DH’s conversational style

[HebburnPokemon]

Whenever I have a conversation (big or small) with DH, he does something that upsets me every time. I’m autistic so I could be totally overreacting here, but no one else seems to do it to this degree.

When I make a point, he will reply to my point with a different perspective, even if it is not a perspective he holds personally. What is this called? I feel my comments are never accepted on face value, and it makes me feel sad and tired because it’s multiple times a day.

He says it’s how normal people have conversations.

Willing to accept I’m out of order here.

@HebburnPokemon Just end the relationship. Don’t allow this to be your life. Good luck.

As an example, if I've already considered what's in the fridge/ cupboard, how much time we have and run through a number of possible meal choices and the pros and cons of each and then ask OH what's for dinner... if he says 'how about X'... I'm likely to point out what we have that needs using up that would be a better (in my opinion!) choice or explain why X will take too long and why Y could be better...

In this scenario, having given it all the thought - and presuming your DH hasn’t given it as much - then why are you asking him what’s for dinner rather than suggesting X or Y? I’d find that hugely annoying! (Sorry, I know it’s just an example picked at random but dinner conversations like this are a big bugbear of mine!)

Thanks for the link.

"Dry drunks tend to be very negative in their thoughts and attitude."

"Dry drunks often react defensively to criticism or suggestions that they may need to change."

"They may have difficulty expressing emotions in a healthy way, and may resort to passive-aggressive behavior instead."

"Dry drunks may be prone to sudden shifts in mood, from a high to a low, or vice versa."

Oh boy. Should I be attending al-anon meetings 😐

However...

"A ‘dry drunk’ or ‘dry drunk syndrome’ is someone who has stopped drinking alcohol, but still behaves in the same way they did whilst they were drinking."

He was actually a 'nicer' person when he was on alcohol. Chilled. Humorous. Light-hearted. Open-minded.

My theory is that alcohol masked his ADHD, meeting his need for dopamine. Without it, he is dysregulated. His father is the same - needs alcohol to function and cope with life.

You say that you're "training " yourself to not speak, so it doesn't matter how he excuses his behaviour, it's having a very bad effect on you. The fact he's trying to minimise it and fob you off like this has my alarm bells going! It makes me think he dpesn't care how it makes you feel, which should be his first priority. It's as if he's telling you that this is the way it's going to be, he has no intention of considering your feelings and you can like it or lump it!
You don't like it, and you actually don't have to lump it either- you can choose to not have it in your life anymore by choosing to not have him in your life! You would be surprised at how liberating it would be, maybe not straight away but in time, and how lovely it feels to be able to speak freely without having Clever Dick tell you you're wrong every time!

I think some men can't bear to agree with an idea if someone else said it. For example, when my husband agrees with me, he always qualifies it with 'maybe' or 'to a certain degree' and then when challenged, it turns out he agrees fully. Deborah Tannen's book 'You Just don't Understand' has some interesting things to say about how male conversational style works on a principle of contest, whereas for women it's building community.

he is a liar who tricked you about who he is.

I sensed alcohol issues early on but he said he wasn't an alcoholic. I'm not sure he realised back then that he was one. I recall him drinking over the recommended level for driving and I was concerned. But he said he was sensitised to that amount.

He is emotionally abusing you

If he read those words, he would KICK OFF. He doesn't view himself that way. If anything, he views me as oversensitive. I get the impression he thinks my standards are too high and I expect too much of him. Part of me wants to believe that - at least I could change myself.

If the problem is him, I have zero power to improve things.

You say that you're "training " yourself to not speak

Yes, for example, I'll have the idea of sharing a meme or news article with him, but recently a voice in my head would say "do you really have the energy to fight/defend your view?" and I back down. I don't act freely anymore.

The fact he's trying to minimise it and fob you off like this has my alarm bells going!

There's a chance he genuinely sees the situation as wholly a "me" problem.

I think what I will do is focus on building my wellbeing. He has his ADHD assessment next week and may get meds and therapy from that which may improve the situation.

For the next few months, I will focus on myself. I need to learn to drive. I need to make friends - build connections, feel heard, feel worthwhile. I need a life outside of my marriage. I think it will improve my mental health. That is where I'm going to direct my energy.

Then I will reassess the situation in a few months once he gotten to grips with his diagnosis and treatment.

Sorry no that’s not how it works (my dh is ND too)

It doesn’t matter if the INTENT isn’t to hurt or belittle you. What matters is the impact on you.
Id the way he behaves, regardless of whether it’s voluntarily hurtful or not, is hurtful to you. You do not have to accept it.

There is a balance to find between accepting one’s limitations and bending yourself backwards so much that you accept to either be hurt or to fade into the background (which is what is happening atm)
Your needs should be valued in the relationhsip too. You should be able to order what you want to order in a restaurant Wo him telling you are doing it wrong. Again.

There's a chance he genuinely sees the situation as wholly a "me" problem.

yep some people think like that. Much easier to assume it’s everyone else fault….
He also has the ‘excuse’ of you being autistic and therefore assuming ‘you dint know how to have a conversation’ aka full on ableism, even if unconscious.

Im impressed by your reaction though. Concentrating on yourself first and re evaluating in a few months sound a good way to tackle the issue.
Juts don’t let him believe that, if he is indeed ADHD, then it’s a door wide open to excuse any behaviour of his as something you should accept.

I'd hate this. Constantly unseated in any situation.

I understand.

There's aspects on my autism (messy, zero independence, forgetful) that he has learned to live with, and no longer judges me for. It's hard for me to be intolerant of his traits. But the loneliness is crippling.

Shall I encourage him to make a MN account so he can 'defend' himself here? I'm sure he will persuade you all that I'm actually the problem 😅

My boss does this sometimes, you'll leave a conversation exhausted from the "debate" and he will be energised and say "good conversation" or say I'm not that bothered - well why were you arguing then?!

So now you need to start focussing on how it makes YOU feel, think and act rather than how he sees it. It seems to me he would never acknowledge that his behaviour is unreasonable and so if you stay with him, he'll just carry on, and if you speak up, dismiss and undermine you , and if you just give up and stop being your true self for the sake of peace and quiet, you'd loose your sense of self, which in a way is an unwitting betrayal of self. Please don't let him, or anyone, do that to you! What he's doing seems to be apower-play, to subjugate and dominate you i.e. he's abusing you emotionally. Regardless of ASD or not, he knows it makes you feel bad but doesn't care, because it gets him what he wants-power over you! As Dr. George Simon says , it's pointless trying to explain to them how their behaviour hurts you, because they know it does and don't care. It's pointless trying to teach them right from wrong because it's not that they don't see, it's that they don't agree. If you stay with him, he's going to wear you out and drain you of liveliness , which is abuse!
Please check out the Freedom Programme, or even speak to Women's Aid, because the more you tell us, the more abusive he sounds and you need to get yourself and your children away from him. They'll help you. Keep posting here too, many of us are survivors of all sorts of abuse from men who purported to love us and we've learnt some painful but valuable lessons! Sending you a hug!

He accuses you of being "over sensitive" to his behaviour?
Straight out of the handbook of Abusive Men.
You are training yourself to change to avoid his abuse.
Awful for you.
Awful for your children.

Good for Uncle.
This is bloody annoying.
I might have Asperger's, or not.
Too old to research this crap for myself.

It just might be that your needs are simply incompatible.
Even if you tried. Even if he tried and is able to cope/deal with some of your traits.

Its not because he is coping with/accepting some of your traits (if that’s what you mean with not judging anymore) than you have to accept/cope with all of his.

Antagonistic

It's called "being an asshole".

This would wear me out. I'd be tempted to stop talking to him altogether.

Is that what he wants? To effectively subject you to put downs so often that you are silenced?

I think you need to bring this up in marriage counseling.

After he said, "You shouldn't always eat the same thing," you should have said, "I don't remember asking for your opinion."

Never try to persuade him or cajole him into agreeing with your choice or your decisions or your stated opinions. If you break this habit of yours, you will stop handing yourself to this heckler on a plate. Remember - you do not need to justify any opinion or choice you make.

If he offers an opinion in any other situation, simply stare at him coldly. You could also give some kind of a sniff, and say, "Uh-huh," in a bored tone. Or go with, "Whatever.."

He's doing it because deep down he feels he is superior.

Yes to this.

OP, forget the possible ADHD diagnosis.

You are shackled to a mansplainer who holds a core belief in his own superiority and your inferiority. He needs to keep you feeling stupid in order to feel good about himself.

This is not an ADHD trait. It's a trait of a misogynistic twat.

Isnt that normal conversation?

That isn't playing Devil's Advocate

That's being a dick

You're an adult. Eat what you want.

No, please don't.

Keep this thread and Mumsnet for yourself, he'll only tell you we're a bitter bunch of vipers etc etc.

And you might find it handy to come back and better MN's not a bone of contention between you (although seems like everything is!)