Friend always late

[TaraMoon]

I have a friend who I often meet for a dog walk. We live fairly close to each other and tend to meet at a certain spot.
So, for example, we’ll agree to meet at 4pm at the park gate and so often she’ll turn up at 4.10. Not always but mostly. I think it’s getting worse … and I’d just love to know what goes on in the mind of someone who does this? Is it about control, is it disrespect, is it just sheer disorganisation?
She’s a lovely person in every other way but this is so rude and inconsiderate (to my mind), I just don’t understand why she thinks it’s ok to make me stand somewhere for 10 mins.
Yes, I could do this too but somehow I can’t bear to play the same game.
I’m not a confrontational person but last time I said ‘I see you like to keep me waiting’ quite sharply. She looked surprised but didn’t comment.
We’re meeting again this afternoon and already I feel irritated at the thought of her thinking her time is more important than mine!
Are you habitually late meeting people, and if so, do you think it’s fine? Why do you do it?!

Being on time varies ...

Five to ten minutes late is on time for dinner at a friends place.
Five minutes early to five minutes late is on time at a restaurant.
Five minutes early is on time for work, a hair cut, church, catching a lift, a meeting.
Ten minutes early is on time to catch a train, go to cinema.
Fifteen to twenty minutes early is on time for a funeral, a wedding, meeting for a musical or ballet, getting to school or arriving for a baby sitting job.
Three minutes early is on time for a doctor's appointment, picking up child from sport practise or school.
Up to tive minutes late is fine for meeting to have a cup of tea, go shopping or a play date.
Right on time is perfect for meeting a friend for a regular jog or dog walk.
Up to half an hour late is fine if arriving to stay at someone's house, to have Christmas Dinner or visit for many hours.
It is also fine to be up to half an hour late home without letting spouse know that you will be late.

@user1492757084 100% agree and thinking about this shows consideration for others.

Ive decided im only going to meet my friend in group events now, after yet again on sunday she was half an hour late. I was sat in a cafe drinking coffee on my lonesome.
She does it every single time we meet. She will be at least 30 mins to an hour late.

Is always try my very very hardest to be on time yet im very often late or just on time. I always apologise. The cause is I haven’t got a good ability to estimate how long things take. My husband now says ‘if you think it’ll take you ten mins double it’ etc to help. I’ve been told (by a psychologist/expert) it’s because I see time in a ‘tunnel’ sense where people who can plan better see time in a more ‘left to right’ linear sense. It’s often a trait of creative people who live ‘in the moment’ try not to judge her, I would just turn up at 415 instead she’ll be there!

Woah I wasn’t even aware of these rules, I must have missed that lesson in life!

Well, seeing as you asked….
it doesn’t wind me up but it does make me feel much more comfortable being around people who aren’t so uptight about their ‘precious’ time that me arriving desperately flustered and apologetic for being not on time that I get an icy cold shoulder.
it’s not just friends I’m late for - I’m late for important appointments, I only just catch trains…I have tried every trick in the book like telling myself the appointment is 30’mins earlier than it is….im still late!
I am actually pleased if someone else is late it makes me feel a bit better…
It annoys me when people arrive early for parties or an invite for food and I’m not ready.::
my friends know what im
like they know I try my best and they’re very understanding

Goodness, that’s quite a list. And do you realise you come across as a little neurotic / superior just by plotting out all these adjectives! Though I’m sure you’re not…

Anyway, I really don’t think I’m any of these things. As I said, just interested in the psychology of someone who is late again and again (not give and take… )

And as I say, late in many scenarios is absolutely fine. I prefer people being a little late when visiting my home as I’m often still hoovering at the last minute… Not anal, happy to make last-minute plans, love spontaneity, not boring (I don’t think)… BUT not a fan of hanging around on street corners for no good reason (repeatedly).

Gets tiring when they always late. My friend is very disorganised with time keeping. She has got better. Its the waiting around bit.

@TaraMoon

@Princessfluffy asked what annoyed me about people that are fixated upon punctuality to an extreme extent. I gave my response.

You made your point to your friend about what was annoying you and they were then punctual.

A less egocentric response would have been to say, I’ve noticed you’ve been late a lot recently, is everything ok, or would it suit to meet at a different time or at yours so we can walk together

Less confrontational to occupy yourself for the 5-10 minutes while they are occasionally behind as it is only a short amount of time.

Lots of ways to handle it. You were snappy and got your point across. But you have no idea what is going on with your friend, which doesn’t seem that friendly.

I agree with this. I don't want to be unkind to the OP though. But I wouldn't think anything of a friend being ten minutes late, I don't think I'd even think of them as being 'late'. If I were ten minutes late and someone said to me 'I see you like to keep me waiting!' it would put me off the friendship to be honest - it comes across as catty and I would think that they were being a bit malicious and paranoid, why say it like that? It seems a bit like there is something more going on. A kind way to approach it (if it really needs addressing) would be to say that you're someone who gets cold really easily and would she prefer to meet at 4.15 next time instead? I would honestly think a friend was having some difficulties in their own life or was acting something out on me if they said 'I see you like to keep me waiting' when I was ten minutes late. Sorry to be blunt OP.

@SensationalSusie
Well, we talk about all sorts of things on our walks so not sure why you assume I have no idea what's going on in her life!

She makes many excuses for her lateness from emails to kids to the cat to whatever... I feel like it's become a habit.

And in all the years I've known her, I don't think I've ever been snippy (till my little outburst)... so she's done pretty well, really (considering!)

In terms of how other people see these things, my experience is that people who are upset about being ten minutes late tend to not be able to emotionally self regulate very well and that can make them stressful to be close to. I know that sounds very damming. But I actively avoid being close to people who are like that - the reality is that life changes, there's a traffic jam, someone gets sick, a place closes when you didn't expect it etc - if you're around someone who needs things to go to a very precise pre planned timetable in order to feel ok it is very unlikely to be relaxing or comfortable to spend much time with them. I know people who are like this, i.e. overly rigid, and it's difficult to make any serious plans with them and I often wonder how their SOs and close family members feel day to day about being monitored down to the minute and the extreme emotional reaction when life's usual ups and downs occur and plans go awry. What you want is some balance and tolerance. Of course you may not be like this at all OP. But honestly I'd feel so happy that I had a friend who wanted to go dog walking with me that ten minutes wouldn't cross my mind as an issue! I would love to have that company.

I actually agree with you… I’m not talking about getting uptight about the stuff that happens to everyone. I’m talking about the lateness that seems like a conscious decision, because it’s habitual. Just interested really, that was why I first posted.

And I know I’m lucky to have a good friend to walk with and she knows I appreciate her. The last line of your post made me feel sad… Hope you’re ok.

@TaraMoon

You don’t know what the underlying issue is relative to lateness, because by dealing with it in the way you did you cut off conversation relative to it.

If you live nearby meet at her house and wait inside in the warm until she is ready, or get her to walk to yours. You don’t need to stand in the cold or create tension. Find a way around it.

The psychology for most people is that 5-10 minutes is not a big deal for close friends and sometimes life happens and it can be difficult to remain timely.

For some there are health issues - adhd, pain, stress, fatigue, beginning of dementia or asphasia and so on.

Relative to it being a conscious decision….. I don’t think for anyone it is. But sometimes there are circumstances or things going on that can make it more difficult.

I know someone who is just always late. He is renowned for it and people have always cut him slack. There was a really important family event and his aunt pleaded with him to please not be late and he promised he wouldn’t. Then ‘there was traffic’ and he was late. He had issues with control -ie hates to feel other people are controlling him. Had been sacked from every job for that reason. So it is clear (to me) that his lateness is a power issue, very deep rooted. I just don’t bother meeting him any more.

So the onus is only on one party to make changes and allowances? The person who is being kept waiting should be running around to make things easier for the person who won't turn up on time continously?

Surely the only way of always being on time is to arrive early every time? What do you do when public transport is delayed or there's a car crash and the traffic backs up? How early do you plan to get there in order that you're never late? Do you aim to arrive 15 minutes early in case of hold-ups? What happens if it's a major delay? Is there a point where concern about punctuality becomes unhealthy?

This

@Abeona Obviously if something completely out of the ordinary happens then yes I will be late and I would always message to say this. I live rurally though and rarely use public transport so it is actually very rare that something crops up.

I always leave a few minutes extra to park or if it’s my first time visiting somewhere. If I’m early I’m always happy to spend 5 / 10 minutes catching up on emails etc in my car.

But this is not the issue. We both walk to the meeting point, it takes X amount of time and always will do…
I’m not talking about situations where there are traffic jams, diversions, acts of God… For those meet-ups, I allow the expected amount of journey time, maybe a little extra, and if I’m late then so be it. I’d message to warn the person though, if possible.

@DoreenonTill8

I’m proactive, if someone hadn’t turned up for me there would have been a text msg sent

”Hey, have you left? I’m totally freezing and dog’s going mental. Walking over to yours now”

If she's fairly consistently 10 mins late, agree an "official" meeting time 10 mins earlier than you wish. So, for 4.00pm, suggest a meet time of 3.50pm. Then you'll both show up at 4. Problem solved.

If she's always late, why don't you aim to also be there 5 or 10 minutes late as well?
You won't be standing about then. Some people struggle with time blindness, it's not intentional and this is for walking a dog not for something you need a specific time slot for 🤷‍♀️

Some people actually struggle badly with managing time, I do no matter how bad I try. My friend is like this, she is so lovely in every other way I can’t get annoyed over 10 mins, we all have our imperfections