men and sex

[endlessnonsense]

I have NC for this. I read a piece in the Irish Times yesterday (won't link to it as it is subscriber only), the gist of it was that the woman has spent years having regular sex with her husband because he wanted it, to "keep the peace etc", not because she particularly wanted it, although she wasn't saying it wasn't consented to. She didn't dislike sex, didn't feel violated etc, just pointed out that many times she just went along with the sex without particularly wanting it. She called it "consensual but unwanted" sex.

I know that this will of course resonate with millions of women throughout the world, and my point is not exactly the same one but linked. I am in my 60s, have been married for many years. I am starting to wonder whether all men are as "absolutely basic" about sex as my DH. Essentially, if we have had sex in the past few days, he is a lovely man, calls me endearments, is kind and friendly etc etc. If a week or more goes by without sex he starts to become more and more silent, gets short with me, and if it goes on a bit longer, becomes outright rude, such as just ignoring me when I talk to him, or being slightly disrespectful in front of other people. Have sex again and he's all sweetness and light.

I don't dislike sex at all, although like most people I don't always feel like it (and like many women I will often go along with it as long as I don't feel actively averse to it in the moment). It's not the going-along-with-sex per se that is bothering me the most. It is the complete simplistic obviousness of his behaviour, which makes me feel increasingly annoyed with him. Sex=nice man, no sex=rude man. Such a black and while situation. It seems so unsubtle, unnuanced, just really stupid to be honest. And he is not a stupid man.

Is it all men or just him?

I know what you mean.
I’ve been there too.

I just think it’s something we have to come to terms with if it’s a facet of one’s relationship.

I was glad when I got out of that particular aspect of coupledom.

It's all men who feel entitled to sex and it's a form of coercion.

Not all men, my dh is lovely to me whether we've had sex recently or not

My dh is not like this but I have a higher drive than him. I'm ashamed to say that when I have been a few days or am feeling particularly frustrated that I'm not intentionally rude, but am definitely less patient, more easily annoyed, easily distracted and just grumpy!
It's not ok, but I don't think it's always intentional or something that can be controlled I don't think.

I’m not surprised you are reflecting on this and feeling dismayed.

I know it’s a common thing and certainly does seem to suggest that their female partner is only any worth to them if they can penetrate and have sex with them. It’s the idea that women are interchangeable fuckable objects and not equal partners in a relationship.

Fortunately not all men have this mindset. And even if it’s too late for ourselves, we have to raise our daughters to know that this is characteristic of shit, basic men and to expect better.

@twinkletoesimnot If you're aware of it then you can control it, you just choose not to

Yes but how long do you go without sex? Days, weeks, months, years?

Mine does get a bit grumpy sometimes (weeks) but then when he really thinks he has an opportunity (relaxing day, no period) he gets all amorous... 😆I think it's kinda part of their (a sexual person's) existence... they seem to "need" it somehow to be happy... I'm not really into sex at all so sometimes do as OP is talking about. I mean it's nice when it happens but it's only something to do (amongst all the tonnes of other things I want to do/need doing) for me. I request a long massage so I get want I really want.

But I think it's awful yours gets grumpy and rude every time. I would show he has zero chance if he's going to be like that. It might be him trying to communicate, but badly. Can you substitute with cuddles? Maybe it's about getting attention?

People are humans, not robots

Yeah people are humans but if I know I'm in a bad mood, I can choose to snap at my husband or not. I can choose how I react, it's part of being able to regulate emotional response which should be normal for adults.

I don't think its OK to be moody because of a lack of sex, address the issue if it's an issue but don't sulk about it. We sometimes go a couple of weeks without, nobody gets moody.

I guess the only thing that stops me from being really annoyed with him about this is that I think the behaviour change is entirely unconscious.

I guess so. It just seems such a simplistic, non-complex way to live your life.

I think the male thing is the selfishness and sense of entitlement, not the sexual drive or feeling. Women have sexual needs too, but don't take it out on others as often.

Are you sure your DH is intelligent?

Not all men are like this when they don't get sex. It's nasty and entitled. It should be called out, always, especially if you think he doesn't know he's doing it! However it's a fact that (most) men want sex more frequently than (most) women. I think most women have at least some 'maintenance sex' just to please their partners. Totally consensual but take it or leave it sex.

The pressure to have sex (and what kind of sex) scares the crap out of me and is the number one reason why I don’t really even try to find a relationship.

It’s all so medieval, it’s crazy how some things don’t get better.

He is certainly intelligent in the strict "IQ" way. And he doesn't pressure me to have any particular "kind" of sex, as in I am up for all the kinds of sex he likes (a wide variety), and he is very good at it. But life sometimes gets in the way and I might have a period of feeling tired, or distracted, uninterested, anxious, whatever. And he will become increasingly cold and rude, in absolutely direct proportion to how long it has been since we last "did it".

It just annoys me that it is so bloody basic and predictable: ie
first few days after sex=calling me "love" and apparently enjoying my company above anything else, laughing and animated;
one week=rarely smiling, talking less;
ten days=ignoring me when I chat about general things and rather messaging people on his phone when I talk;
two weeks=ignoring everything I say except essential life arrangement stuff and sounding exasperated all the time;
three weeks=interrupting me in front of other people and failing to do things I ask for like picking up something from the shop.

It's almost comedic how predictable it is. It is getting my goat, after more than 20 years!

There would definitely be methods of controlling it but many just don't try them.

Have you brought this to his attention?

Yes, indirectly. He denies it. Which is why I think it is unconscious.

He's hardly going to admit it!

Yeah I dunno. This is interesting as I am woman and DH jokes that if we don’t have sex regularly then I get really cross with him. And actually yeah, if he refused me three weeks on the trot I would be entirely fucked off with him. But this has never happened in 20 years so I am just guessing.

being female socialised I would probably hide it better tho.

That could be correct, or he’s fully aware of it but has no intention of changing, possibly because he feels you ought to be punished and he may enjoy that, and possibly because he believes this treatment ultimately gets him what he wants

If a man treated me like that he would be and was, dumped. I won't tolerate moody, sex pestering bastards.

You’d be surprised- I’ve read many a thread where the woman has challenged her partner and they explain the universal fact that men like sex and women don’t 🙄 and it’s an irrepressible need for them (not for us) and therefore is an entitlement.

😂👏🏻👍🏻

I wasn't asking whether I should dump him. I won't. I was asking if other men behave in a similar manner.