn't feel in any way beholden or feel obliged to have a reciprocal date where they did pay. So your assumption may not be correct, if she does let you pay.

I’ve been on quite literally over 100 dates where the man has paid and I have not once felt like there was an ‘expectation’ just because they paid. Most were gentlemen. Some I saw again, most I didn’t.

It depends on age, the type of guy and social circles and culture. I have never paid on a coffee date in OLD, it wouldn't even occur to me, most of the men I meet are high earners like me and the cost coffee and cake isn't even a factor or issue. If I am going on a second date then I usually offer to pay but if he accepted there wouldn't be another date. After that the men have offered to pay for dinners and I would pay for theatre tickets, make dinner at home.

I completely relate to this.

I think in high earning circles the idea that you would split the cost of coffee or a couple of drinks is unthinkable. Splitting the cost of dinner on a first date is practically unheard of too, IME, and if a guy did that there would be no second date.

I too only date high earning men, some of whom are quite obviously serial daters, and them paying is just the default. 🤷‍♀️

Well, I'm glad to hear that. I still don't like the dynamic of the man always paying. It somehow puts him in a position of power, even if he's a perfect gentleman. I like to feel equal, not someone who's being looked after.
If it works for you, though, that's good.

100% When a man asks me for a date and I agree, he'll suggest locations either near me or central. I choose. Then he suggests one or two places or just chooses one.

I've never asked a man on a date and I couldn't understand how if a man asks me out on a date I should pay. Of course if I can't stand him (after the experience) I will, but not for a normal friendly date with prospects.

In fact some men brought with them flowers, a box of chocolates, box of tiny cupcakes etc. I have already agreed to the date and given the pleasure of my company. He's usually thankful and doesn't think I owe him for asking me.
He desired to see me in flesh and I obliged. In fact in other parts of the world where I dated, the man will drive down to pick me up, take me to the venue and bring me back home. This also happened in the UK but only with men introduced to me by mutual friends, not those though OLD.

Of course I've watched movies and perhaps seen it discussed in some spaces that women always pay for their dates etc and perhaps there're men who expect it.

Thankfully, I didn't come across men like that even though I dated a lot for two years. I was dating to marry and wanted a gentleman who sought a lady; we both got what suits us.

Or a way to ask, without causing anyone to lose interest?

@YankeeDad

I would honestly treat finding out her opinion on that, as on any other question, as the purpose of your date. If you can't think of a way to find out her preferences, then what chance does the relationship really stand.

If you are genuinely interested in finding out her opinion on that and many other subjects, I'd expect that you increase your attractiveness. Obvs maybe start with simple questions and see how it goes.

Good luck fingering it out.

😱

Good luck fingering it out.

I dunno, if you can't figure out her preferences, you should definitely avoid intimacy. 😉

Exactly. What bear said, so much more simply and clearly than I managed.

The (politically uncorrect, but traditionally chivalrous) answer for a first date is that the woman should offer to go halves, but the man shouldn't let her and insist on paying. After that, I'd suggest that it can be taken in turns or split, but perhaps slightly in the favour of the lower earner.