Stingy restaurant behaviour has given me the ick

[HazelSchmazel]

This afternoon, I went on a second date with a guy I met on Tinder. Wasn't too sure after the first date, but I thought I'd give him the benefit of the doubt.

We had a nice meal and the bill was in the region of £50. When it was time to pay, I placed £30 (cash) in the middle of the table on the basis of £25 for my share and a £5 tip (our shares of food and drink were pretty much 50/50). He then proffered my £30 to the waiter, together with his credit card and said 'put £20 on my card'. So the poor waiting staff get no tip and my £5 effectively goes into his pocket!!! Uuuurgh - instant ick!

I should have said something, but I just wanted to get the fuck away from the knuckle dragger asap! Plus I was temporarily deaf from the thunderclap of my fanny slamming shut.

Now snuggled up with my cat, a bar of chocolate and am planning a Netflix binge, together with a future life of celibacy. Bliss!

Anyone else with a story of financially induced ick?

I highly recommend a cat. My cat may be an arse, who will demand and eat her dinner in front of me when I'm hungry, but she gives me loads of attention and is cute and cuddly, so I forgive her.

@AvidPearlPlayer It would have been a better look had you gone through my arguments point by point and analytically refuted them. I'm always happy to have an articulate and intelligent discussion.

Despite your assertion, I rather suspect that you are inclined towards being a coddler of cock.

'as women we are financially disadvantaged, in that on average we earn less than men. In addition we are subject to a beauty tax in that we spend a lot more than men on cosmetics, toiletries, clothes, treatments etc. (OK, so you could argue that's optional, but let's face it - we need to look a certain way in order to stay in the dating game). Then we have to spend a ton more time getting ready for a date'

And @AvidPearlPlayer , perhaps you could review my paragraph above and point out the statements that are factually incorrect? I will graciously concede to being a twat upon your accurate response.

It's not AvidPearlPlayer holding court on a chatboard having had a date with a disrespectful man who didn't pay his own bill, yet failed to say anything to him at all. Most other women wouldn't just take this shitty behaviour from a man or if they did, they'd give their own heads a wobble and know exactly where they went wrong, vowing never to do that again.

Calling posters 'cock codders' is puerile but, if that's your level then crack on.

I'll bite on this one as well.

Women aren't subject to a 'beauty tax'. We put ourselves in competition against other women to attract men who really aren't worthy of us. I keep hearing that we need nails and waxing and new outfits and, and, and... I think if you (general) need that much upkeep then that is something for you to work on.

What you didn't mention - and what is relevant - is that women are paid less so when it comes to having children it's important that any partner is supportive and can financially provide for his family. Finding men that are up to the job is important. Finding vacuous nitwits who are impressed with fake nails, hair, clothes and make-up isn't difficult. Settle for those at your peril and if that's what you choose then accept your lot because it's what you deserve.

Women do hold all the cards if we did but realise it. We give birth, we determine whom we will have sex with. Choosing partners who are worthy of this is priceless.

Thank you @LyingWitchInTheWardrobe

I may be purile and not quick thinking enough in the moment to challenge inappropriate dating behaviour, but we are broadly in agreement.

I appreciate the fact that you took the trouble to discuss and expand on my viewpoint, rather than just labeling me a twat a la @AvidPearlPlayer

My actual words were:

'I'm actually very much in two minds about who pays for the first few dates. I always offer to pay half'

I haven’t RTFT but I have two rules when it comes to dating:

1. If I have to plan a first date, there is no date. He needs to take charge and organise something.
2. If I have to pay for anything on a first date, there is no second date.

I have to admit, I also feel pretty strongly that the man has to at least properly plan the first date. I used to think this was terribly anti-feminist of me, but then I realised that on some unconscious level, it was actually a really good way for me to see if a man was actually going to step up, or, at the very least, had the ability to step up. When I consider the 5 million posts I've read on MN or the many many conversations I've had with women over the years about men who, once in a relationship and with a family can't even organise a simple dinner of fish and chips for their family ever again, I don't think it's that odd that this little "test" of - is he competent from day 1 is there.

I care less about who pays, but would feel very aggrieved if I was manipulated into paying.

What about someone who steals the fiver that @HazelSchmazel intended to go to the waiter, who was on NMW, @S0livagant? And who underpaid for his HALF of the bill at the same time? You are OK with that sort of behaviour?

POF first date .... he counted out TO THE PENNY half of his share (yes coppers ... the EXACT amount) while I was in the toilet! Ick and Block! (I intended going half but surely round up to the nearest £ ??

We used to always tip until restaurants started automatically adding service charges to the bill. Of course that is the tip automatically included and they don’t get another. Some restaurants where staff tell us they don’t get the service charge, we will delete it off the bill and tip cash.

But the worst lot are the restaurants that add on the service charge and then still leave space on the bill for a tip! NO, you have already taken it. Don’t take the piss!

I would also consider myself a twat if I used such aggressive and judgemental language and then acted surprised that other people reacted with the same and demanded they justify it or their opinion is invalid.

@AvidPearlPlayer Could you provide me with an example of my aggressive language please?

Would you have described my language as aggressive had I been male?

Perhaps you consider every woman who holds a differing opinion to yours to be aggressive

I'm almost as far from a cock coddler as it's possible to get but I disagree with all of this.

A guy going on a few dates in a week (because not all of them will end up with a second date) could be spending a fortune on two sets of meals. Just because men on average earn more doesn't mean individual guys would.

Also I'm sure some men do take trouble with their appearance. And the time you take to get ready shouldn't be costed. Just my opinion.

I think it's sensible for a first meet up to be a quick coffee and wouldn't consider that to be a proper date. I don't think that many people could afford to eat out several times a week, even if they were only paying their own share and not someone else's.

Your comment about time getting ready not being costed is an interesting one. It's getting off the subject I know, but as women, we are rather conditioned into thinking that our time has no value. We then get into situations where we are run ragged, shouldering a disproportionate amount of caring responsibility. Men on the other hand, see their non-working time as theirs and theirs alone and happily go swanning off doing their own thing.

@HazelSchmazel are you sure he didn't leave a £10 tip on the card machine?

I’ve really enjoyed reading this thread and offer the male perspective in that the bloke was clearly an arse and not worth your time. I’ve have generally always paid on a first date, been messed around a lot but I’ll keep plodding away and being generous, not going to let others change that behaviour

Yes - 99.99999% sure. There is usually a bit of faffing when it comes to leaving a tip via a card machine, but he just quickly tapped and that was that. All he said to the waiter was 'put £20 on my card' (or words to that effect)

Thanks @Daverl1980

You sound like one of the nice guys and sorry you have been messed around.

Thank you that means a lot, just one of those things in life 😀

Then it's probably worth letting him know that it's not acceptable and fully ick-worthy then block him. You are helping the next woman that has the misfortune seeing as we can't trip advisor review on crappy dates.