Propose myself or wait?

[HannahLouD]

Hello! :)

I'm (F 30) and I've been with my partner (M 35) for 4 years. It's our "anniversary" on 26th July and I'm seriously contemplating proposing to him (is that mad!?)

We have been living together, in a house that we bought together, for 2 years and we have an 8mo son together, as well as a 6yo daughter from a previous relationship of mine.

My partner was married before (separated when we met, and divorced for 3 years now). I've never been married. We spoke about marriage when we first started dating and we both said it was something we would like in the future, despite his past.
I have bought it up a couple of times since, but it's never got much further than him saying "maybe one day". I know obviously he has been through divorce and hurt before, and that he took 6/7 years to propose to his ex, but, I would really like to be engaged and eventually married to him.
I've always seen myself as being married and having a family and I know I am extremely lucky to have a family and to be living with my partner, but I would love the "whole package". Me and my daughter have one surname, and my partner and my son have a different surname - I'd love us to all have the same surname! (My daughter would like to take his if/when we did ever get married).

I know it probably sounds ridiculous, because we are in a stable, committed relationship, and perhaps I shouldn't want/need more, but, it's just something I have always wanted and I just don't think it's going to happen anytime soon if I don't propose myself. I am and have always been, the romantic/thoughtful one in the relationship and I genuinely wouldn't have a problem being the one to ask him. But, I know that's probably quite controversial! I also don't really know what he would say - I know he obviously wants to be with me, but I'm not sure if he would want to be the one to eventually ask... but when?!
I also understand 4 years isn't that long to be with someone, but literally everyone around me is engaged/married, including people who have been in relationships for much shorter amounts of time. Again, I know I shouldn't compare, but here we are, I am doing just that! haha.

Would you, as a woman, ever propose to your male partner? Or wait an indefinite amount of time for it to maybe one day happen? I don't want to keep on hinting to him that it's something I would like him to do, as I know if he wanted to do it, he would. But, is there really any harm in me being the one to ask him?

Thanks everyone! Honest (but not too cruel) opinions very much welcome :)

My daughter has my surname. My son has my partners surname... Which maybe wasn't the best idea. But here we are!
So if we were to get married, I'd like us all to have the same surname

I personally know a few women that have proposed, sadly they all ended badly. I was in similar position, I was with someone for three years we were older, in our 40s, and I felt he was the one. We discussed marriage, even looked at rings. But he never made the move and I started thinking I would do it, although it's nothing I would normally do. And something told me not to do it. After three years, if he hadn't proposed then I knew he didn't want to get married, at least not to me. A few months later found out he was cheating, so I'm glad I didn't.

Sorry to hear this :( and thanks for your input :)

Tell him your changing the babies surname to yours. Should have done that in first place when unmarried tbf.

this would be both an antagonistic move, given OP wants to spend the rest of her life with this man and also not actually possible, given presumably they registered the birth together, he has PR and would need to consent to the name change.

But yeah, great advice.

Oh no don't antagonise the poor guy heavens to betsy!!

Yeah, I tend not to go round antagonising my life partner, over an important joint decision made less than a year ago. But you do you.

It’s not permitted to change a child’s name without the consent of both parents or a court order.

So how was that good advice?

I'm all for women proposing BUT if he didn't say yes or give you a clear answer, that could set up a rift in your relationship...

I asked my DH to marry me, although it was really more of a two way conversation rather than a proposal.

Honestly, go for it. Sod the tradition and waiting for him. If you know it's what you want then talking about it with him is the sensible, grown up thing to do. There is no other subject where people would advise you to let him have all the control and do it on his terms.

Goodness me - I don’t get these responses saying women shouldn’t propose. I did a full romantic on-one-knee proposal to my now-husband. It felt really romantic, special and ten years on no regrets from either of us as far as I can tell!

I did 30 yrs ago. Still married.

I don't get it either.

All the poor insecure men who think proposals should be made by them and women should know their place.

If the men want marriage why don't they propose and if they drag their feet what is the harm in the women proposing?

Maybe I shouldn't have agreed to give our son his surname. But I did. And yes, we both signed the birth certificate so changing it isn't an option. Nor do I want it to be... Where would that get me in this? 😅

I think what you do is have a discussion about marriage. Ask him what he feels about it. Say you would like to be married. If he agrees, get married. If he doesn’t agree you have to decide if it’s a deal breaker. It’s quite simple.

Thank you, I did say in some previous posts I'll have a discussion this evening and update :)

Yeah, discussion is the way to go.

That's what I did. I raised the subject. I'm a woman. We've now been married for 11 years. Films have a lot of nonsense to answer for.

Men are biologically wired to hunt, women are biologically wired for safety and security. It's how we have been from day dot.

This is total nonsense and we have research available to show you're talking rubbish. Why are you spouting 19th century junk science?

Surprised by some of these comments. Ridiculous old fashioned traditions won’t change unless we change them! Go for it.

I would only propose if I was prepared to end the relationship if my proposal was rejected.
I would also only date someone if they knew marriage was what I expected from the start.
I don’t believe a woman has to wait for the man.
My now DH had apparently dated a woman for six years without any intention of marrying her. I wasn’t going to allow anyone to waste my youth and so I gave him an ultimatum after 8 months.
If he hadn’t proposed by the next leap year I was going to propose myself.
He proposed before that date.

Well if you do marry make sure to protect your daughters inheritance.

If you died and left it all to him through marriage he could disinherit your daughter and leave it all to his bio son.

Seen it happen.

Update for anyone who cares...

We had the conversation - I outright said to him - "Are we ever going to get married?, because it's something that I really want".
In short, his answer was "I don't know".

His reasons -

• we already have a child and house together - it's a lot harder to sell a house and sort out custody of a child than to get a divorce - what we have shows more commitment than marriage.
• he would much rather spend money on other things (to which I said I was more than happy to have a low key wedding that doesn't have to cost much - plus I know my parents would help out anyway).
• he personally doesn't feel that a ring, a peice of paper and a change of surname really changes anything in a relationship (apart from more financial security of course).
• he's done it all before and it wasn't all it panned out to be - he said it was just a lot of stress for one day and ultimately can cause arguments trying to arrange something that's not that important.
• he wouldn't want to do it if his heart wasn't in it. He said he'd do it to make me happy, but I'd then obviously always know it's not because he really wanted it, so for me, I obviously wouldn't want that. When he got married before it was because he was pressured into it. He doesn't want that again.
• he just doesn't really see the big deal or the point in it.
• plus a few more than I'm too tired/upset to remember and type out right now.

We have spoken briefly about marriage in the past throughout our relationship. But from the start, I seemed to be under the impression it was something he was open to/wanted again someday. Not that he doesn't know at all. I said how do you not know after 4 years, a house and a baby? He said it's nothing personal and he knows he wants to be with me forever and loves me very much. He said he wouldn't have got a house or had a child with me if he wasn't sure about us, he just doesn't know right now if he wants to get married again.

I gave all my reasons for wanting to get married (of which I realise now there are a lot!) but again, won't post them all. And now I honestly don't know how to feel. After reading everyone's comments and then having this conversation, I feel a little broken right now.
I don't really know what to do. I understand his reasonings, but, to think I may never be married to the man I want to spend the rest of my life with? That stings. And yes, you can obviously be in a long term, commited, "forever" relationship with someone and be perfectly happy and unmarried. But it's something I know I've always wanted when I found who I thought was the right person... I don't know how I feel about waiting an indefinite amount of time to either maybe one day be proposed to, or not.

I know people have said previously I shouldn't have got a house with my partner or had a baby with him before marriage. But I honestly thought it was something that was on the cards one day for definite and I didn't want to push anything too early on as I know his past and his hurt from that. But, here I am, stupid decisions later or not. And now I'm not sure what to do. Please don't be too unkind as I'm feeling pretty fragile right now. Just thought I'd update as a lot of people seem to have had some big opinions on the matter.

Thanks all - previous nice and not so nice comments all appreciated in one way or another!

OP, your daughter at 6 years old wants to change her name?
"My daughter would like to take his if/when we did ever get married"

We have spoken about surnames before as she has a different surname to her brother and was asking about it. She would like us all to have the same surname as she has mine and her brother has my partners and I was saying if we did get married I could change my surname to his and she said she wouldn't want to be the only one in the family with my "old" surname.
Irrelevant now after my update post.

I’m sorry OP.

None of his reasons are particularly good - except maybe he’s been burned before. And if it isn’t that big a deal and is just a piece of paper to him, but one that is important to you, why not just do it?

Letting you give the baby his name when he has no intention of marrying you was mean. Especially as your DS now has a different name to you and his sister.

Take some time to think it over OP. I would be quite withdrawn for a few days I think as I would processing what all this means. Maybe even take some days away with DC if you can? Take some financial advice next week and think about making a will and ensuring your daughter is protected. Maybe if he sees you doing these practical things and that he has potentially harmed the relationship he will in time change his mind.

Men are notorious for chasing if they think they have lost you/are losing you. Maybe he’s had it too easy for a while? Do you do his life admin for him? This would make me reconsider all sorts of things I have to say and maybe would bring the worst out in me. Things like ‘oh you missed sending x a birthday card because I didn’t remind you?’ ‘Oh well no big deal, it’s just a missing piece of paper’ etc.

Probably don’t listen to me.

I hope you manage to do some nice things with DC this weekend.

💐💐

I’m sorry OP. I’m also angry for you. None of his reasons are anything other than standard bullshit that people who don’t want to get married come out with and none address the protections that marriage gives you and the DC. He also seems to have a very different viewpoint now than he had when you had the discussions previously. That must surely damage the trust between you.

If he had suggested a civil partnership or putting in place all the protections that marriage gives (which would cost more than actually getting married) I’d feel differently. But right now I just see him as another bloke who is more interested in protecting his assets than having a secure family.

I would make plans moving forward accordingly. You’ve already lost a lot of opportunity to drive your career by having a baby with him. I’d expect your career to take priority over his for a while now and for him to make sacrifices to support that.

Wishing you all the best